OA Election Question

[bigbovine]

So, new Troop and first time to have any experience with OA outside of Camporee Campfires. Two boys were elegible, so we held Elections. After they cast their ballots, the OA representative takes me to the side to tally the votes and then let me as SM sign some paperwork. As we are doing so, he marks both boys as being Elected. "What gives? I thought only one boy was allowed per year" I asked him. He goes on to explain that more than one can be elected if they each recieve half the votes in the election. I tried to understand this, but just couldn't really get past the fact that I always thought only one per year.

So could someone explain this to me. Can you send more than one boy and under what conditions?

Also, I was asked if I wanted to be nominated as an adult to help get the OA built in the Troop by his parents. I said I would have to give it some thought. But how does one go about that process also. I asked the boy thinking he was the one to talk to, but he said he knew nothing of the process. They left before I could talk to his parents again.

[00Eagle]

Current rules: all scouts eligible may be elected. To be elected your name must appear on more than half the ballots cast. Each voter may vote for all, some or none of the candidates. He can also decline to turn in a ballot which doesn't count against anyone.

 

Until about '97, scouts could only vote for up to half the slate: 5 or 6 eligible meant no more than three elected. If you had six voters, two eligible and it was a 3-3 tie, I think they went to another round of ballots before decarling no one was elected.

 

Adult rules just changed this year: Scoutmaster may be nominated if he has a year in the position and the camping time. Otherwise: one adult for every three scouts elected (or fraction) may be nominated.

 

Used to be one adult nomination for every 50 scouts in the unit. Troops with 51 or more could send 2 adults, etc.

[sst3rd]

Bigbovine,

 

I'm sure others will respond but I'll start. Election procedures for youth OA members have changed over the years. Current rules have been in affect for quite a few years. Once the Scoutmaster creates a list of qualified candidates for the Troop's OA Election (including he Scoutmaster's Approval), he invites an OA Chapter Election Team to execute an election. They will explain the election rules to your Scouts. Yes, you can vote for more than one.

 

As far as adults being selected (not voted), usually the Troop Committee decides this, after applying the adult qualifications. I believe the Scoutmaster and the assistants can participate as well. You can have one OA election per year, and can only select an adult candidate, if your Troop has a youth election (and actually elect a youth member). You can actually select more than one adult per year, if you have a larger Troop membership (maybe after 50 Scouts or so). I'm sure others will expand on this.

 

Good Luck,

sst3rd

[Eagle92]

Current rules: all scouts eligible may be elected. To be elected your name must appear on more than half the ballots cast. Each voter may vote for all, some or none of the candidates. He can also decline to turn in a ballot which doesn't count against anyone.

 

Until about '97, scouts could only vote for up to half the slate: 5 or 6 eligible meant no more than three elected. If you had six voters, two eligible and it was a 3-3 tie, I think they went to another round of ballots before decarling no one was elected.

 

Adult rules just changed this year: Scoutmaster may be nominated if he has a year in the position and the camping time. Otherwise: one adult for every three scouts elected (or fraction) may be nominated.

 

Used to be one adult nomination for every 50 scouts in the unit. Troops with 51 or more could send 2 adults, etc.

ntil about '97, scouts could only vote for up to half the slate: 5 or 6 eligible meant no more than three elected. If you had six voters, two eligible and it was a 3-3 tie, I think they went to another round of ballots before decarling no one was elected.

 

Actually I know of one troop that used some type of formula to elect everyone into the OA when they had an odd number of scouts eligible under the old method. Don ask me what it was, but I saw it happen when I supervised an election and it blew my mind. Some time after the election, I heard the SM bragging about how he figured out how to get everyone elected and told his troop how to vote..

 

back to the original post. As 00Eagle pointed out, they recently changed the rules and made it easier for adults to get in.

[Gone]

The adult election rule I read recently...which was reiterated by our OA election rep...was that a troop may appoint 1 adult for every three scouts elected. The SM, if not a member, may also be appointed BUT if he is already a member (or declines the offer) then you cannot send someone in their place.

 

So for the example above, if you elected 2 youth then you can send one adult; two adults if the SM is not a member.

 

As for who decides, I think this varies from troop to troop and I have not seen any directive from the OA. As long as the Scouters meet the same criteria as the youth then they are eligible. In our troop the Scouters each cast a secret ballot for the available slots (in our case we could send three). So of the 15 ASMs there were 5 eligible and three could be elected.

 

BTW, we do our own tap out. The boys really like it and it allows us to do a better job than in a large District or Council event.

 

@Bigbovine: Here are the links that talk about the OA requirements. I am not a member and have decided to go this year. Our OA ranks were dwindling and I wanted to make sure as SM I was promoting OA. NOTE: My own Council has noted the "new" adult election guidelines and posted a note from the National OA, HOWEVER, if you look at the National OA site you will find references to more than one process for "electing" adult members. Go figure, BSA being vague.

 

OA Site: http://www.oa-bsa.org/misc/basics/

Another thread on OA: http://www.scouter.com/forum/order-of-the-arrow/22226-oa-adult-nominations-not-happening

[Gone]

Sorry for the extra post...here is the official guidance from my Council. Note they say this is a new national policy for 2013. When in doubt I would contact your local Chapter and ask them what they know.

 

 

BREAKING NEWS

 

CHANGES TO ADULT SELECTION TO THE ORDER OF THE ARROW FOR 2013!

 

The national Order of the Arrow committee has modified the requirements for the nomination of adult unit Scouters as candidates for induction into the Order. The changes will increase the number of currently-serving Scout Leaders and Varsity Team Coaches and other unit Scouters who can be nominated as candidates. These modifications apply only to adult leaders in Scout troops and Varsity teams who are 21 years of age or older. They are effective at the beginning of each lodge’s 2013 elections season or January 1, 2013, whichever comes first.

 

There is no change to the current youth requirement or unit election process. The change is in the adult selection process for each unit. There are two changes.

 

First Change - Upon holding a troop or team election for youth candidates which results in at least one youth candidate elected, the unit may nominate adults for consideration and approval of the lodge. The number of adults nominated is no more than one-third of the number of youth candidates elected, rounded up where the number of youth candidates is not a multiple of three.

 

Second Change – If the registered unit leader is not a member of the Order, the unit may nominate the currently-serving registered unit leader (but not assistant leaders), as long as he or she has served as the registered unit leader of that unit for at least the previous twelve months. This nomination is separate from the adults nominated based on the youth election results.

 

Up to this date the number of adults nominated was based on a successful youth election and then the number in the unit for every 50 youth members. The new process bears no consideration to the size of the unit, only the results of the youth election and the qualification of adults nominated.

 

Examples - A unit that elects 12 youth may nominate up to 4 adults + the unit leader if the unit leader is not a member of the Order (or) If a 51 member unit elects 2 youth. The unit may nominate 1 adult + the unit leader if the unit leader is not a member of the Order. If the unit leader is a member then the unit may nominate one registered and qualified adult.

 

If the registered unit leader is a member of the Order, the unit cannot replace that nomination with anyone else. Only the registered unit leader qualifies for this nomination if they are not a member and have served as the registered unit leader for the previous 12 months. The unit leader nomination is separate and does not count toward the unit nominations for adults based on the results of the youth election.

 

Nominated adults are candidates for induction, provided the following conditions are fulfilled:

 

• Selection of the adult is based on the ability to perform the necessary functions to help the Order fulfill its purpose, and not for recognition of service, including current or prior achievement and positions.

 

• The individual will be an asset to the Order because of demonstrated abilities that fulfill the purpose of the Order.

 

• The camping requirements set forth for youth members are fulfilled.

 

• The adult leader’s membership will provide a positive example for the growth and development of the youth members of the lodge.

 

[BDPT00]

Write something here

[bigbovine]

Something! ha ha, seen this in another.

[bigbovine]

Bye the way thanks, you guys answered my question. I do not know why my misunderstanding of the election. In fact, I was given this information by what I thought was a reputable source. Once again, thanks!

[BDPT00]

I'm finally catching on. I was wondering why I saw all of the "Write something here" posts. Now I know.

 

The notion that only half could be elected under the old system was/is a very common misconception. One simply needs to read the form and do the math to figure it out (this includes the OP).

People will make up rules regarding adult selections, too. Whatever they come up with won't be spelled out on the form, so don't believe it. There are as many ways to do it as there are ideas.

The most important thing to do regarding elections is to get your teams trained, and to get your troop leaders to trust them and let them do their job. It takes both to make it successful.

BDPT00

[Gone]

People will make up rules regarding adult selections' date=' too. Whatever they come up with won't be spelled out on the form, so don't believe it. There are as many ways to do it as there are ideas[/quote']

 

Very true. I was told by at least several SMs (same district, same council) in other troops adult selection "had to be done" a certain way. Guess what? There were as many "ways" as there were SMs. I finally asked out Council office. Their reply: "As long as the number of adults nominated adheres to the candidacy criteria (15 nights, long term camp, etc) and does not go over the number alloted by the latest formula, we can use whatever method we want (SM appointment, Committee appointment, vote, secret ballot, etc.)."

 

Always helpful to have the Council office so close and available to answer questions. We did a secret ballot among the SMs to elect our candidates. We (I) will keep them secret, as we will the youth candidates, and tap all of them our together at our troop-based tap out. This works for us and is in line with OA guidelines...so it works all around.

[TAMScout]

If I could only get the adult leaders in my district who went through ordeal as youth to pay their lodge dues, there would be no need to elect / nominate adults. Of course then they would need to be faithful active arrowmen. The last time I thought I should nominate an adult, I found out he was a member.

[Old_OX_Eagle83]

This is something needs needs looked at again. OA selection is no longer nuch of an honor, and many of those elected are not "good scout/camper role models" the program was deisgned to promote. Additionaly, manhy elected are not old enough, or mature enough to be of much use to the order. BSA has destroyed this core program, and I can't fathom why.

[Old_OX_Eagle83]

 

This is something needs needs looked at again. OA selection is no longer much of an honor, and many of those elected are not the "good scout/camper role models" the program was deisgned to promote. Additionaly, many elected are not old enough, or mature enough to be of much use to the order. BSA has destroyed this core program, and I can't fathom why.

 

[Krampus]

This is something needs needs looked at again. OA selection is no longer nuch of an honor' date=' and many of those elected are not "good scout/camper role models" the program was deisgned to promote. Additionaly, manhy elected are not old enough, or mature enough to be of much use to the order. BSA has destroyed this core program, and I can't fathom why.[/quote']

 

Well, this is the whole problem with BSA now. More Eagles. More Arrowmen. More leaders. More MBs. Less quality. It's almost as bad as a youth sports team where everyone gets a trophy. It has all become so watered down and boys have so many other activities that the real purpose of Scouting is lost in the noise.

 

I do disagree about only inducting adults who were Arrowmen as youth. There are many fine Scouters who never were Scouts and can be, or are, excellent Arrowmen. But I would be in favor of having them re-do Ordeal if they lapse in dues or participation.

 

But you are right, OA is a shadow of its former self. Certainly no longer an honor society of elite campers. Just another popularity contest.