Lenai Lenape?

[gwd-scouter]

My older son's vigil name is translated to Happy Quiet Man. I don't remember the actual Indian name. My question is, are OA names all Lenai Lenape or are they based on the languages of tribes in your region? Just curious.

[AlFansome]

 

Ours is based on the Costanoan language of the local Ohlone tribe. All the info at http://bsa-mdsc.org/oa/info/lodgehis.php#home

 

 

[scoutldr]

It's "Lenni" Lenape. However, the tribe themselves preferred "Lenape", which means "original people". Since "Lenni" means "original", it's redundant. Since the Lenape language was originally written down by the Pennsylvania Germans of the region, most Lenape words are pronounced as they would be in German.

 

A bit of useless trivia for around the campfire...

[Gold Winger]

http://www.delawaretribeofindians.nsn.us/

[OldGreyEagle]

Hey GWD. I don't know if you knew that the Order of the Arrow was orinally founded on a Scout Reservation in the middle of the Delaware River near Philadelphia.

 

The original Native Americans of this particular area were the Lenai Lenape, thus Vigil names are supposed to be Lenai Lenape in nature. At least thats what I have been told. Then again, I live less than 50 miles from Treasure Island so the COuncil I serve is in the midst of Lenai Lenape land so it is natural all Vigil names are Lenai Lenape. Would the Vigil Honor be less if it were a Lakota name? I doubt it

[Eagle92]

For most lodges, Vigil names are in Delaware, aka Lenni Lenape. However you do have a few lodges that use local Native American languages. Chilanktakoba Lodge 397 out of SE Louisiana Council uses Choctaw.

[moxieman]

Madockawanda started out using names of stars for Vigil names. They did this through the early 1970's. Since then they use Lenni Lenape and sometimes mix a little local Abnaki (or Abenaki) into the names.

 

[shortridge]

(This message has been edited by shortridge)

[MikeS]

The names are supposed to be Lnape, but as I understand it many Lodges also use languages more local to them.

 

What you have to keep in mind though is that most "names" are contrived with very little regard for proper Lnape grammar and the meanings of words are very frequenlty 'extended'(using "horse" to mean some sort of vehicle for example). As a result, most of these "names" are totally ungrammatical and words used so out of proper context as to make them total jibberish.

 

A very frequent error I see happening is the use of adjectives with inanimate grammatical markers being used to modify nouns which are animate.

 

I can't speak for Lodges that use local languages - I have not seenmany examples but I would hope that they are also in contact with local speakers who are able to provide correct forms.

 

 

[emb021]

I don't know of any rule or policy that says Vigil names are 'supposed' to be Lenni Lenape.

 

Many are. Many aren't.

 

My lodge started using Muscogee words for Vigil names a long time back.

 

 

[MikeS]

Sorry - I should rephrase that - What I meant was that the Lenapi names usually given and ones I have seen are "supposed to be Lenape", but unfortunately because of the disregard for grammar, correct forms of the words, etc., they end up being more or less jibberish.

 

I'm all for using names with a more local flavour, but I think that I would want to check with the local Native groups, etc. for permission and guidance.

[Tokala]

Quote:

I'm all for using names with a more local flavour, but I think that I would want to check with the local Native groups, etc. for permission and guidance.

 

Now, see that just wouldn't work in my lodge. The last 10 years or so they have been using Timucua for Vigil names. The lodge takes it's name from the tribe, however, it was misspelled ad Timuquan, back in the 40s when it was originally chartered. Anyone familiar with the Timucua would realize that it's a dead language. There are no Timucua Indians left and haven't been for hundreds of years.

[MikeS]

LOL - Tokala, yeah you're right! Let me yet again rephrase (brain cramp!) - obviously if the language is still a living language check with the local Native groups, etc.

 

If a dead language is being used, such as Timucua, you kind of have a few issues - if there exists a dictionary and grammar for the language (fortunately Timucua has both available)I would strongly recommend using both to arrive at grammatically correct forms for names.

 

If neither exist - I'm kind of curious to know, for those who are using them, what is being used as a resource to base names on (or do you just not use that language and go with say Lenape)?