Who do you think determines what is within the scope of Scouting?

[BadenP]

Bob, from the first line of your first post on this thread and the second line of my post we seem to be in agreement with the topic of this thread, hmmmmmm. To clarify for Eamonn the council only intervenes if there is a disagreement or a flagrant violation of scouting policies, otherwise the unit scouters makes the call.

[Gold Winger]

"Now the logical question arises that if the Lone Scout is camping alone, why would he wear a Boy Scout uniform, who is going to see it?"

 

Why wouldn't he wear his uniform? According to BSA, the uniform is the perfect clothing for outdoor activities.

 

You're still avoiding the question, Bob.

 

[Bob White]

Actually BadenP you say the council's role is to translate national executive board decisions, I said the Council's role is to enforce them. Hardly the same.

 

Then there is the matter of your off-handed comment regarding my experience in scouting that has not been addressed (or edited by a well meaning moderator). I believe that either and apology is due me or better yet you can share exactly what facts you know of my scouting experience that lead you to make such an inaccurate remark, based of course on your almost 5 years of experience as a DE.

[BadenP]

First of all Bob that is not what I said, READ IT AGAIN!, "the council professionals are the local representatives of National."

 

Secondly, I do not know what comment you are referring to? By the way I never received any pm from you.

[Bob White]

Yes, the council executive represents national in many ways, but their role is to enforce the national policies not translate them as you said. And while the SE can set some policies for the council he cannot chage national policies. As some councils like the Cradle of Liberty council discovered when they tried to alter the BSA membership policies.

 

You might check your personal settings, a PM was sent to you earlier today at whatever e-mail address you have placed in your settings on this forum.

 

I anxiously await your response.

 

Goldwinger writes

"Why wouldn't he wear his uniform? According to BSA, the uniform is the perfect clothing for outdoor activities."

 

I have to ask...when was the last time you read a Boy Scout Handbook? It hasn't said that for several years.

 

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Gold Winger]

Well Bob, the last handbook said that the uniform was for field use. It is the same uniform as is worn today. Does that mean that the older uniform was better than the ones made today? Does it mean that BSA realized that the currnet uniform is a pile pretty felgecarb? Come on . . . we really want to know!

 

 

 

 

[FScouter]

It appears the secondary objective of the participants in this topic is to share wisdom, gain perspective, and learn from others.

 

The primary objective appears to be to beat each other up. Thats not a purpose of the forums.

[BadenP]

Well Bob your interpretation of the responsibilities of professional scouters in a council is just plain wrong. You have never been to professional scouting executive training so it doesn't surprise me you would create an factless,fictional, and full of hot air argument around something you so obviously do not understand. I suggest you sit down with your SE someday and allow him to enlighten you with the facts you so sorely lack.

 

By the way my email info is correct so you obviously never sent me a PM or I would have received it. Was this another bit of fiction from you? Bob,sometimes you come off so pathetic that if your responses weren't so arrogant I would feel sorry for you.

[Eamonn]

"Why do you say that Eamonn?"

 

Let's start with:

"To answer the question of who determines what is within the realm of scouting is very simple it is National which is locally represented by the professional Scouters in your council."

 

Professionals are employees.

Scout Executives:

Are hired by the Council Executive Board and can be fired by the Council Executive Board.

Voting members of the Board are all volunteers.

Scout Executives are members of the Council Key 3 and do advise the other members of the Key 3. But as a non-voting member has no voice (Vote) in determining what the Council may or may not deem to be within the scope of Scouting.

Scout Executives can not determine what is or what isn't Council policy.

Each of the more than three hundred BSA local councils, or local offices, is a separate and independent employer.

Each Council is a 501(3)© Corporation which works under a charter issued by the BSA.

This charter is reviewed at lest once a year by members of the Area Committee, again a committee comprised of volunteers.

It is unrealistic to expect anyone to have a in depth understanding of everything which might or might not be " within the scope of Scouting"

 

I have worked with a few SE's over the years. Each has had different strong and weak points.

Very often the Search Committee (Volunteers) will look for a person who is supposed to be strong in one area when they are hiring a Scout Executive. In the past we have looked at hiring people with strong communication skills to replace a SE who seemed happy to hide in his office and just didn't get on well with anyone (He was fired!) We have hired a guy who was supposed to be good at fund raising -He wasn't and he seen the writing on the wall and moved to the Council next door as a Field Director. He didn't do a good job there, so now he is in the National Office supposedly working as the LFL person in charge of working with Homeland Security!!

Within the Council we have many knowledgeable and gifted volunteers. Some volunteer as Council Vice Presidents or as Council Chairman of specific areas -When a SE want to find out something he asks them.

No prior Scouting knowledge is needed to become a DE.

A week spent at PDL 1 doesn't in any way prepares or equips a person to know what falls under the scope of Scouting.

Many of the people who have the hardest time adapting to the role of DE are young men who reached the Eagle Scout rank.

By far the best DE our Council ever had was a female whose only experiences of Scouting and the BSA before becoming an employee of the Council was that her son had been a Scout.

The main reason that she as so very good at her job was due to the fact that she was happy to leave program matters to the volunteers who knew what they were doing.

She of course had met the qualifications for employment:

Bachelor's degree from an accredited college or university

United States citizenship or declared intention to become a U.S. citizen

Adultmust have attained age 21 unless prohibited by any applicable law

People-oriented, having the ability to work well with adult volunteers, community and business leaders, and representatives of other organizations

Able to work varied hours when necessary to achieve positive objectives

Believe in the BSA and subscribe to its principles and standards

Be approved to receive a professional Scouting commission

(Copied from: http://www.scouting.org/Careers/Qualifications.aspx )

At the unit level.

The professionals have no say what so ever in who is selected as adult leaders.

While some misguided individual professionals think they have a say in how the program is delivered or what sort of program is delivered. They don't.

They could point out things that are not being done right to the COR or the Units Executive Officer, but they have no say -With that in mind. How the heck can anyone say that they determine anything?

Districts and Councils are only around to help support units. If a unit doesn't want the support offered it doesn't have to take it.

All members of the District Committee, Council Committee, Commissioner Staff and professionals employed by the Council when they visit a unit do so as invited guests.

 

So Ed, that is why I say that.

Eamonn.