Woww-eeeeeeeeee have GS uniforms gotten expensive!!!

[AnneinMpls]

I'm taking a look at the new catalog thinking over uniform options for our new Junior/Cadette troop. I've already determined that whatever we do, we're gonna look like two different troops thrown together - there just is no middle ground between the Junior and Cadette uniforms (not that I really had any expectation of that anyway...)

For the Brownie troop we gave up on the uniform shirts - poor quality, hugely expensive. We went to light blue polo shirts that we got on clearance at Old Navy for $4 each. One of my co-leaders found a whole bunch of Brownie jumpers on clearance also - some for $4 and even some for $1! So they're good to go - I still have some of those polo shirts to sell off for the new girls.

Juniors are easy enough - especially this time of year we can easily get affordable white polo shirts for them.

Since I've got such an enthusiastic bunch of new Cadettes coming in, I thought I'd revisit the idea of official uniform pieces...what a shocker!

The official blouses are $31.50

The official polos are $26.50 - who pays $26.50 for a polo shirt???

I guess those make the navy blue 3/4 sleeve t-shirt look like a bargain at $19.95.

It's frustrating. I'm looking over the BSA catalog too - their official uniform shirts are about the same price as the blouses but you don't have to then also get a separate uniform piece for wearing insignia. Guess I'm just in a complaining mood today... (BSA'a polo shirts are a lot cheaper)

[dsteele]

Be cautious, Annie -- comparisons between the Boy Scouts of America and the Girl Scouts of the USA are a quick path to madness.

 

In spite of the similarity of missions -- the two organizations are apples and oranges to each other.

 

My wife earned her Gold Award. I earned the Eagle Scout. We both have very similar skill-sets and very compatible values. We both worked very hard to earn those ranks.

 

However, the two organizations are very, very different in just about every way.

 

I'm most aware of the differences in professional organization. For example, a Field Director in Girl Scouts equates to a District Executive in the Boy Scouts. In many Girl Scout Councils, the Field Directors work only 35 hours a week and are part time employees, while a District Executive in the Boy Scouts generally works 60-80 hours a week and is a full-time exempt (meaning no pay for overtime) employee.

 

A Field Director in the Boy Scouts is defined as a professional Scouter with no district of his/her own who supervises two or more (usually more) District Executives. I don't know what the Girl Scout equivalent is.

 

I believe I heard at one time that GSUSA sold the patterns for their uniforms so folks could make them themselves. I always thought that was a great idea. Is it true?

 

DS(This message has been edited by dsteele)

[AnneinMpls]

Awwww, you hijacked my whiney thread!

 

Hey, I was never one to avoid quick paths to madness, sortof like ripping off a bandaid - the faster the better, right?

 

I do find it humorous how much complaining Boy Scout folks do about their uniform - do they even know how good they got it?

 

Put a bunch of Girl Scouts in a room together, and anyone actually in uniform is in the minority. The fewer uniforms they sell, the more expensive they get, and we're cycling towards no longer being a uniformed organization. Which is truly sad. There are so few uniforms being sold now, that it's getting very hard to find used uniforms locally at all. Our troop is pretty rare in encouraging uniforms beyond just a vest or sash, but I had no qualms about going with our own shirt style for the Brownies because no one else is wearing a matching shirt anyway.

 

Well here's what our official publication, Girl Scout Uniforms Insignia and Recognitions, has to say:

"Since its earliest days, Girl Scouting has been a uniformed movement. Today, our continued commitment to the uniform, its insignia, and recognitions signifies Girl Scouting's trusted relationship between outward appearance and inward strength and ideals.

"The Girl Scout uniform symbolizes a large and vigorous worldwide organization, devoted to the development of girls and grounded in these essential values: Identity...Growth...Unity and Equality...History...Community...Service...."

Umm, that is the most convoluted load of... Sorry, I just think we could really do a much better job of giving a clear rationale for uniforming and a much better job of actually using the uniform. In my years as a Girl Scout, I have worn some pretty ridiculous excuses for a uniform, including that horrid lime green thing with the multicolored printed plaid weirdness. And after 3 years had to switch the weird plaid for a *different* ugly weird plaid. We did our level best to wear it with pride too.

Uniforming for the Girl Scouts has never been and won't be in the foreseeable future as simple and easy as the Boy Scouts' shirt and pants. We started back in the day when women only wore long skirts, and were very daring by putting on matching bloomers under our skirts. Girl Scouts playing sports were shrouded from view back in the 1910's because they actually took off their skirts and wore just their middies and bloomers. Shocking. Course at that time Boy Scouts were swimming nekked and camping out in breechclouts. So our uniform designs will always have a skirt option lest our girls' parents think we're turning them into a bunch of Communistas (and I think skirts are nice for formal occasions like award ceremonies, Girl Scout Sunday, etc.) but, damn, can't we just pick a shirt and go with it? One single simple shirt. What is so hard? Instead they churn out these truly odd ensembles every 2-3 years, completely different designs and colors. Our troop back in highschool was accused of being airline stewardesses for heaven's sake. (Along with the terrifically witty comments about coffee tea or me offered up in gutteral German.) That was the event that spurred us to ditch our offical uniforms for travelling and come up with our troop travel uniform. The current uniforms are really not *too* bad, but still not exactly "uniform" - put a bunch of girls and leaders in a room and you'll see probably 8-10 different looking outfits, designs and colors, even if they all show up in a full official uniform. That's just dumb.

Arrgh.

Peace out,

Anne in Mpls

[AlphaCentauri]

Boy Scout wear uniforms because they are practical. They are sturdy clothes that are durable enough to camp in and comfortable enough to sleep in. Moms don't mind their boys wearing them to camp and crawling in muddy ashes, because they aren't ruining their regular clothes. Boys don't mind wearing them because the older boys and adults wear the same uniform.

 

A girl may buy the Girl Scout uniform, but where can she wear it? The sash or vest is a hazard when working around an open flame, and the short little skirts preclude sitting on a floor. The khaki pants are fine, but aren't too specific to Girl Scouts -- every school in the country seems to have adopted Dockers navy or khaki pants as their uniform. Our girls show up to meetings in their vests, then drape them over the backs of chairs for the rest of the meeting.

 

If it were up to me, I'd change GSA to have girls stay in one uniform with one troop as they got older, so older and younger scouts would be together (as they are in so many troops now anyway). A single uniform with a more subtle variable (different color sashes over the basic Brownie-to-Senior uniform, for instance) would solve the "looking like two troops" problem and make it easier to find used uniforms, too.

 

As far as leader's uniforms, at least the Lands End stuff looks better than the airline stewardess uniforms the GSA sells.

[AnneinMpls]

Sigh

Alpha, how would you and I go about getting the needed changes made to the uniform? I have noticed in the last few years they've started placing little tent icons next to uniform options most suited for camping - that's a step at least.

I think the Brownies in brown is such a tradition, I wouldn't want to mess with that. (And I think the Daisy program as a whole ought to be realigned closer to the Brownie program but that's a whole nother topic for a whole nother thread!) But if we could come up with a basic uniform design for Juniors on up through Adults, practical for outdoor activity, that would be really cool.

I'm toying with the idea of putting all of us Juniors, Cadettes, Leaders into that $19.95 blue 3/4 sleeve shirt - what do you think? Actually - nix that - not my decision - gotta let the girls work on this one at our meeting this week. But you know us leaders - place a subtle suggestion on the table and...

Peace out,

Anne in Mpls

[MomScouter]

Alpha, As a parent of a Boy Scout, I mind very much when he wears his uniform to camp and gets it full of stains, etc! The shirts cost over $30. In fact, as a rule when they are at camp the only time they wear them are at dinner and during ceremonies. And my son has still managed to get stains on his shirt. Boys have sashes too, and wear them at the same kinds of places that girls wear theirs (and girls have the option of, in my opinion, the much more practical vest for insignia).

As for my Junior, she wears her uniform only in parades, certain outings, and at meetings, not to campouts or outdoor stuff. I do wish more of the troop would get the vest or sash, but uniforms are really not an issue.

[Fat Old Guy]

"I believe I heard at one time that GSUSA sold the patterns for their uniforms so folks could make them themselves. I always thought that was a great idea. Is it true?"

 

I've seen Girl Scout fabric at fabric store in the recent past. Both the official green and a white fabric with the "Service Mark" on it.

 

As for Boy Scout uniforms, it's too bad that they don't make the youth shirts in 100% cotton. My cotton shirts have been through hell but the stains come out. Over the years, I've notice that most stains, especially oily ones, latch onto plastic closthing and won't come out with anything short of dyne-e-mite.

 

Actually, I don't think that you really need the explosives but you do need to be a bit creative for stain removal. A couple years ago, my son got a nasty salad dressing spill on his shirt. Stain Stick, pre-treating, etc. didn't do anything for the stain. Finally, out of desperation, I tried turpentine. Good-bye stain. I just had to let the shirt air for a couple days before I washed it to get rid of the odor.

 

There was a time that the field uniform was a true field uniform and could withstand the rigors of outdoor activities. Alas, that time is long past.

 

Yeah, I know that some will complain about having to iron a cotton shirt. All I can say is "don't be so lazy." It takes five minutes, at most ten, to iron a shirt. Better yet, spend a $1.25 and send it out for heavy starch.

 

I will agree that Girl Scout uniforms are expensive. Even more outrageous than Boy Scout uniforms.

 

I bought my daughter a plain white polo shirt ($4.50, K-mart's boy's dept.) and used my ink-jet printer to print an iron-on service mark in the right shade of green (about 1.4" high). I put that on the left sleeve, just above the cuff, and it looks pretty good.

 

[hops_scout]

At least Boy Scout uniforms are all the same... be back to explain more later

 

[Daisy Chain]

I agree that the cost of uniforms is way out of control. Our troop did buy the official girl scout pattern. It has since been discontinued. The fabric has also been discontinued. Our Brownie troop just uses brown cheap fabric from the local Walmart.

 

We "strongly encourage" our girls to have a uniform. However, we are the only troop in our service unit who has full uniforms for our girls. We "require" them to wear them to school each week on Girl Scout day and to every troop meeting and activity.

 

Also, my co-leader and I intended to purchase the blue 3/4 sleeve shirts to wear since they would match the girls. However, we were informed that we were not allowed to wear them by the Girls Services Director when we went to purchase them.

 

The cost to join as a new girl scout is quite a shock to parents- especially now that the national dues have gone up. The books are expensive and our council asks for a donation as well. Even our meager $2.50 a month dues add up. It cost one family (with two new Brownies) over $290 for the books, uniforms, and dues!

[MomScouter]

Daisy Scouter,

 

Does your troop do anything to offset these costs? Last year we used troop funds to re-register the girls. We got a grant from a business to buy the girls the book sets (Juniors). Our council will cover the cost of registration for any girl who cannot afford it, and will offer additional funds for things like a sash or dues. Our Service Unit will provide funds to new troops. We do several fundraisers to cover the cost of field trips.

 

Also, I know having uniforms is great, but I don't think a troop can require that all the girls wear them.

[Fat Old Guy]

"Also, I know having uniforms is great, but I don't think a troop can require that all the girls wear them."

 

According to my daughter's troop leader, the only required item is the felt do-dad with the membership pin.

[Overtrained]

"...I just think we could really do a much better job of giving a clear rationale for uniforming.."

 

The rationale for uniforming that I have heard and believe works on most parents, is that uniforming evens the field. No matter what background the scout comes from, they're all the same in uniform. Of course, they have to be able to afford one or have some trade in program with the unit.

[Midnight]

I for one, have had experiance with the who uniforming bit. Uniforming may equalize the girls, but lets's say you can't afford the unform to begin with? Or you already have a uniform, but it's 6 six years (and 5 tacky styles) behind the rest and can't afford to buy or make a new one?

 

I am also a complainer on the subject - having to wear uniforms to headquarters and to DC. Both were unpleasant experiances in the uniforms simply becuase we felt out of place and uncomfortable becaue everyone in the troop felt as if they were unattractive. Yes, we understand the point of uniforms is not centered around being attractive, but these were teenage girls. These uniforms do NOTHING to boost self esteem.

 

The BG vs GS uniforms isn't really comparable, I agree. However, it would be nice to keep a uniform that didn't change every few years, something that was both durable, comfortable, and reasonable looking (all in my wildest dreams, I'm sure). I've had experiances where I was requested by camp staff or by council to be in "full uniform" and then had to hike, in heels and hose, up and down rocky trails to teach at a few summer camps.

 

(This message has been edited by Midnight)

[genamarie]

I'm a Cub Scout den leader as well as a Brownie and Junior Troop leader and when I went to buy uniforms for GS, I was appalled! My son's CS uniform shirt was $24.00, and my daughter's uniform shirt was $22. Similar, yes. But when I went to get MY uniform...my BS shirt was $38 and my GS uniform was something like $120, since separate parts of the GS uniform can't be worn without the other parts, where BS uniform shirts are perfectly fine to stand alone. It's just nuts, that's all!

[scottteng]

My GS just bridged to jr having been a brownie for three years the only uniform even suggested by her troop was the vest. Now that she is a jr I got her a sash just for a change and purchased a skort combo skirt and shorts. Great garment for florida climate and outdoor activities. The sash came from GSA along with the correct insignia they are reasonable. The skort came off E-bay. I am registerd GS leader just for carpooling no uniform needed. Boy scouts is more costly I need uniform as ASM and son needs uniforms in multiples. All are available on E-bay look in the stores if you don't want to get into the bidding. I use the extra uniforming and equipment needs as birthday and Christmas ideas