Scouting in France

[alki]

trevorum - Yes, I was in France as a missionary for 22 months. I lived in Angouleme, Cholet, Bayonne-Anglet-Biarritz, Bordeaux, and Cahors. Absolutely loved it. It's been awhile, though, so my French is comparable to a "vache espagnole".

 

hugolin - Un certificat d'entranement avant de devenir chef scout n'xiste pas ici. Au contraire, on est lu chef scout, comme Trevorum a dit, et puis on dois assister (tout de suite!) sois-mme aux entranements si tu n'y tiais jamais. Le gouvernement amricain n'a rien faire avec a. Le BSA dirige tous ces runions pour toutes les organisations qui veulent adopter les "Methods of Scouting." Est-ce qu'il y a un diplme de chef scout donn par l'tat en France? Comment es-tu devenu chef scout?

[There is no training requirement before becoming a scoutmaster here. In fact, once you're elected scoutmaster, as Trevorum stated, you must (quickly!) get yourself trained if you haven't already. The US Government has nothing to do with this. The BSA oversees this for all the (chartered) organizations that want to adopt the Methods of Scouting. Is there a Scoutmaster Diploma given by the French government? How did you become a scoutmaster?

[Hugolin]

Hi friends !

 

Thank you Alki for what you said about my english. It is very friendly... Maybe that discussing like arround a virtual campfire I will progress. It would be great!!! 

 

I see that you understand how work scouting in France. However, youre not completly right about relation between religion and founding received by movements. French state doesnt care (I am still polite) about religions. On the countrary, I think we have one of the less religious state of the world.

My scouting movement (the 2nd more numerous) doesnt receive anything. If you want to receive government funding, you have to be politically correct (in the norm). In that sens, youre right saying that you were not fairly juged and I am not surprised. I am sorry for the feeling you keep from that...

 

What is a LDS mission?

 

Thank you Trevor, I learn lot of things... It is excellent! Your 8 methods looks like our 5 goals of scouting :

1 Sens of Health (body, sport,...)

2 Sens of Caracter (word?)

3 Sens of Concrete things (technical capabilities?)

4 Sens of serving (service?)

5 Sens of God (which give sens to all the others)

 

One more time, translations are not very good.

I am very glad, because when I see Ideal, outdoors, personal growth, uniform, etc... I exactyl recognize our method. It a joice to know that throught Atlantic, scouting is very similar, scouting is a brotherhood.

 

It is interesting to learn how works one troop management, with the troops committee and the troops sponsor. In France, the scoutmaster (leader In France he is called chief of troop) is also choose by 1 or 2 older adults (often parents of scouts) Men for boys, women for girls.

I asked this question because, here, the scoutmaster will be allowed to camp 15 days only if he passed, not an exam, but a kind of training. If the chief is not in the rules during the camp, he can be pursuited in justice (go to tail?). But knowing youre a national scouting movement, you may not have such problems.

Different training are avaible. 2 degrees per age field : louveteaux (little wolves) field, scout (claireur in French) field and road field. Corresponding age are : 8-11 ; 12-17 ; 17+. I was chief (leader) in road field, so I passed my 2 degrees for that. I also have my degrees in scout field because I was scoutmaster this year. These degrees are recognized by Youth Ministry.

 

 

Your Jamboree seems to be great! 32,000 scouts... It is amazing. We did it at the european level (eurojam), but selecting a limited number of troops per country, because it was in Poland and they cant receive 50,000 scouts. We were 10,000. The biggest national movements in the GSE are France and Italy. Poland is increasing more and more.

 

Thank you very much Scoutldr for saving my word pedagogy. It is very friendly, but I think its a word created by french for french who try to speak english.

 

[alki]

I apologize that my frustration with bureaucracy came out and soured our discussion. Please forgive me.

[Je suis dsol que ma frustration avec le bureaucratie a rat notre discussion. Je t'en prie de me pardonner.]

 

I should correct my earlier statement that said a newly-elected scoutmaster "must" quickly be trained if they aren't already. The truth is, unfortunately, that a scoutmaster may go many years without training. If a scoutmaster breaks rules, frequently it is the chartered organization and the Boy Scouts of America that are sued [pursued in justice], not the individual scoutmaster.

 

In the US, there is no training requirement, just a training recommendation. This training is conducted by the national organization (BSA), so it is the same for any chartered organization (church, school, etc). Hugolin - Who conducts your training? Is it the Scout Federation or the Guides? How long is this training? What topics are included in this pedagogy? [sure hope I used this word right. ]

[Hugolin]

It is interresting to see how do you consider training and its necessity...

I think that we share exactly the same point of vue about this. I'm glad for that because in French lot of scoutmaster are not trained. I think we can't serve our next correctly without good training.

 

My movement (GSE) is allowed by Youth Ministry to conduct its own training. It is a good thing for adding a scout spirit you won't find in Scouts of France. Training is for 1 complete week in situation (Scoutmaster are in the skin of those they will lead - It may be funny when it's about 8-11 years old). Topics : Security, Legacy, Pedagogy,... In Pedagogy (Lot of things, all our method) : The Scoutmaster role (post?), the Patrol Leader role, the personal growth (of the boys AND of the chiefs...), the game, the camp life, uniform, etc...........

[Trevorum]

In the BSA, Scouts accept 3 kinds of duty:

Duty to God and Country,

Duty to Others, and

Duty to Self (physically strong, mentally awake, morally straight).

 

Our duty to country includes learning about our country, our history, our laws. etc. Before every Scout meeting and each morning in camp (raid?) we salute the flag and say in unison our Pledge of Allegience to our flag and country. Is it the same in France?

[Hugolin]

Your word "camp" was the good one... "Raid" is only for a walk.

I'm glad to learn that you also salute the flag.

We "stand up "colors" (it is a very poor word by word translation from french : "monter les couleurs") every morning singing tradition salutation song. In your country it is quite usual to do that. But in France, it is very exceptional... Out of the soccer, the flags are not very used, because it looks like "old France"...

During the camp we stand up 3 flags on a "mat" (word? like on a boat...) : French, Scout and European flags.

Oh! I just have an idea... I put a few photos for you from our summer camp. I'm disappointed because they are not very good and we can't see the flags. It can give you an idea about our scouting.

adress is : http://famille.bergier.free.fr/Photo%20Camp/

 

I think I will have lot of very good photos later... Waiting, you can have a look on these one.

 

 

[Trevorum]

WONDERFUL photos!

:)

 

For all of our differences in language, Scouting is Scouting!

[alki]

Great photos!!

 

I especially like that the uniforms have simple, uncluttered, insignia.

[Hugolin]

Thank you...

I will try to select and to organize them better when I will receive all the photos.

 

If you want to see our uniform, there are photos (more beautiful) on the national website : http://www.scouts-europe.org/

 

[frog]

Gday guys,

don't know if there is anyone still on this one.

Introduction: My scout totem name is Poulain, that is foal for you english speakers, I am an old Guide, used to belong to the same association as Hugolin. I am French and have now settled in Queensland Australia where I work for National Parks.

My scouting years have been great and Hugolin's desciption of Scouting in France is complicated but it does portray the situation there. Basically WOSM and WAAGS are old worldl=wide movements created to confederate the national associations on the world stage. Unfortunately things have changed since then and it is very hard to get in as they only want one federation/association per country.

In Europe, scouting in the twenties was starting to divide by religion.In France we had a Catholic (Scout de France), a Protestant( Eclaireurs Unionistes), a Jewish (Eclaireur Israelites de France), a neutral (Eclaireurs de France)associations.

As Hugolin said in the 60s some tried to modernise scouting by changing uniforms, laws, pedagogy etc and created tensions leading to scissions and creation of new associations most of which are going back to more traditional scouting methods. When I was in France there were about 30 different associations!These new ones can't join WOSM cause there is already an associatuion representing their religion in the national federation.

Hope this clears things up.

Fraternel Salut Scout

Yours in Scouting

Poulain