Backpacker Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Bob What I said in my post was not a personal attack it was to address the wrong information you gave about Venturing advancement and that information I gave was correct. Just because you led a training session doesn't mean you are a knowledgeable source on Venturing, it means you read a book and apparently not very well if you check the references I stated you would see you were not correct. Funny Bob, you state you are a scoutmaster, Sea Scout leader and now supposedly a Venturing Advisor, I find it hard to believe that you can perform all these positions concurrently. And I stand by what I said in my original post to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob White Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Yes, I have been a Scoutmaster, and an Assistant Scoutmaser, and a Sea Scout leader (which is a part of Venturing), I never said I was an Advisor, I said I was a leader in the Venturing Program and I am. I have been a Den Leader and a Cubmaster as well as a few other position at various levels of scouting. You assume incorrectly that I have been all these things at once, and I have never said that I was. I have been in the program for many years, and that has offered me the opportunity to serve youth in a number of leadership roles in scouting. You admitted confusing the Venture Silver with the Girl Scout Silver Award, an easy mistake to make. But assuming that I had no Venturing background was an error, as was your assumption that I was wrong about the Silver Award. both could have been avoided had you simply chosen to have a decent conversation rather than the off-handed comment you chose to make. In the future why not just post a question rather than continue to be inaccurate with your guesses. I would be happy to give a polite response to a polite question, and I am always happy to help leaders who are genuinely looking for answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nldscout Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Another perfectly good discussion down the tubes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScoutNut Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 Bob W - You stated: "The Girl Scout Silver Award Medal is approved for wear on the Venturing uniform for formal occassions." Could you please say where this is stated? Also, if the Girl Scout Silver Award is approved, what about the Gold or Bronze? I would assume at least the GS Gold Award would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob White Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 I believe you will find it in the uniforming section of the Venturing Leaders Handbook, where it talks about medals that can be worn on formal occassions. I apologize but my handbook is not readily available or I would look up the page #. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backpacker Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 My Venturing Leaders Manual and handbook are right in front of me and in neither book does it state anywhere that any other medals outside the Venturing or Boy scout program can be worn on the uniform, not even for formal occasions. THe GSA gold and silver are NOT ALLOWED. By the way BW this was also discussed in Venturing Leader Specific Training I attended, so NAtional and Council are in agreement. Now who owes who an apology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob White Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 "Now who owes who an apology." Based on the tone and rudeness of your remarks I would have to say that it would be you. Forgive me if I do not find you the most reliable source on scouting I have available to me. I will be leaving shortly for Jamboree and when I return I will look for the information that Scoutnut politely requested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backpacker Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 Scoutnut I have throughly researched your question in all of the Venturing manuals and handbook and in none of them does it state that any GSA awards can be worn with the Venturing uniform, this was also confirmed to me today by a National Venturing program spokesman at a council meeting this morning. Bob is mistaken, there are no exceptions to this rule. You can call National and talk to the Venturing division to confirm this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the7hiker Posted July 16, 2005 Author Share Posted July 16, 2005 Some people have lost the vision of Venturing. That vision includes thinking outside of the box. That means crews don't have to always follow the same uniform rules as Boy Scouts. For example, the Powder Horn and Kodiak dangles can be worn on either pocket in Venturing. (Direct from Bill Evans) For pins like the GS Gold Award, crews can decide if they can be worn on the uniform or not. To me this was a non-issue. I encouraged the wearing such pins. Of course the uniform guide is not going to cover these issues because they are crew decisions. Venturing is an exciting program. Not bound by the traditions of the Boy Scout rules. Let your hair down; have some fun! Craig Murray Crew Advisor TLC Advisor Webmaster - The Venturing Notebook http://www.sageventure.com/venturing/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nldscout Posted July 16, 2005 Share Posted July 16, 2005 the7hiker The problem with your logic on a crew deciding is that if they choose to wear the Kelly Green shirt then they must comply with uniforming regulation, plain and simple. But then again if I was in the business of selling unauthorized patches to people, I suppose I wouls advise them your way also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hendrickms24 Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 "I think BSA should make an official Knot for both the female Venture Scouts and Scouters who have earned the Gold award." All, I just want to apology to each and every Venturer out there. It was not my intention to offend you in any way by calling you a scout. I've been out of Scouts for fourteen years until last September and Explorers was the name of the program back then. Mark Maranto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoutldr Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 If there is anything out there that will help increase recruiting and retention, then I say go for it. If the lady Venturers want a square knot, where's the harm? Are the guys just jealous that there will be a knot that they can't have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob White Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 I have no problem with any award the BSA wants to make for the BSA uniform. What I do not understand is where Craig felt he had the authourity to create it. For him to suggest the award to national is one thing but to go to his scouts and say "hey, how about I make uo a national award?" is way beynd his authority as a unit leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGreyEagle Posted July 17, 2005 Share Posted July 17, 2005 Guys, whats the GSA? Now the GSUSA, them I know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the7hiker Posted July 17, 2005 Author Share Posted July 17, 2005 This discussion has gotten nasty along the way. It is sad that some feel that is the scouting way. I certainly don't feel that I have authority to create knots. This one knot was created because of demand and the desire to recognize others that are now in the Venturing program. Certainly if you think it is not right, don't buy any but you don't have to be nasty to the people that would like the right to recognize others in the fashion they choose. With respect to the business aspect, I do make enough to pay for my website. It costs me $70 a month. But if you have looked at my full site, you will see that I do my best to bring a lot to the scouting and venturing communities. My goal is to make sure information is shared, not to be critical of others. Take the ideas that you like and create a better program for the youth you work with. Forget the ideas you don't like but don't bash others along the way. All the best, Craig Murray http://www.sageventure.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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