Council Exective is a bully

[moosetracker]

She didn't say it was only her unit. In her original post she stated I thought it was just that he didn't like us. But talking to other Scoutmasters, they feel the same.

 

Are there executive at high levels that try to micro-manage everything.. Absolutely! I have seen it in many things not only in scouting.. They are usually well hated also for the power trip they are on, and the difficulty they cause in others to do their jobs properly..

[BadenP]

moose

 

It just seems to me there are way too many holes in her story. Yes there are some SE's who try to micromanage everything but not this somewhat trivial situation. Almost 100% of all tour permits are signed by the council registrar and are never even seen or discussed with the SE. If this is indeed a true story, which I am beginning to strongly doubt, the only recourse is for the COR to meet with the SE and Council President.

[ScoutNut]

While our registrar is the one who goes over the permits to verify training, etc, it is our Assistant Scout Executive who actually signs them and gives them the final approval.

[lilizard62]

mooseguy......I apologize for not making myself clear.

Our Tour Permits are strictly done online. They go straight to the Scout Ex. This new policy came to be when I turned in a written Tour Permit to the Registrar and SE happened to be there. Took the form from the Registrar and told me that I should be doing these on line and this permit was the last one he was going to accept on paper. May i add that it wasn't in his happy tone. I don't think he has a happy tone.

I follow all the emails sent out to us by Council and there was no indication that this change was going to be mandatory. This man is not approachable. Unless you are giving him money.

I do got to hand it to him.

[lilizard62]

I hold Asst. Scoutmaster position. I also am in charge of filling out Tour Permits, Rechartering, Transitioning Webelos. I am very active.

BP... come to one of his training sessions or council meetings and listen to his demeanor. You will understand....

In round-up kick off party...he suggested to our Cub Leaders that if we can not get a parent to volunteer for leadership we should tell the kids "IM SORRY BOYS, BUT YOUR PARENTS DON'T CARE ABOUT YOU". I am not exaggerating.

[Hawkrod]

In defense of lilizard62, the internet can be a tough place to try and discuss issues. I managed to make quite a mess out of trying to get help. I did not really want to go beyond very specific facts but a lot of people had the same reaction as I see in this thread. Fortunately my SE has become involved and a lot of the issues cleared up very quickly. Had he not been willing to help I do not know where I would be but the reactions I got from people here were disbelief. Just because we have not run into the issue does not mean it isn't happening or that the person is trolling for attention. I came here hoping to find answers and the reality is that it was not a good experience as rather than answer the question on its face value, people responded that they had never heard of something like that and questioned the me as if I were a criminal. How about instead of attacking the person who is asking for help, you answer the question if you know and don't respond if you doubt it. I know it sucks being questioned this way for asking for help in finding an answer. I know for sure that my posts on this forum are now carefully gaurded and I am quite sure this post will take fire but doing what is right is more important than doing what is easy. BTW, I had a really hard time understanding the abbreviations as well. I had never seen or heard them used before but God forbid we should ask such an innocent question because it sheds doubt upon our skill and experience as a leader. I can tell you that I think a few high and mighty people here are here only to rule the roost and be seen in awe by all around them. They have a ton of experience and knowledge but sharing it isn't always free, sometimes you have to pay the price to get an answer. JMO

[BadenP]

lilizard

 

Even if your SE is as big an idiot as you suggest there are ways of dealing with him as many have explained to you. If enough units are really angry and get their COR's to the next council executive meeting this problem would be taken care of very quickly.

 

It seems to me that this is more of a personal battle since no other leaders seem to be rallying to your side. If that is truly the case, which I think it is, just hold tight and in a couple of years he will be transferred to another council. In the meantime you better learn how to work with the guy or your unit will continue to have problems.

[83Eagle]

@Hawkrod: They have a ton of experience and knowledge but sharing it isn't always free, sometimes you have to pay the price to get an answer.

 

I empathize with your position. I have commented on this elsewhere. Too often people make assumptions based on limited information presented in a post and rather than try to get a clear picture first, they go on a diatribe to tell you how much they know about something you didn't state or imply.

 

I would say, don't let it get to you, but it's hard not to. As you've learned, don't ask a question here unless you are prepared to have people criticize you for needing an answer. Based on the number of PMs I've received from people that essentially all state, "That's why I don't post here often, but I don't want to agree with you publicly," you can also take comfort in the fact that you are not the only one who feels this way!

 

As was mentioned in another thread, "This place isn't for wussies." Which, being a Scout forum, is disappointing.

[John-in-KC]

Very quickly,

 

lilizard,

 

1) Get with your SM and CC. Your responsibility is to them, their responsibility is to the Chartered Partner, its Institutional Head, and the Chartered Organization Representative. Make sure they know and approve what you are doing. You want them to have your back.

 

2) Have a friendly cup of coffee with your Institutional Head and Chartered Organization Representative. Lay out the issues on the table, simply, clearly, and without emotional investment.

 

3) Ask your Chartered Organization Representative to talk, in turn, with your District Committee Chair, and your District Executive. Let him carry the water to Council about why issues are unsat and what needs change.

 

4) If 3) works, great. If not, it's time for a business meeting with your Chartered Organization Representative: Does he want to press this matter as a franchisee of the Council (which is what a charter really is, pretty much) with the Executive Board? If he does, equip him. If he does not, then you're done; you have to live inside how the Council Scout Executive chooses to do business, or ...

 

5) Call it a day, it's time to leave your local Council, or leave the particular tasks you have.

[lilizard62]

This Thread is getting out of hand and I apologize. My plan is as followed.

1st. Talk to my Troop Committee and see if they want to pursue a formal complaint. If yes and we do put it in writing and then

2nd....Approach the Charter Organization Rep and discuss what needs to get done.

 

 

[skeptic]

Just to take the edge off................

 

It this was an English executive (I know they don't have them), would we be happy he was "bully"? Just wondering.

[infoscouter]

Skeptic -

 

My understanding is that much of what is done here by paid staff is done by Commissioners in Scouts UK. Of course, some of what is done here isn't even bothered with in other countries - my impression is that we are much more paperwork intensive. The paid staff of Scouts UK is relatively small compared to our National Council staff.

[Gags]

Skeptic,

 

Only if he was bully AND a right ol' chap.

 

Cheers,

 

Gags

[skeptic]

Gags;

 

Does that mean one has to be a "right ol' chap" to get up on the Bully Pulpit?

[mc99218]

Your suire it's the Council Executive and not a subordinate at the district level???

 

Assuming this is a SE or SDE or DE flexing pecks

 

and

 

If your a registered player..(any position) except an ASM in which you take this to your SM first

 

put your particulars in writing and send via registered mail marked (personal and confidential)signature required to the Council President and the Council Commissioner.

 

State hour case

Document with corroboration your grievances

Offer up a desired outcome

Sign it

Get the support of other who have been mistreated as well.

 

Give em a couple days and while waiting Make friends with a savvy commissioner.(choose one wisely)

 

If contacted by any of these worthies agree to cooperate with efforts to rectify the matter.

 

If nobody contacts you....

 

you have your answer.

 

If your a "concewrned parent" with a boy in a troop register your concerns with your Committee Chair or the CR or the IH and turn make friends with a savvy commissioner (choose one wisely)

 

If your stonewalled

 

Call the media or maybe just work within your Chartered Partner committee and the District Committe to keep the matter on the front burners until somebody gets the message

 

A Scout is Friendly even when counting coup

 

 

all scouting is local

 

all else is vanity

 

MCCET

PMTNPO

OWL