Does COR HAVE to be a member of the Chartering Organization?

[Beavah]

Yah, more and more bizarre. No easy way to troubleshoot this from afar, eh?

 

To my mind, though, if someone is being told a decision taken behind closed doors with no opportunity for the man to defend himself is "final", then things have been hijacked. Da COR should say "no" to any council demands and call the council and area presidents.

 

I'd suggest the SM consult with his attorney and consider a "shot across the bow" letter to the DC and DE, since it's quite clear that their words and actions have damaged his reputation in the community. Since da DE is presumably acting in his capacity as DE, I'd hint at da possibility of expanding da action to include the council and copy the SE.

 

"Scouting professional and local scout council named in slander suit against hardworking volunteer" would definitely be picked up by the 4th Estate.

 

Beavah

 

[ScoutNut]

It seems to me that the issue of this SM, while important, is not the central issue here.

 

The central, and most important issues here are that a DE, and DC, are trying to get a COR removed from his position, against the Charter Organization's wishes, simply because the COR does not agree with them. The DE, and DC, are trying to tell a Charter Organization who they should have as volunteers in the CO's unit, and what positions they should be in.

 

These are very dangerous precedents for a council/district to be setting.

 

In a time when most councils are trying to strengthen relationships with Charter Organizations, in order to increase the numbers of units and members, this council/district is doing it's best to tear down those relationships.

 

THAT is why, if I were a COR in that district, I would be on the phone to the SE as soon as I heard of the goings on. NOT because my buddy the SM-elect is being railroaded, but because my Charter Organization's rights to run it's program are being threatened.

 

 

[ScoutNut]

BTW - What exactly did this guy say in this infamous "political discussion" among friends that started this whole brew-ha-ha?

 

 

[5yearscouter]

well no news

went out to dinner for my birthday instead of spending all evening on the phone.

 

I don't wanna have to go to council to deal with this.

 

boo hoo

 

sigh

 

[5yearscouter]

Let's see, what did SM elect say?

 

he said the president lacked testicular fortitude in regards to speaking out about the Ground zero mosque

 

he laughed that someone else called the vice pres- Joe Bite me

 

he said a local sheriff was an utmost disgrace and doesn't understand free speech

 

he said something about Marxist Democrats using the Tucson shooting to take away more of our freedoms (gun control discussion)

 

and a godless Democratic party

 

several quotes are totally edited for content with words deleted to make them sound worse than they are. Part of a sentence posted at 2pm is stuck together with part of a sentence posted at 5pm to make it sound like the guy is going to burn a pile of Qurans.

 

 

there is more, but I'll stop there

 

note I'm paraphrasing, not copying SM's words

 

 

I want to prove my point, but I also know that others could interpret the information in a totally different way than I have.

 

 

 

[5yearscouter]

Scoutmaster elect shows up at council today

for a visit with the council and district execs

 

he took a printed out copy of all of his online/email/facebook/+ discussions in full, rather than cut and paste parts

 

when the execs read thru and compared the full print out to things from the district commish

and found that district commish cut and pasted things specifically out of context to make them look worse than they really were.

 

council apologized to the scoutmaster elect

and approved his application to lead this troop.

 

whooo hoooo

 

I'll see the district Exec at an appt Tuesday to see about the other issues raised in during this fiasco.

 

Question to the scouters?

What would you feel should happen regarding this District Commish's actions?

I believe he was making trouble in a unit, which is NOT what a District Commish should be doing.

 

 

 

[Scoutfish]

So how about the DC? Ithink it's time he be removed from his post.

 

Purposely and intentionally twisting the truth, flat our lying and purposely pursuing slander?

 

Noyt in any shape way or form a quality that follows the Scout Oath, the Scout Spirit or reflects the values and morals of scouting.

 

And you have to ask: What will he do or say the next time he doesn't like somebody else?

 

What has he said about other in the past?

 

THis guy lost all credibility in everything he has said, or will ever say.

[5yearscouter]

I figure the troublemaker went to the troop committee, District Committee, Council,

so the next level he threatened to go to is National and then the Media.

I wonder if he'll do those, and I forgot to ask what council they will do if he tries that.

 

 

I honestly feel hatred for this guy, and I have always said that like is too short to hate people, it uses up too much of your own life force.

 

so I will focus on the positive.

and thumb my nose at this guy.

 

What really got council to look was comparing the whole print out

to the DC's cut and paste,

 

the one where half the sentence from 2pm was stuck with half the sentence from 5pm to make the SM elect's words say something totally different than he really said.

 

I used that as an example in my email I sent to the District and Scout Executive. Interestingly I got a read receipt from them for the email right before their meeting with the SM elect where things turned out right. that means they also read the rest of my email telling them it was inappropriate to try to remove a COR.

 

I really appreciate you guys talking me thru this.

 

I HATE when grown ups can't play nicely with others. Your support and information has helped me to think clearly about what I could and could not do, and what I still need to do come Tuesday.

 

I will tell them that the DC needs to be removed from his District position for making trouble in the units he's supposed to be supporting.

 

But I won't use the scout law as a weapon against him. the scout law is not a weapon, it is a guide to live by.

(This message has been edited by 5yearscouter)

[Oak Tree]

I will tell them that the DC needs to be removed from his District position for making trouble in the units he's supposed to be supporting.

 

You're welcome to do this. I don't know that a different approach would be any better. But here's what I would do. I wouldn't focus on telling them what they should do. They clearly already understand that this guy screwed up. They might already be ready to fire him, but that's hard to know.

 

What I would say is something like:

"Our DE, who is supposed to be supporting our program, has instead become a source of great frustration to our leaders. He has lied about us, lied to us, misrepresented our words, and tried to have us removed, all for no apparent cause. We find ourselves completely unable to trust him moving forward, and to protect ourselves, we don't expect to be involved in any district or council activity where we might encounter him. Our unit has been in turmoil, our adults have been ready to quit Scouting altogether, our emotional energy is shot, and our focus has been removed from the boys. We really want to thank those at council who took the time to understand the entire issue and tried to put things right. But things can't possibly seem right to us if we continue to encounter our DE, because every interaction brings back a memory of the pain and discord."

 

People generally don't like to be told what to do. They do often like to view themselves as doing the right thing, and it should be obvious what the right thing here is.

[5yearscouter]

yeah I'll just use this

""Our DE, who is supposed to be supporting our program, has instead become a source of great frustration to our leaders. He has lied about us, lied to us, misrepresented our words, and tried to have us removed, all for no apparent cause. We find ourselves completely unable to trust him moving forward, and to protect ourselves, we don't expect to be involved in any district or council activity where we might encounter him. Our unit has been in turmoil, our adults have been ready to quit Scouting altogether, our emotional energy is shot, and our focus has been removed from the boys. We really want to thank those at council who took the time to understand the entire issue and tried to put things right. But things can't possibly seem right to us if we continue to encounter our DE, because every interaction brings back a memory of the pain and discord."

 

thanks for reminding me to stay on track

and giving me a great way to do so.

 

[BadenP]

5years

 

While Oaktree's idea has merit better find out first how this DE did last year on his money raising and numbers requirements, because if he surpassed his goals the SE will be very reluctant to get rid of him. On the other hand if he didn't make his goals then this incident will be the final straw in his goodbye package. A similiar case like this occured in my council when I was a new DE, the Sr. DE was a complete A-hole but he knew how to smooze the big money out of his district and he was always starting new units even in areas that already were saturated with units. His volunteers hated him but he didn't give a da** cuz he never went to any district events, short of a drive by. When they complained to the SE they were told that this guy was doing a fantastic job exceeding all his required tasks and that they would just have to learn to get along with him.(This message has been edited by BadenP)

[5yearscouter]

""Our DE, who is supposed to be supporting our program, has instead become a source of great frustration to our leaders

 

naw sub Dist Commish for DE.

 

I'll keep DE

he's immature but has some potential although he's not completely innocent in this.

 

Our old DE got a lot of complaints from the units,

but he did kick butt on fundraising. I just made sure in dealings with him I knew fundraising was his strength and kept any other requests from him at a minimum. He got promoted to another position in the council.

[5yearscouter]

Scoutmaster elect resigned his postion in the troop.

 

Seems Dist Commish is still talking

"going to the media"

and contacting SM elect's employer (he's a teacher)

 

I believe he is contacting lawyer about this mess but he's not talking to anyone at the moment. I know he's really hurt over the continued attacks. Scouting isn't fun for him anymore, that's for sure.

 

 

Unfortunately when the discussion of replacement came up

Nobody in the Troop raised their hands with interest in being Scoutmaster in his stead.

 

Retiring scoutmaster will stay on for an addition month or so in the hopes that things settle.

 

blah.

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by 5yearscouter)

[Eagle92]

Sorry to hear that SM elect is stepping down. Threatening to go to the media and employer is very juvenile. Good luck to him and the troop. I know I would nto step up and volunteer in that unit, or district, with a commish like yours.

[CalicoPenn]

5year,

 

I know you're not in the Troop - but you said the DC is actually a parent in the Troop - I said it before, I'll say it again - if the Troop really intends to move on, the first thing they need to do is contact Council and tell Council that the DC and his sons are no longer members of the Troop, then call the DC and inform the DC that they are no longer members of the Troop - it no longer matters if it hurts the boys - and yes, it's not their fault, but until the Troop rids itself of this toxic parent, then it will never be able to move on. The next call is to the Council Commissioner where the troop will demand that the DC be removed from his position, that the DC has cost the Troop a quialified volunteer and has damaged the reputation of this noe ex-volunteer - and the Troop will not compromise. It's time for this person to go - end of story.