FScouter Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 That sounds reasonable enough to me. Now all the boy has to do is figure out what his duty to God (or higher being) is, and do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest OldGreyEagle Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Gee Ed, as the king of "the uniform is not required" and "you cant add to the requirements", I would have thought you would appreciate having the Declaration of Religious Principle statement included in a discussion of how to honor those principles. I assume under this new attitude of not posting anything that is already known, you wont be reminding us anytime soon about how the uniform is not required nor that you cant add to requirements Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunt Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 "That sounds reasonable enough to me. Now all the boy has to do is figure out what his duty to God (or higher being) is, and do it." I think many people may find it easier to figure out what the duty is than to figure out the nature of the higher power. For example, treating others with kindness, protecting the environment, etc.--so many things are common to multiple religious traditions. Because BSA is nonsectarian, I don't think we can assume that duty to God must include some kind of religious observation, such as prayer or ritual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmori Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Actually, OGE, that will continue to happen. The uniform isn't required. Belief in God is! The Scouts God, not yours or mine. Ed Mori Troop 1 1 Peter 4:10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest OldGreyEagle Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Ok Ed, I get it now You can quote BSA policy anytime you want, but I can't. I copied the statement from the BSA website, I didnt add any comment or interpretation of mine to it. When you corectly say that a uniform is not required or that you cant add to the requirements you are also quoting BSA policy, without and comment or interpretation. I fail to see the difference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperParatus Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Are there any real agnostics out there that can shed some light on the philosophy of agnostic theism, and the differentiation between belief and knowledge, that could lead to an agnostic having a belief in God while not having knowledge of His existence. This is getting interesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmori Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Breathe deep the gathering gloom Watch lights fade from every room Bedsitter people look back and lament Another day's useless energy spent. Impassioned lovers wrestle as one, Lonely man cries for love and has none. New mother picks up and suckles her son, Senior citizens wish they were young. Cold hearted orb that rules the night, Removes the colors from our sight. Red is grey and yellow white, But we decide which is right. And which is an illusion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest OldGreyEagle Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 While I love the Moody Blues, I fail to see how it answers the issue at hand Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FScouter Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Agnosticism is more than a lack of knowledge about God. It is more of a belief that it is impossible to know anything about God. If an agnostic person finds it impossible to know anything about God, it seems impossible he would have any belief in God. How can one believe in something one declares it is impossible to know anything about? OGE, what we have here is a failure to understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperParatus Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 It is impossible to know what Ed will post next, and yet, I have belief that he will post something. (This message has been edited by SemperParatus) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packsaddle Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Yeah, OGE, but it really was a great album. One of Gern's recent posts reminded me of something. The oath states that we will "DO OUR BEST to do out duty...". If agnosticism or whatever this boy is struggling with is HIS BEST, then he qualifies. Period. I guess I'm just taking it literally. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest OldGreyEagle Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 I understand Pack, I posted the BSA statement because a lot of times poster's pose as having the inside scoop in BSA policy interrpretation when they are no where near it. Lambert, the Scout/Scouter Atheist from California, Lambert was given a chance to declare a belief in a power higher than himself (or something like that), he said he didnt, he was removed from membership. But none of this explains why Ed quotes BSA policy with gusto and when I did, he questioned my motives, that is the part that I dont understand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FScouter Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Packsaddle - If we're going to interpret that loosely, we may as well delete that part out of the Scout Oath, and revoke the declaration of religious principle. Semper, before you go there you'd better define ednosticism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packsaddle Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Loosely? I consider it to be the strictest interpretation. Make of that what you will but I didn't write it, BSA did. Actually, the way it is being interpreted here DOES delete part of the oath, the part about doing one's best. So in a sense you have already endorsed the practice of deletion to fit one's preconceived notion. Edited part: It just occurred to me that I may need to actually explain what I just wrote. Here goes: The wording of the oath does not say, "I xxxx, promise to do my duty...". Rather it says, "I xxxx, promise to do my best to do my duty..." Anyone who decides to drop that first part of the oath has made a huge modification of the meaning and that DOES qualify as a loose interpretation. For that matter it is an outright FALSE interpretation. Until BSA changes it, I don't see any other way TO interpret it strictly. If the boy actually does his best, then he has lived up to the promise in the oath.(This message has been edited by packsaddle) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmori Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 1st off, I don't quote policy just to quote policy. 2nd, my post of Late Lament was to show I can cut & paste, too! Agnosticism is more than a lack of knowledge about God. It is more of a belief that it is impossible to know anything about God. If an agnostic person finds it impossible to know anything about God, it seems impossible he would have any belief in God. How can one believe in something one declares it is impossible to know anything about? Agnosticism isn't a lack of knowledge about God! It is more of a "I know there is a higher power but not sure what it is". Most agnostics are turned off by organized religion. The BSA doesn't require it's members to belong to a denomination, go to church regularly if at all or publicly display their belief. They do require it's members to do their duty to God. And that can be done in a million, not trillion different ways! It seems the sticking point of the original post was the Scout not wanting to say grace. I posted this before - grace doesn't need to be religious in nature! Grace can be as simple as "Thank you for this food". The failure to understand isn't coming from this Scouter. Ed Mori Troop 1 1 Peter 4:10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts