proper "punishment"

[troopmom]

SharonNC, no, the dadwas not there. and when the Committee suggested probation consiting of the offenders' parents being required to come on campouts for a period of time, he pitched a fit informing us that we "can't make parents go on campouts." He isn't much for spending time on campouts apparently, not one yet. I don't think it would help though, this past weekend junior broke his foot climbing on a fence a church that he had been told not to climb on. I would have been totally embarassed but dad talked openly about it to everyone. I too am very confused at the behavior.

About the MB, a boy came up with the idea and most of us feel it is fair as some of the scouts were only involved by knowing and not saying. Since we are not sure who did what when and to what extent, everyone gets the same. The way we felt is that we will show how stupid you were and what the consequence could have been. If you continue to be stupid you won't be a happy camper and may be gone depending on what the policy we come up with says. Personally, I hope he is goes.

 

[matuawarrior]

Hello to all. Welcome Troopmom! Sorry I've been in and out of the campfire. Let me pull up my virtual log to have a seat.

 

It looks like everyone has posted positively and a lot of great suggestions have been given. I can only reiterate what was said. I feel that If the PLC had already voted and the committee has given their support then its a done deal. Apparently this "dad" is churning up the waters, over this "punishment"(we call it corrective action out here).

 

I don't know to much about the dad in question other than that he is an "Acting" SM. If he is a registered SA with the troop, then he doesn't really carry much weight as far as voting goes with the committee other than if he is speaking as a parent BUT each Charter Org is different. If he is a committee member, then he really doesn't carry weight with the PLC. The PLC is facilited by the SPL with the SM listening in the area. Just like our government, The BSA has its own checks and balances. Your either in the committee or your with the troop, should not be both.

 

My thoughts, continue with what your doing. Alot of advice has been given.

 

Matua(This message has been edited by matuawarrior)

[troopmom]

He's not an ASM, just a dad/committee member. Thank y'all for the support. It let's me and others on the committee know that we are not off base, thus feeling firm in our decision.

[RuddBaron]

"Boys will be boys" does not include needlessly dangerous and stupid activities like you mention. You can and should set a standard of conduct for troop activities, especially when it relates to fire. If they don't follow the policy during an outing, send them home IMMEDIATELY. If the parents won't come, deposit them at the local police station. Be prepared for some flak, but never never never back down.

 

Years ago at a Jamboree my Jambo troop had a kid with a real discipline problem. The adults kept threatening to send him home, even to the point of calling his parents numerous time, but they never did. Surprise, surprise, he never improved, and it continued disrupting the troop.

 

ONE BAD APPLE SPOILS THE BIN. They either follow the policy, or OUT THEY GO.

[Twocubdad]

I think your solution is a classic example of proper discipline -- discipline defined at training which makes punishment unnecessary. That it was suggested by a Scout and approved by the PLC makes it a great example of a boy-led solution as well.

 

You should print this thread and give copies of it to everyone on the committee.

[troopmom]

I've linked it to most of the committee and will have copies for dad. CHECK!

[ozemu]

maybe you could set fire to the dads arm to check how emphatic he is on boys being boys. He wouldnt see it as dangerous or bullying it seems.

[AlphaCentauri]

It's interesting that the other boys in the troop are expected to put up with this sort of behavior.

 

Our society is great for expecting children to "stand up to" bullies and not "tattle," when the same behavior by an adult bully would be considered a felony, and the proper response would be to notify the police instead of taking matters into one's own hands.

 

Fire setting is often a symptom of very serious psychopathology. It is often seen in children in foster care with attachment problems. They fear getting emotionally attached to anyone, and they almost dare the foster parents to send them back. Arson is the one behavior that isn't tolerated and is guaranteed to get a response.

 

I doubt the troublemaking boy wants to be in the troop -- or be in any group like scouts. This behavior shields him from having to actually form relationships with other people. The other boys will fear him from afar, but it masks the fact that he's a social cripple. The really sad part is that if his father doesn't see a problem with this, the son has no chance to get straightened out before he is old enough to be tried as an adult.

[troopmom]

Very insightful. I feel the same way in that the good kids shouldn't be expected to hang around bad behavior. However, the scariest part is that the boy is very popular at school. It is sad to see this quantity of youth attracted to such delinquent behavior. He is a likeable kid who does stupid things.

 

Since I first posted, the outcome (I think) is that the boy is going to leave the Troop. We have had two of the sessions at the fire dept. given by a fireman who used to be a SM. Wasn't that a Godsend. The boy attended one session and had had surgury a few days before the other but was given paperwork that he could do to make it up. We have a video to watch left, but the boy has stopped coming so assume his family has decided to stick to their guns and protest. I am conflicted about this as I feel Alpha is correct in that he needs to form a responsible relationship. I'm not sure that the Troop is the best place for that though since the other boys may follow his lead. I guess I'll just have to have faith and listen to my little birdy.