Really annoyed with our Adv Coord.

[LauraT7]

the other day a parent came up to me and told me that I really needed to 'get on' our Adv coord because he wasn't keeping up with the boy's advancements. I am NOT the SM of our troop, but i am a really active adult leader, and many parents have had alot of contact with me because I have been the Activities Coordinator for a couple of years. So, since i am not the SM, and it was only one parent, I just pointed out that they needed to talk to Mr W (Committee Chair and Mr M (SM)and went on. later i overheard some other parents gripingabout him - but since the person who is Adv. Coord is a friend of mine, I just didn't butt in and comment ( real unusual for me - I comment on EVERYTHING - one of MY faults) . No one was being specific as to what the problems were.

 

Well, today i found out part of what annoyed this parent - we had our annual Family picnic / court of honor - usually the biggest COH of the year, as it covers all the rank advancements and badges earned at summer camp. I threw out my back yesterday and could not go - another family took my son. Of the 6 badges my son earned this summer, he received ONE actual badge. This was a typical ratio for ALL the boys.

 

Camp was more than 6 weeks ago, and as Acting SM for camp, i personally turned in all the records to the Adv Chair tues after we returned from camp - with all advancements and badge cards recorded on troopmaster print-outs so all he had to do was the data entry into Troopmaster. Two weeks after our first camp - some of our boys attended a second summer camp. those records were also turned in immediately after camp. 4 weeks ago.

 

Knowing that he was going on vacation in between the two camps, and that afterwards, he was starting a new job - and because I have been unemployed all summer and have time on my hands - I volunteered a number of times to run over to the council office for him, do the data entry in troopmaster, or help him out any other way, etc. he always told me he had it all taken care of.

 

But then, the Adv chair 'forgot' or didn't get the order placed in time for the boys to get their actual badges. Only badges he had "in stock" were given out. (the old Adv chair kept a small overstock for last minute turn-ins of badge cards - so we had a surplus of 'odd' badges) the one badge my son got was "Home Repair" Which is not a popular/common badge - we must've had one in the box already.

 

Now, since i am disorganized and often late, forget things, etc - i have alot of sympathy for someone who has trouble with organization and time management. I consider the current Adv. Chair a personal friend as well as a scouting friend. But I just don't see any plausible reason for this?!? 4 - 6 weeks past camp? i could see SOME badges MIA if they were completed after camp and turned in late - but not that many!

 

I guess it also peeves me that after I left the committee as Activities Coordinator in Feb, he took it over and messed that up, too. In April, I took the job back, temporarily, until they could find someone else - even though i am now an ASM. In April - he took the Advancement position, because the prior Adv chair, a very methodical person, was asked to take over as treasurer. (the treasurer and son left the troop in Feb) BEcause he hadn't done anything there, either - i had to scramble to make reservations and change plans because some parks were not available for may and june campouts. he hadn't made any reservations for future campouts.

 

No one wants to do the Activities Job, and yet, the committee doesn't really want a non-committee person to do it either. After camp, I was told that a father was going to do it, but when I contaced him about getting the information to him - he stalled. that father has made no attempt to take over the job and I am STILL doing it - it seems as if the troop doesn't really CARE if the boys never get to go on another trip???

 

They are certainly making no effort to see them do so??? so we still have no one in THAT job either. For our last trip, again, I made the arrangements and reservations - or it would not have happened. I have been told that I am doing too much - and i agree, i am. BUT NO ONE ELSE IS DOING ANYTHING ABOUT IT!

 

i just can't stand to see the boys loose out on activities because the adults can't get their act together!

 

We are certainly short-handed in the adult volunteer department. We have parents complaining, but none willing to take on these jobs.

 

I am certainly far from perfect, i can procrastinate, loose stuff, forget and disorganize with the best. I do have Attention Deficit disorder, and yet, when it comes down to the wire, I have never let the boys down in taking care of the essentials in making sure a trip happens. I might forget my son's and my bike helmets,(did that once - had to buy some on the way) but I always have the paperwork and permits taken care of.

 

so am i wrong to be really annoyed with this guy? With the whole troop committee?

 

We've woprked so hard on turning this troop around, and we still seem to keep stumbling and screwing up.

 

I'm so discouraged.

 

[hops_scout]

Maybe it is time for the Activity Coordinator to become a boy to gain leadership. You would still need somebody to overlook him at work, but he could do the majority of it. Maybe his parents as the adult??

[eisely]

Based on what you have written, you are right to be frustrated.

 

Dealing with these issues is really the Committee Chair's job, but I also sense that there is more at stake here.

 

I have never seen a troop where one individual handled all the outing arrangements. While there is no guidance from BSA on this division of labor, outing arrangements are really the responsibility of the adults who have agreed to assume responsibility for the outing, working through the boys as much as possible. It is too much to ask of one individual to do all that for all activities. Besides, as a trek leader, I wouldn't want somebody else doing this stuff for me.

 

There is little or no excuse for the poor performance of the advancement coordinator. It is a big job, but that person must be prepared to step up to the plate when the surges arrive. Otherwise someone else has to do it. Advancement is one of the eight methods of scouting, but it loses impact and meaning when it is mishandled like this.

 

If the volunteer situation is as bad as you imply, perhaps it is time for a "come to Jesus" meeting with the parents. That again is the committee chair's job. People have to be asked. Some will offer, but many will respond only when asked.

 

Good luck.

[silver-shark]

Ditto to everything that eisley just said.

 

There is a form that I beleive is called a "Troop Resource Survey". It can be found in the "Troop Program Resources" book and I beleive on-line at USSSP.

 

When you make your suggestion to the CC about this parent meeting, make sure that he/she knows about this form that lists out the MANY different ways that parents may become involved.

 

YIS

 

Kris

[LauraT7]

Hops -

 

i had to laugh at your response - the adv chair IS an overgrown boy - 36 yr old, single and lives at home with his mom - the Charter rep. she is a driving force in our troop.

 

but she is also computer-phobic, very old fashioned - and all our records are on troopmaster.

 

He WANTS to do alot for the troop - but is really poor at follow through (and as the queen of disorganization, I KNOW that of which I speak!)

 

Eisley -

 

I have pushed for a meeting or something with the troop parents. the SM agrees with me - the CC does, too - but they have not made the effort to do so. summertime, after camp is a traditionally slow time for our troop. Today's picnic is/was a prime opportunity - most of the families come and we have lots of time to see them one-on-one and talk to them. Unfortunately, I could barely move with my back out, (bad enough i got my chiropractor out to see me on a SUNDAY - goo thing she's a long-time friend) and I could not go. I hope they DID make some effort to recruit and draw in some parents other than the low key 'we need help' plea.

 

thanks for listening, guys - It's nice to know there's somewhere I can vent!

 

 

 

[MaineScouter]

Laura, I agree with Eisely. In our Troop, we insist that one leader be responsible for each outing. This is a parent, a committee member or ASM that is going on the outing. He/she is the "tour leader" and is responsible for overseeing the outing from start to finish. We have one committee member that handles "just" the permission slips and tour permits for trips. The treasurer handles any money issues (collection and payment of fees). We have a parent that 9 times out of 10 volunteers to do the food shopping and takes boys with him to help them meet advancement requirements. The Scouts are responsible for menu plannning/shopping lists, equipment, leadership on the outing, patrol activities, etc. Committee members help handle the behinds the scenes arrangements, such as transportation, reservations, planning fund raising if necessary, etc. In other words, the work is spread out and it's not the same people every time. The decisions are made in a committee meeting as to who will do what. Announcements are made at the end of Troop meetings when we need parent volunteers. We seldom have to cancel plans due to lack of help. The last cancelled trip was due to lack of interest by the scouts themselves. The cancelled trip was a high adventure canoe trip in northern Maine. Not enough older boys wanted to go.

 

Good luck, Laura, in getting this mess straightened out. And remember, so long as you're doing everything... they will let you. I know it's difficult if you think the boys won't get to do something, but make it clear up front that someone else needs to start pulling their weight and then let it happen. If the Troop misses out on an outing because of it, it will get the parent's attention. There's nothing like telling "drop-off/pick-up" parents that the Saturday campout is cancelled because we didn't have enough drivers and adult leaders to go.

 

MaineScouter

[Sparkie]

Hi Laura! Sorry to hear about your back . You certainly have a right to be frustrated about this. Our boys received their Merit Badges AT summer camp the day we left (Sunday). It is alot of work to put together in that time frame. However, i'm glad we did because there was some straightening out to do with the office before we left (2 MB were missing, and about 4 partials not recorded properly...at the office). Once we were safely back at home, our Advancement chair sent home a letter to each scout with a partial (not the actual card) informing them what still needed to be completed to receive the MB. Just something to think about for next year .

 

Given the history of this leader, possibly reporting at com. meetings would help. Like simple updates of what advancements/MBs boys have achieved/earned. Also, since the Adv. chair is a friend, just offer helpful suggestions instead of pointing out what went wrong (i'm sure that's what your doing anyway).

 

On one other note, you mentioned "it seems as if the troop doesn't really CARE if the boys never get to go on another trip". What about the boys? do they have any say-so on where to go? Ideally, the PLC should be coming up with ideas (and researching) where to go, not the troop com. I was really impressed at our last PLC meeting (my first), where the boys discussed and came up with a monthly camping plan for the year. They also planned the MB to be worked on this year, based on a survey they passed out last fall to all the boys.

 

Hang in there, the fun is just beginning!!!

 

Sparkie

 

 

[buffalo2]

Say it again Hops - I don't think that anyone heard you the first time...

[Sparkie]

Buffalo2, care to elaborate? i think everyone responding is in agreement with hops scout.

 

[spork]

Another frustrating thing here is from the scout's perspective. Our troop had an Adv Coordinator like this (luckily he moved) but he held up my Eagle board for a month and a half for no apparent reason, and then he moved. Our old coordinator took over and finished the job, but my board was 3 months late. People that can't do jobs right should not put themselves in a postition that they would have to do them. It's as simple as that. This must be a frustrating thing for everyone in your troop, scouts and scouters. Good luck.

[acco40]

We are all paid the same (Man O Steele, your excused) as volunteers. If someone is doing a sub par job, don't **** , step up! If nobody else steps up, shut up! I hate to sound so crass but the only real problems occur when someone is doing a sub par performance, someone else wants to do the job and the sub par performer won't relinquish control.

 

If the Advancement Chair's performance is not satisfy the troop (or certain individuals in the troop), have the CC or other confidant, talk to him/her and see if the problem can be remedied. If not, or if it does not approve, announce the position is open and try to fill it with a competent individual.

[buffalo2]

Hops seems to be making the point that there are some aspects of the Advancement Chair's job that a youth could do. While we don't see it often perhaps, and it's somewhat out of the mainstream Scout jobs, I'd have to give it some thought if the right combination of Scout/adult could be arrived at.

Talent is too precious to squander at any age!

[andrewcanoe]

As the Adv. chair for our troop my problem is with too many people want to help do some of my job but no one wants to actually take over for me,I am also one of three ASMs. We usually have three or four parents at each meeting and some help with advancement with some of the scouts, the problem arises when the scouts tell me they have done all the requirements with Mrs.X or Mr.Y when they know less than the scout on the subject or take the scouts word that "we did that on that one camp-out", even if the parent was not along.(This message has been edited by andrewcanoe)

[Laurie]

This happened in our pack, and my son did not recieve any correct activity pins (Webelos), nor did he recieve the correct amount of pins. Thankfully, he was awarded his Arrow of Light, but that is because one too many had been ordered. The den leader forgot to tell the person handling advancements that these things were earned on time, but then they tried to make a quick run to fill in what was missed, but it still didn't work out. I later learned that there were no records kept--just a jotting down of advancements on scrap paper somewhere. This was the day my son bridged. I was not happy about this. He had worked hard, and if you could have seen his face when they passed right over him. That moment compelled me to learn all I could about helping to ensure that every boy gets what he has worked for. We are short people in the pack, so I am the Asst Cubmaster but just this month was given the role of Advancement Chair as well. Interestingly enough, my husband was asked to be the Advancement Chair for the troop--though the troop is in great shape though short on people too. (One trip to the scout shop from one of us covers both our troop and pack ) What bothers me is the attitude many in our pack have: "It's just a trinket or piece of fabric" has been said. I object to that. It is recognizing what a boy has earned, and he deserves to be recognized, and if the leader can't support that, then the leader needs to rethink why he/she is in leadership.

[mk9750]

I want to talk only about my situation, because I'm not sure how relevant it may be to others. But I am the Adv. Chair in our Troop.

 

Five years ago, if you were to rate my effectiveness on a scale from 1 to 100, it would have been 96. Everything was perfect, save for those very rare times when I, or someone else acted human.

 

Today, if you rated my effectiveness, it would be like 60.

 

What's the difference? Our Service Center moved from directly between my home and work, to about 45 miles away.

 

I was used to the convenience I had to drop stuff off, and if there were any descrepancies, getting them fixed the next meeting and dropping them off again. That luxury doesn't exist now, and even after five years, I haven't made the adjustment. I blame no one but myself, but the move is the reason.

 

My point is that it may be helpful to try to find the root cause of the problem and see if that can be fixed, or accomodated. It might not be the advancement chair, it might be a situation that can be resolved creatively if you know the real reason for the problem.

 

Mark