Men in GSUSA

[andrewcanoe]

We have had a thread about women in BSA,How about the thoughts of those out there with an opinion on men as GS leaders.

 

I was asked to join both a troop and an "high adventure" interest group in the local GS council to help promote camping and other outdoor activities. I took these invitation as a complement of the BSA program that I am a part of.

[NWScouter]

I have never been a leader in GS and my girls were in Campfire but from what I have heard from Scouters involved in GS, if you think you females are treated like second class citizens in BS try being a male in GS.

[rlculver415]

Our BSA troop has an informal partnership with a Girl Scout troop that's about two hours away from us. We join forces for a couple of campouts each year. We also have a very active Scouter in our troop who also enjoys working with a local Girl Scout troop. I see nothing wrong with his working with the girls, as long as there is sufficient chaperonage - which there always is. I have heard some comments wondering why he does this since he has no daughter in scouts any more. However, they all seem to benefit from the set-up, and are having a lot of fun.

[Fat Old Guy]

" We also have a very active Scouter in our troop who also enjoys working with a local Girl Scout troop. I see nothing wrong with his working with the girls, as long as there is sufficient chaperonage - which there always is."

 

Do you insist that there are proper chaperones for the female Boy Scout leaders when they go camping with the boys?

[KoreaScouter]

I'm also registered as a leader in both GSUSA and BSA. I don't have a copy of GS "Safety Wise" (their GSSS) in front of me, but if I recall from my training, it doesn't permit me to be the only adult present with girls, under any circumstances, although a female leader may be. I understand it, follow it, and don't have a quarrel with it. I realize that they're simply managing risk; instances of men molesting young girls are more common than women molesting young boys. Like it or not, that's the reality.

 

So, I don't think we should be treated the same. Our policies, and the policies of any organization, should reflect the risk or threats to its members. Let's face it, men and women are different, biologically and behaviorally.

 

Here's an example I used on both my kids when they were old enough to walk and get lost. You know how we always tell our kids not to talk to strangers and if you get lost, find a policeman? Well, at most places where kids will get lost, there aren't policemen standing around. There may be security guards, or UPS guys, or somebody else in a uniform...who is -- a stranger! What I told my kids repeatedly is if you get lost, find a woman with small kids, tell her you can't find your parents, and ask her to help you. Easily identifiable, present everywhere, and much more likely to immediately get involved, and for the right reasons. Managing risk.

 

KS

[ScoutNut]

I have known many men who were members of GSUSA. My husband was one of our co-leaders for about 8 years. There was a handicapped dad who was leader for many years. A neighboring council had a dad on staff who ran many programs for the girls. My hubby helped him out one year when our 2 councils collaborated on a 2-weekend event (1 at their camp & 1 at ours). Our parish grammer school currently has a dad who is very involved with the schools Girl Scout troops. He has been intrumental in getting our Holy Name Society (a Catholic men's organization) to sponsor the school's GS Troops (they are also the Charter Org for our Pack & Troop). There are other men in our area who also are leaders or troop helpers.

 

Like BSA, GSUSA has rules reguarding safety issues which must be followed. Also, like BSA, there are some members who would rather see a single sex organization thruout. Thankfully, unlike in BSA, I have never run into a GS group which treats willing leaders and helpers like unwanted trash just because they are the "other" sex.

[SMT376Richmond KY]

Hmm I'm registered in both. At GS camp training I was the only man. When they found out I was a Scoutmaster and Life Scout guess who gathered all the firewood and started all the fires. I had to bunk in a cabin a 1/4 mile down the road we were all adults. This doesn't happen in BSA. I have provided first aid training during GS encampments for several years as an ER nurse and have herd several comments from other female leaders similar to "what's he doing here."

 

Also, I have found that the general conseus from many in the PC world for GS and BS is the following "Why would a man want to spend his time in the woods with boys/girls." Must be a gay pediphile for BS or sexual preditor for GS. Not a person that wishes to help young people learn and grow into productive citizens. Ok off soap box.

[rlculver415]

FOG --

 

If you will refer to my previous post, you will realize the word I used concerning chaperonage was "sufficient" (as in enough), not "proper". It would be a wide-open opportunity for lawsuits if our Scouter were alone with a troop full of pubescent females.

 

As for proper chaperonage of female BSA Scouters, to which group I belong, let me say that I don't need a chaperone, so I don't insist on one. However, I wouldn't ever be alone with any boy other than my own son wherever we might be. It's against the two-deep leadership requirement.

[AlphaCentauri]

Our Sunday school has a policy of two teachers present at all times -- the regular two teachers for primary and middle school groups are both women, but if one group isn't meeting, the other will have a parent stay with her group.

 

As far as male Girl Scout volunteers, I think that part of the resistance is that girls simply behave differently in female-only groups, and part of the idea of Girl Scouts is to encourage those behaviors. For instance, it's very disruptive at our scout meetings if there are boys nearby, because all the girls start showing off by ignoring the planned program. They aren't interested in adult men yet, but give them a few years. (I remember male teachers causing a lot of excitement in my high school.)

 

And girls don't get enough exposure to the idea of women managers and leaders except in female-only programs like Girl Scouts. They can certainly benefit from exposure to men with such great experience, but they (and their female leaders) also benefit from sorting things out for themselves.

[Fat Old Guy]

Alpha Centauri said, "As far as male Girl Scout volunteers, I think that part of the resistance is that girls simply behave differently in female-only groups, and part of the idea of Girl Scouts is to encourage those behaviors."

 

Interesting, when a similar argument is made on the Boy Scout side, we're called barbarians and out of step with the times.

 

Korea Scouter, don't you find the GSUSA's policies to be the same as "profiling" and assuming that a black man in a sports car is likely to be a drug dealer and that a man in a turban on an airplane is a threat?

 

 

[Herms]

I was a registered leader in GSUSA for several years (the only male in the council). I ran the outdoor program for our troop and the parents (many of them single mothers) loved having me around (As I was male influence in there girls life, but I ALWAYS made sure a female leader was with me!)

 

On the first camporee I was told by the Service Unit Leader that, I had to be out of camp by 10:00pm (yeah right, I was still doing dishes) and that I had to pitch my tent 75 yards away (neither of which is a GS rule, but I did to be a part of my girls scouting expierence). My girls were very prepared, but I brought 6 extra sleeping bags, extra blankets and extra jackets, all of which I gave out to other troops that showed up and the women and girls were very thankful I came. A group of them went to council to complain about the 10 O'clock and 75 yard rule, which is how we found out that there is no such thing, and was the Service Unit leaders personal bias.

 

When I attended the outdoor training (which was extremely poor) I was basicly told to keep my mouth shut when offering to help run a compass course (which the trainer didn't have a clue on how to do). Over the course of the weekend the other female leaders there for training started coming up to me on the side asking for help and pointers.

 

After 5 years with the troop, my daughter last year decided that she doesn't want to do Girl Scouts anymore (Teenagers!!), but can't wait until she turns 14 next year to join Venturing!