Need to understand OA a bit better

[Eagle309]

I just got back from my fisrt year at Boy Scout summer camp as an adult.

I attended as a Scout for 3 years but that was over 20 years ago. Our troop had no scouts tapped out since we had none elligable who were not already members. However, I did overhear from some of our first year scouts something upsetting that was going on. They were told by some older scouts that becomming an OA member involved a blood oath which of course left them never wanting membership. Our troop OA rep told them that all about the Ordeal was secret and he could not say anything. Maybe I know more than I should, but as I understand it, the ordeal basically involves sleeping outdoors alone, little food, and a day of work, all in silence. After our reps comments, I dared not tell the boys this, but just told them that any type of blood oath is against BSA policy so I was sure it could not be part of the OA. Was our rep. eing over secertive, or would it have been OK to let the boys know the basics of the ordeal as stated above?

 

My other question is can and should I, as I am soon to be Scoutmaster of a newly forming troop, seek OA membership? Would it be benficial to our troop to have an adult in the OA, or don't it matter? Would it be overwhelming for an adult to be helping in OA and in a troop?

 

[SemperParatus]

Definitely allay their fears that it involves no blood letting (sweat - yes, blood - no).

 

I think it is very beneficial for the SM to be involved with OA. Your involvement can help spur the interest of the boys in your troop and you will be in a position to promote and support the OA at the unit level, which is the primary focus of OA. In addition to the Lodge and Chapter-sponsored events, our troop offers special trips and activities just for troop OA members to assist in their understanding of the Order's meaning. We have found that this especially helps to fill the gap for younger boys that may have little interest in participating at the Lodge/Chapter level initially, because they feel uncomfortable in venturing outside their scouting unit.

 

Whether it is overwhelming will be a personal matter based on your available time and commitment to each. OA is boy-run (probably more so than most troops) and so it is pretty easy to find some way to meaningfully participate that requires a time commitment that is not inordinate. My current 'OA job' is cook at the Chapter's Ordeal (150 or so very hungry folks). It is basically one weekend a year. I would love to do more, as time allows.

[Mundo219]

I am a Scoutmaster of a relatively new troop...we are in our third year... and a rookie to the Scouter forums. For the past two years at summer camp our guys have witnessed the callout ceremony. When they have asked questions, we have answered them as best we could. This is the first year we were able to have elections, and two of our guys were elected and called out at camp.

 

When the election team came to our troop, we did our best to explain to the guys about the OA, its purpose, as well as the character of the young men they were to elect to be a part of it. We made it clear at that time that the OA is not a secret organization and we explained in very basic terms what would be involved in the Ordeal and how the Brotherhood later "sealed" a Scout's membership in the OA. We didn't go into much detail, but just enough to let the guys know what would be expected of them if and when they were elected.

 

Immediately prior to the call-out ceremony at camp I reminded the guys again about what the OA was about, that they should be happy for whoever would be called out (we didn't tell the guys who was elected). I also reminded everyone, and especially those who were eligible but were not elected, that the OA is about service. Everyone, if they meet the basic requirements can be eligible, but it is only by being recognized by their fellow Scouts as being a competent camper, a leader and a servant, can they be elected.

 

The call out ceremony was a great experience for our troop at camp (and all the parents who attended). After the ceremony we were able to answer even more questions some of the guys had.

 

The mystery of the ceremonies and the symbolism of the OA should never--by anyone--be used to scare younger Scouts or to develop some kind of "hierarchy" or class mentality in the troop ("we're in and you're not!"). That undercuts the values and character that the OA stands for.

[stlscouter]

I hope your experience at camp other than this incident was enjoyable.

 

OA has changed over the last 30 years or so -we no longer "tap" boys out- we call them out-some say not an improvement-others are more impressed with the resourcefulness that the boys have come up with to do the ceremony

second-G2SS scouting has enumerated the policy about harrassment and any talk about blood oaths would be covered under that policy. The silence issue is slowly making a change in some places and an encourgement of cheerful work (read laughing, singing etc)is making inroads.

thirdly-the emphasis in the OA has shifted somewhat from the "Brotherhood of Honored Campers" to an "Honor Society" but keeping and expanding the idea of Cheerful Service.

fouthly, the OA in general has become more open and less "secretive" and only the ceremonies are closed to non-members (not secret) and even that is not always observed. (The PLC is closed to regular troop members but not secret nor or they invited).

 

Yes, Yes and Yes you should allow yourself to be voted into the OA-there is always a need for adults if for no other reason than to drive the youth members to a function where great scouting takes place.

 

PS we don't do branding any more either-but I do know of one father and his two sons, after recieving their Vigils, get matching vigil tatoos.(This message has been edited by stlscouter)

[Proud Eagle]

As a current Lodge Advisor let me share my thoughts on this matter.

 

First and foremost there is no "blood oath" in OA. In fact there is no "oath" at all. The only Oath for the OA is the same as for everyone else in Scouting, the Scout Oath.

 

On the other hand the Freemasons do, so rumors have it, take a blood oath. Since OA borrowed a few things from the Masons, I suppose it would be possible to think that was one of the things, but it most certainly is not.

 

Next, as to what you should or should not say about the Ordeal, I would suggest keeping it a mystery. Mystery is one of the methods that supports the Ordeal. There are NO SECRETS. My advice is use a need to know system. If a parents requires information before letting their son go through that is one thing. If a Scout just wants to know because he doesn't have the patience to wait that is another. I always make sure to tell a Scout what they will need to take to the Ordeal and what to do before going to prepare. I don't tell them why. That isn't my place. It will all be revealed in good time.

 

Finally, the issue of a Scoutmaster being in OA. The Scoutmaster is the most critical adult in a troop as far as the boys and the program go. Therefore if OA is going to be a success for the Scouts in the troop the Scoutmaster must be supportive of OA. To be able to offer the right kind of support the SM should be a member. The first adult to be nominated from a new unit should normally be the SM. Obviously there are exceptions to that rule, but that is what I believe should be the norm.

[wojauwe]

The OA is scouting,even the ceremonies are scouting.Nothing that violates any scout rules or the scout law and oath takes place in the OA.The OA strives to exemplify these principles.So no blood letting.If a parent was concerned about their son going through a ceremony,the ceremony will not be kept secret from them.Our desire to preserve the mystery is superceeded by this concern the parent has for their son's safety.

[KoreaScouter]

As a SM, you should be familiar with every aspect of your unit program, and OA's a part of that. You'll have to go through your ordeal just like any candidate, but by doing so, you'll better understand and appreciate what the boys are experiencing, too. Plus, if you're an Arrowman yourself, you'll have an Arrowman's perspective regarding which of your Scouts are eligible for election.

 

Don't worry about the Lodge levying some expectation that you take on another full-time volunteer job within OA once you complete your Ordeal. As a unit-level Scouter, especially an SM, the primary expectation of you by OA is that you promote OA within the unit, and challenge Arrowmen and make sure they have opportunities for service.

 

By all means, help to maintain and keep the mystery. It helps make the whole experience more special and meaningful for the boys. I compare it to standing in line to buy a ticket to see a new movie, and somebody comes out and tells you the ending before you go inside. The experience is better if you don't know beforehand.

 

KS

[Lynda J]

Kevin was tapped out at our Mountain Man Camporee this past spring. And they actually tapped them out. The OA advisor came to us and gave the adults each a hat. And for each member being tapped out there was an adult. Of course the boys didn't know they were being tapped. It was beautiful. THe best part was when our SM was tapped out just after his son had been. I wish I had a picture of his face when the OA member walked up behind him and put his hands on his shoulders and said "You scout, come with me now"

I have seen the calls outs and they simply aren't as impressive as the tap out was.

 

 

[wojauwe]

Lynda J, that would be awesome,that special personal touch is something lost to my chapter we had 145 candidates to call out at camporee and got complaints about it takeing too long when the names were read off as fast as possible.We only have tap out for Vigil.

[scoutldr]

Any Scouting function is open to any parent who wants to observe.

[John-in-KC]

What KS said is very true: A Scoutmaster's first and foremost mission is to his Troop.

 

There are plenty of Scouters in any District/Council who are willing to provide guidance to the Chapter and the Lodge.

 

The other operational advantage is the mean/median and mode age of the Order is generally older than the typical Troop. Young men are willing to take on increased responsibility and authority.

 

That's a good thing

[stlscouter]

Years ago when I was a summer camp staffer the OA ceremony involved running the "line" and with a cupped hand "tap" fairly forcefully in the middle of the chest so as to force the candidate back into the waiting arms of Arrowmen. The call out still involves running the line but the Arrowman stops, points and yells "You have been chosen"

 

Lyda J

I am interested as to how a tap out could be held a a camporee and how do you handle the election and insure that the boy will be there to be tapped out?

 

Incidentally, our Council has 2 OA lodges and one has an OA winter banquet dinner(700-800 Arrowmen) is where our Vigil Candidates are called out. Our other lodge calls out their Vigil candidates at their Fall reunion at their Saturday BBQ dinner by letter.

 

 

[Greying Beaver]

for Stlscouter: Being able to have call-out/tap-out at camporee is a matter of timing. Our election season runs from November through February. We are in a huge Lodge and Chapter. Our election teams are kept pretty busy with unit elections. Troops meet every night of the week. The election team members usually juniors or seniors in high school and they want to focus on their studies for the rest of the school year. We made February 28 as the drop dead date for unit elections and got the District Executive and Lodge Advisor to back us up. Boy, did we have some steamed SM's, TCC's, and not a few parents that year. Funny thing: Guess which troops aren't represented at Roundtable?

 

Anyway, our district camporee is held in mid- March which gives the chapter advisor time to get the election forms to the Lodge and hold the call-out at camporee. The only problem is that the adults nominated are not approved until April, so they cannot be recognized at call-out. They need to be recognized as well.

[stlscouter]

Our Council had our Fall reunion for one of our Lodges last weekend and the lodge had almost 1200 Ordeal candidates. the Lodge nears 8,000 members. One of the districts had over 250 alone. I'm try ing to imagine how our 15 or so districts could do call outs at a camporee. And about the number of Vigil numbers-25 total last year-adults and youth.

[VCservice559]

Lynda J, I think that you should learn a little bit more about a tapout ceremony. They are not allowed anymore because they were very violent and painful. There were many ways to do them. I have witnessed one that the people being "tapped" out were basically tackled and then taken near a fire. My scoutmaster tells me that when he was a child the chief would slam his hand onto your shoulder and almost dislocate it. They are NOT allowed anymore, but people still do them.

Also, this may not sound very scoutlike, but what is with all this no secrets crap. I believe that OA should be kept secret from all youth, and all parents involved in scouting. The youth should go in expecting nothing, and be completely amazed by what happens. That is how it happened to me and i loved it. Also, the OA is a mostly secret society. Why do you think that you have to reach new ranks to learn more. I am brotherhood and i know that i have barely scraped the surface of what there is to know. I believe that non-members should know nothing except that OA is fun, mysterious, an a brotherhood of cheerful service.