OA or Indian Lore question about feathers and birds

[willysjeep]

I'm not quite sure who can answer this for me. I would like to know what feathers other than eagle or immitation eagle can be used appropriately in a head dress. I am thinking about seriously updating my regalia(sp?) and I don't want to "fake" anything this time around as long as I'm putting all this effort into it. I know eagle feathers were used because of the noble qualities of the eagle and the reverence the natives have for them. With endangered species laws and the scarcity of eagles around most of the stuff that would have once been eagle feather is now dyed turkey feather, and I don't want that. I would like to know historically which other feathers would be found in a head dress, and which ones if any would be taboo. I was thinking that another raptor that is not protected (raven, crow) or a more nobel bird like a hawk feather from a falconer might be more appropriate. I just don't want to end up making something that will make the local tribe furious with me, and I don't want to immitate eagle feathers.

 

Oh, along those lines. I was also wondering, just as an opinion question, which do you think would be more appropriate at a drumming event: A resin cast immitation eagle whistle, or a real bone eagle whistle made from the bone of a raven or other similarly sized bird? Again, I would tend to lean towards the real thing, but would using the bone from a raven be a taboo in the drum circle?

 

Any comments would be appreciated.

[acco40]

I claim no knowledge of Native American / Indian etiquette/sensibilities but I do know that from a legal perspective, non-native Americans should not use Eagle "parts" for ceremonial purposes.

 

What is wrong with dyed turkey feathers? The way I look at it, instead of using the "national bird" why not use the national bird (non-scavenger) that Ben Franklin wanted to represent the USA?(This message has been edited by acco40)

[nldscout]

Our ceremonies team here in NNY use wild turkey feathers that we get from turkey hunters for free. When they can they also use a few goose feathers.

[willysjeep]

That is a good point, I am not native american by birth, so I really have no right to use actual eagle parts, the law actually forbids it unless I am a member of a reckognized tribe. That is in part why I was asking about alternate feathers.

 

Using dyed turkey feathers as eagle feathers may look right, but I don't think that native americans would have. I want to make my regalia as correct as possible without offending anybody. Dyed turkey feathers I guess could have been used before the 1900's but they would not have been used in the place of eagle feathers. I would imagine they would have been used as turkey feathers.

 

How did they traditionally use the feathers of crows, turkeys, and geese? Also, were any birds considered disrespectful, taboo, and were their feathers not to be worn? Did they have any headware that did not contain eagle feathers but did use those of other birds?

 

Thanks for the ideas!

[packsaddle]

Crows and ravens are not raptors but both of them are famous (notorious?) for their intelligence. Eagles regularly eat carrion, something a turkey would never do. At least vultures (which are also raptors) are honest about their station. Franklin had good points but lost the argument. You will not find a more noble bird than a wild turkey. I once used grouse and quail to finish the fine details of two dance rosettes. Took many hours to complete but the effect was stunning. Check with your state wildlife regs regarding raptors (hawks, etc.), the penalties can be devastating.

[red feather]

My understanding of the law prevents you as a non-native american from owning, wearing or utilizing any part of the eagle and many other protected birds up to and including in some areas the bluejay.

 

To create an appropriate costume,consider researching a local or favorite tribe and match as close as possible historic infofrmation.

 

As a Runner in the Tribe of Mic-O-say, I wear a deerhair and porcupine roach, leggings, linen shirt, breastplate, buckskin loincloth, possibles bag, choker, rattle and shield.

 

All is made without using proscribed items. Feathers are either turkey, pheasant, goose and other game birds. Some of the feathers are imitation and are very close to the real thing. You get what you pay for when it comes to imitations. Rattle is made from a cowhorm and brass hanes tip, stained with natural coloration. Some of my costume is made from copper cable, an idea from a plains tribe picture that I found that showed them using telegraph wire for decoration.

 

Shield is made from rawhide and is painted with researched symbols.

The costuming of some tribal members is very extensive. Fancy beading, and lot of it is based on the actual items found in museums and seen as various pow wows.

 

Just let your imagination go and pick a tribe to emulate or pick items from different tribes that you like. Also remember a costume is never, never done just in constant change.

 

yis

 

 

[willysjeep]

Did a little research on the laws, Eagles and hawks and falcons are pretty much off limits to me as near as I can tell.

 

My local tribe would have been the Noquet, but the Ojibway would also be very close. I plan on making my regalia as close to the Ojibway style as possible. As it turns out the Ojibway did not traditionally use too many feathered head dresses, they would have worn an otter turbin or possibly a porcupine roach, but later on just about every tribe would have worn the eagle feather head dress as it became immensely popular in the early 1900's. By then immitation eagle feathers could have been used so I am considering that option also.

 

The Ojibway's claim to fame as far as clothing goes was their floral pattern beadwork, which I plan on imitating from an older set of regalia in my family and using on my shirt, leggings, and breech. I guess the issue of using turkey feathers is over for me, as I have found proof that it would have been done once the feathered bonnet became used by the Ojibway.

 

In regards to my other question I first have to see if any other birds have a wing bone of a similar size to that of an eagle. If I can locate a "legal to own parts of" bird with a wing bone like an eagle then I should be able to make an eagle whistle out of it. The one thing I really want to avoid is plastics, so if I can't make one of real bone there is really no point to it. It would be just a little accessory anyways, so it isn't a big deal if I can't make one. Mabey making one wiht the resin cast whistle as a pattern would be good. Ah well, I guess I will have to see how that works out.

 

Thanks for the ideas and thoughts!

 

[packsaddle]

Would a couple of vulture bones do it for you? Check the laws to see if you can have them in your possession and send me a private message with your address if you're interested.

[SR540Beaver]

Willys,

 

Check out this website, http://www.skullsunlimited.com It is a company here in Oklahoma City that has an international reputation. They provide skeletons and bones of many types of animals for all sorts or purposes, from museums to medical schools to collectors. They might be pricey, I don't know. But they may have a wing bone of similar size to an eagle available.

[packsaddle]

Their skulls are really nice but kind of pricey, replicas too. In my work I have seen and handled quite a few bald eagle carcasses (especially the last few years), too bad I couldn't keep one of the skulls for my daughter's skull collection. Anyone out there care to make a contribution?

[willysjeep]

I just found out that a few supply houses make eagle whistles out of turkey bones! In fact, a ready made one is going for 50 UK pounds on one site, but I don't want to pay that much. I think I'll get a butterball and mabey buy a little resin cast whistle to use as a pattern. Thanks again for the ideas but it looks like I found a good economical option. Same thing for turkey feathers, I'm OK with them now, given the time period I would be shooting for.

[le Voyageur]

WJ,

 

Seeing that you're in the upper Michagan peninsula you have a wealth of history that you can tap into.

 

As such, my suggestion would be to develop a persona for a specific period of history and go from there.

 

For example, during the 18th century the Great Lake tribes in your area mixed native American dress with European.

 

Proper dress seen for this era would be a long shirt, breech clout, sash, leggings (wool, or brain tanned deer), and center seam mocs. Other items could include a gorget, decorations made from trade silver, and maybe a weskit and/or capote.

 

Accoutraments would include items like a scalp knife, small neck knife, hawk, powder horn and a small hunting bag. The most common gun was the Fusil de Chasse in 62 cal.

 

When camp ends, I pm you and forward you some photos to give you a better ideal for the correct look if you're interested....

 

[OldGreyEagle]

Hey WJ,

 

I know you are sorta new on this forum,

and you might like to know le Voyageur is a native American and is a wealth a knowledge on the subjects you seek. Pay very close attention to him, it will serve you well.

 

[packsaddle]

le Voyageur, anyone, Maybe you can help me with a question that I've never been able to answer. How is it that brains (as an animal organ) are able to 'tan' a skin? What's the process and why wouldn't another organ (say, the liver) also work? I've always wondered how it was that one organ could have such effect on another. Also, how in the world did anyone discover this in the first place?

[ozemu]

Wondered the same thing when I read the Jean Auel series.

 

Our Aboriginal people didnt wear much. They went in for body scarification in a big way. They did wear some impressive possum skin cloaks (up to 80 in one item). The ceremonial items were interesting. Lots of clay and ochre body painting.