Jason OK Posted June 29, 2004 Share Posted June 29, 2004 Dang Bob.....you tear jerker you! Jesus died for all of our sins. There is so much cool stuff I am learning concerning the crucifiction of Jesus. Why is his blood so symbolic..(concerning Angels not lambs).....why did Christ have to die at 3:30....where were the sacraficial lambs born? Bethlaham........Why did water and blood come out when his side was pierced (cardiogenic shock). What people mostly know about Christ is that he died for our sins...which is true and accurate.....but if people would study the word they would find out there is much more to the story thats hard to explain away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzzy Bear Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 So you do not go to church? But how does God look at the church building? 1 Chronicles 17:4 God, Go and tell my servant David that God said not to build him a house to dwell in: Why? 5: God, "For I have not dwelt in a house since the day I brought up Israel unto this day; but I have gone from tent to tent, and from one tabernacle (i.e., tent of meeting) to another..." Of course God relented and let David build the Temple and then he let it be destroyed and destroyed Why? Because, God wishes to walk with you and go where you go and do what you do and be there when you wish for him to listen to you and to answer your questions. God teaches us individually. FB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason OK Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Fuzzy Bear........don't take the bible out of context. The Bible also teaches us that Christians are to meet together on the first day of the week (Acts 20:7; I Corinthians 16:2). We cannot do all God has given us to do unless we meet together (see Ephesians 5:19; I Corinthians 16:2). Neither, can we follow the example of the early Christians in the Bible (I Corinthians 11; I Corinthians 14). The Bible teaches us to worship together in order to encourage the saints. We can't do that at home. Hebrews 10:25 says, "And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another....." Notice the word is "assembling" not "assembly." This passage has often been quoted as "forsaking the assembly" in an effort to get people to come to church at the appointed times. Even though it does not specifically refer to the appointed worship times, it does not exclude it. Notice the PURPOSE is to exhort one another. When we come together and worship together, we exhort one another (see also Colossians 3:16). What does it say when we miss worship services for avoidable excuses? Not only does it fail to exhort one another, but can even be a "stumbling block" to others which is sin (Romans 14:13). It encourages them to have the same lackadaisical attitude about worship as you have. When we choose to disregard the authoritative decision that has been made concerning worship, we disregard the authority of God (I Peter 5:1-5; Romans 13:1). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boleta Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 ScouterPaul You have described 95% of the 11 year olds I have met. Gee... All this time I thought the discussion about the True Religion was about Islam. Boy, was I surprised when the discussion turned to Christianity. I thought BSA was supposed to be INCLUSIVE. I respect the religious fervor of some on this thread and would never try to dissuade them from their beliefs. Too bad they couldn't respect mine (regardless of what it is), because if mine isn't theirs, then apparently mine is WRONG. The Christian fanatic is no different than the Muslim fanatic is no different than the... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason OK Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 When was the last time you saw a Christian in the news cutting off someones head? Christian Fanatics are followers of Jesus........if anything they kill their enemies with kindness. The last times Christians lost their way was in the dark ages when books were not readily available and the word was not taught (rather religion was a form of control) hence the pilgrims...mayflower...hello? Muslims Fanatics are taught the word from a very young age. CNN showed a group of Muslim children studying the Koran while bobbing their heads constantly for 12 hour days. This is fine to me. We are all human and imperfect. That is why Christ died on the cross. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob White Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Boleta, I hope you will understand that people will discuss this topic according to their personal frame of reference. They can hardly discuss other religions as well as they feel they can disuss their own. And I admit embarrassment over the way some of "Christianity" has been expressed in this thread. If nothing else this underscores why the BSA has avoided choosing a home team as it were. I think the BSA has done as good a job as is possible to experess what they want the program to be able to instill in a person without forcing any specific religion on anyone. (This message has been edited by Bob White) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzzy Bear Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Jason, What I said was spoken by God directly from the text. You made the "One True Religion" mistake that we have been speaking about. I shared with you what God has taught me. God has taught you something else. Could it be that one of us worships a false god? Could it be that one of us knows something that the other does not know or is not ready to know? Could it be that debate tends to make us unsure about what we do know about our God? Are there ultimate answers to the God question that only the very elite will know and others will never know? Does knowledge make God love us more so that the really smart guy is God's friend and the dumb guy is just a distant second? There are many religions and many views within each religion. The idea is to respect each person's view because God chooses to teach us individually. Once again, God walks and camps with us. During that time, he teaches us. As I have been taught by God, FB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason OK Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 One thing I can do is admit when I get overly passionate and lose my focus concerning a subject. It is the debater in me. Fuzzy......my apologies. In my other post...well......just a observation to balance the hand that was dealt. Maybe not the best way to deal the hand but none the less dealt. I do not believe we will be on this earth very much longer anyway. So I am not worried about who is right and who is wrong. I am right. LOL I took offense when Christians were referred to fanatical. Fanatical in todays terms seem so evil. I would prefer Holy Rollers or Jesus Freaks. Much better insult. Which I can be at times I have only been saved for a year, so the sinner in me loves to show its head (big mouth) from time to time. I make that statement for clear reasons. I do not wish to turn anyone away from christ.(This message has been edited by Jason OK) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster7 Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Boleta, The Christian fanatic is no different than the Muslim fanatic is no different than the... Thats an interesting statement. Last time I checked, no Christian fanatics had flown any planes into BSA headquarters in Irving. If you want to defend your statements please do so. But dont label me or anyone else a fanatic unless youre going to back it up with something relative to the discussion. I respect the religious fervor of some on this thread Great, so can I, but I think it was you that labeled those same folks as arrogant. and would never try to dissuade them from their beliefs. I dont see the second half of your statement as noble. If you thought their beliefs were wrong, why wouldnt you tell them? If you believe in Universalism, then that makes life easy thered be no need to tell them, because everyones beliefs are equally true. However, Universalism is a belief system that defies itself. For example, both Jew and Christian cannot be right. The Messiah was either Christ Jesus or not. Both cannot be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twocubdad Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 The last times Christians lost their way was in the dark ages Within my lifetime I seem to recall religious conflicts in Belfast and Lebannon where the Christians didn't mind offing their fellow man in the name of religion. I'm sure someone who pays more attention to these things than I can list more. Frankly, I think this whole line debate is nonsense, but let's try to maintain a little accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boleta Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Let's see... Northern Ireland- Christians killing Christians in the name of Christ. Bosnia-Serbia- Christians killing Muslims in the name of Christ. Nazi Germany- Christians killing Jews in the name of Christ (don't protest, they were described Christians). And so on.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason OK Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Boleta & Twocubdad , Get the facts straight. If you really want to talk about history lets talk.....because your example is poor! Christians all over this world are being slaughtered in the name of Islam. How can anyone call the Nazi's Christians (Japan being where the Nazi's got their religious ideas with mainly secret cults) Turn on the History Channel and maybe you might learn something. Jews have been persecuted but thats no surprise. God spayed they would be. Pull your heads out of the sand. I can fill this post with news article after news article Christians are being persecuted and slaughtered as never before in places like India, Africa, and the middle east. Either your a fool or have a religious agenda you will not admit. I am, what I am. Boleta you sound like a politician & a Muslim. Which is fine. I can state my religious beliefs but you hide like a coward! (This message has been edited by Jason OK) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firstpusk Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 "The last times Christians lost their way was in the dark ages when books were not readily available and the word was not taught (rather religion was a form of control) hence the pilgrims...mayflower...hello?" This statement could be considered offensive to Catholics and Orthodox believers. I know I consider these remarks uninformed and religiously bigoted. Scripture has always been part of Christian teaching and worship even during the dark ages. The vast majority of believers through Christian history would be considered illiterate by today's standards. Therefore, the word was taught as it is today in many Christian churches - read aloud to the assembled. The idea of mass ownership of the written word is a relatively new concept. The fact that most Christians before the printing press did not own bibles does not mean they were not aware of what was written in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packsaddle Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 To me, people who commit murder or other crimes are criminals. If they try to justify it on the basis of some religious belief, then I think they are either engaged an a self-deception or not brave enough to take the personal responsibility. By the way, I think words to the effect that God in some way condones persecution of Jews are blasphemous and un-American. Same when applied to any other group of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster7 Posted June 30, 2004 Share Posted June 30, 2004 Boleta, Let's see... Northern Ireland- Christians killing Christians in the name of Christ. Bosnia-Serbia- Christians killing Muslims in the name of Christ. Nazi Germany- Christians killing Jews in the name of Christ (don't protest, they were described Christians). And so on.... If this is in response to my post, it has no relevance. Your previous post accused some posters on this thread of fanaticism (if not directly, then by inference). The sins of Christians in Northern Ireland, Bosnia, Germany, or elsewhere have nothing to do with them or this particular discussion. Explain to me how posters on this thread can be fairly described as fanatics. Furthermore, just for clarification - no one claimed that Christians had no sins, or that no Christian was ever guilty of fanaticism. So, listing the crimes of Christians does little to prove your point. Nevertheless Your description of NAZI Germans attack on the world as being inspired by Christians has the ear markings of bigotry. A novice student of history knows better. German was a wildly nationalistic country commanded by a mad dictator. Your summary horribly distorts the reality of that war and those who embraced it. Similarly, the conflicts in Northern Ireland and Bosnia are more about territory, ethnicity, and those peoples desire to be independent from one another, than it is about religion. Case in point, how many Catholics travel to Northern Ireland to fight the Protestants (the British)? How many Christians ran to Germany or Bosnia? How many self-proclaimed religious sympathizers from other countries supported those conflicts? Answer - very few, if any. Now look at Iraq, how many insurgents are Muslim extremists from other countries? Look at the Muslim web sites Do they condemn or support the cause of terrorist groups? How do they view these cowardice murders that behead civilians (whos only crime is, not being Muslim)? Look at the Arab television network Do they portray these fiends as criminals or holy warriors? Religious fanaticism is alive and well. So much so, you should be careful as to make proper distinctions. Heres an easy test. If you were a vocal, self-proclaimed Muslim living in the U.S., would you be able to sleep well at night knowing that youre relatively safe? If not, how realistic would those fears be? How many Muslims have been murdered in this country since 9/11? Now, put yourself in Iraq, or anywhere in the Middle East, or any Muslim dominated country, as a vocal, self-proclaimed Christian and ask yourself the same question. Can you honestly say that you would feel safe from harm? How many Christians have been murdered in the Middle East and elsewhere by Muslims since 9/11? My point, you can cavalierly make the comparison and act as if one should have equal concern about extremists in the Christian community, but thats a lie - and the facts support that conclusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts