Cub scout at Ordeal competition

[fleetfootedfox]

I went to a Ceremonial Team Seminar last weekend. I was surprised to see a dad came and brought his little tike, evidently Cub Scout age or younger. He allowed him to watch an Ordeal ceremony being performed for competition. Maybe he figured the kid was young enough that he won't remember much of it by the time he's 12, or maybe there was some other special circumstance I was unaware of, but I was still surprised.

[CalicoPenn]

Why would there be an Ordeal Ceremony performed for competition in the first place? The Ordeal Ceremony, like the Brotherhood Ceremony and the Vigil Honor Ceremony, should be a special and significant ceremony, one done only when candidates are being inducted into the Order of the Arrow.

 

But if competition it is, so be it. To the crux of the question, the Ordeal Ceremony, though special (despite being diluted in meaning by competition) is not secret. No, you can't just buy the Ordeal Ceremony book - however, any parent can attend and watch the ceremony, or for that matter can ask to read through the ceremony book.

 

Besides, the lad is unlikely to remember this when he is inducted - and then is unlikely to remember it after being inducted. Heck, I don't remember much of my Ordeal ceremony except for some guys I knew dressed in "regalia" spouting off some mumbo jumbo, showing me the secret handshake and whispering something in my ear that to this day I swear was "Donald Duck Wears Pants".

 

I remember less of my Brotherhood Ceremony. I do remember my Vigil Honor ceremony - but then it was a shorter ceremony.

[John-in-KC]

CP,

 

I know that lodge C-teams, being made up of young Thespians, do gather together and see who can enrich the basic ceremony the best. Certainly there's all manner of this kind of competition at NOAC. I'm not surprised there's Regional and sectional events.

 

I do think whoever the Professional or Volunteer Adviser to the event was, should have had a polite, but somewhat strong word with Cubbie's Dad.

[Nike]

But, there are no secret ceremonies or closed events in Scouting, correct? (I don't know about OA. My son won't say anything.)

 

While Dad may have breached etiquette, was what he did against the written policies and procedures of BSA or OA?

[Eagle92]

Ceremony competitions are supposed to be used as a learning tool to improve a lodge's ceremony. yes some lodges do go overboard with the competition aspects, but ideally it is supposed to be a learnign expereince to improve the cceremony, and thuse the candidate's experience.

[John-in-KC]

Nike,

 

The issue isn't Dad, it's Cubbie, for whom mystery, as a program device, should be maintained.

[Region 7 Voyageur]

Could the ceremony in question possibly been the Pre-Ordeal ceremony? That ceremony is open to all to witness.

[fleetfootedfox]

No, it was the Ordeal, but don't confuse call-out with pre-ordeal. And it depends on what you mean by open. If a huge crowd of parents and siblings followed the candidates into the woods after the call out, it would certainly be a different experience.

 

On a humorous note, when I was tapped out, it was a long walk from camp to the place where the call out took place. Then we went down the wrong path on our way back to camp plus we had another long walk to the spot for the pre-ordeal. I was so tired from all the walking, sleeping was not a problem that night. I think that is actually maybe their intent to some degree. Get the boys tuckered out so they can sleep good. I wonder how many parents would even want to be there if they knew that in advance.

[shortridge]

Just as a point of clarification... Not all lodges take candidates straight from the call-out to the pre-Ordeal ceremony.

 

In my experience, the call-out is done at summer camp or a camporee, in public, generally at a campfire. The candidates are taken a distance away from the main group, out of sight and sound, and given information. The Ordeal process takes place several months or weeks later at a separate inductions weekend.

 

I personally think it would be a great experience to integrate the call-out ceremony with the Ordeal and do the inductions process at summer camp, say. But that requires quite a bit of logistical tinkering on the part of both the lodge and the camp.

[eagle1977]

Just to take this one step further in the vein of no secret ceremonies. My son's troop will be going to an out of council camp this summer. The camp offers a "Scoutmaster Merit Badge" for completing a number of activities during the week. Another ASM is not OA but is interested in attending the Ordeal Ceremony, which is one of the items listed for the MB. Any harm in that? He was not a Scout in his youth but is very active in his sons Scouting activities.

[Eagle92]

1977,

I would not recommend it since he is active in the unit and may be selected.

1992

[eagle1977]

92,

 

I have already had to break that news to him . . . he is an eager beaver, though, we may need to tie him down that evening!

 

77

[Eagle92]

Diamond Hitch also works well on camp chairs