election - 12yr old first years

[BoyScoutSam]

i agree with Lynda J. the older you get the more distractions you have. the younger guys can more easily catch the spirit of the order and have less other things going on. the guys without distractions are a huge asset to the lodge.

[eaglescout2004]

If i am not mistaken, Eagle at 11 is IMPOSSIBLE! The earliest you can enter scouting is at 10 (if you have your arrow of Light). You have to earn first class, which even the best scouts do in a 12 month period. After that you need to be first class for 4mo., star for 6mo. and then life for another 6mo. The youngest age is around 12.5 or 13!

 

No offense, but i don't think that it was intended for kids this age to achieve the high rank. I know many people will disagree w/ me, but i will stand by my position that if you have eagle by 11 or 12 (or even 13) you have spent too much time on advancement and not enough on learing other skills, enjoying the activities, and other aspects scouting has to offer.

[NWScouter]

Talking theory here:

 

If you join Scouts at age ten. Now to reach First Class the only requirement having any time associated is the Tenderfoot physical fitness and thats 30 days. So if you could do that and get 10 outings, three of which were overnights in month, you could be First Class. Now another four months for Star, then six for Life and finally six months for Eagle. Now that figures out to be 11 years five months old to be an Eagle.

 

[eaglescout2004]

I stand corrected, my math was off. Theororetically (sp), one can become eagle @ 11. I still think that more time should be spent doing non-requirement activities and activities outside scouting.

[BoyScoutSam]

it wouldnt have happened had my dad not been so supportive of me. i let him know i had that goal and he made it possible. he was the newscout leader at the time, and was the newscout district chairman as well. he had held the meetings for the newscouts in the troop in my livingroom for 4 years prior, and i had sat in. i even began teaching due to his lack of assistant. that happened by about the time i turned 9.

 

I still was able to catch the meaning of my rank, and the spirit of scouting. i think the most important thing for someone whos trying to earn something (especially as important and prestigious as the eagle) at a reletively young age is to commit not to stop there.

 

around here it is the common myth that once you have your eagle you are done with scouting. as a result the varsity and venturing programs are lacking. if someone isnt going to remain in scouting through the time they are able, they should wait and not get this award young. my reasoning was that if i had the eagle "out of the way" then i could fully devote my scouting self to other things (the order and scout camp) my brothers were both so busy in the order, and working on camp staff that they almost didnt get their eagle scout. they got it at 16 and 17.

 

this was my way of fixing that problem so that i could be dedicated to workin in the order and things have worked out great. the important thing is not to stop. eagle palms are important too. no one around here even knows what those are anymore. its really kinda sad.

[VAordeal]

no offense to you sam but 11 is way to young for eagle. Scouting is about taking the time to enjoy what you are doing. You just cant convince me that you enjoyed doing all that merit badge work or all the hours of service required. I hate to say this but i believe you are what could be a called a "paper" eagle. I am 14 and will reach Life over the summer. I have taken my time and have no doubt that i will make eagle at 15 or 16. But 11!? I do not doubt that you are an excellent scout, dont get me wrong. As you are a lodge chief i have the utmost respect for you. Well congrats on being an Eagle Scout!

 

D.B.

Amangamek Wipit 470

WWW

[BoyScoutSam]

i dont think im a "paper" eagle. i guess i just dont like to bother waiting around when i could get going and move on to other things. thats just the way i work. when i got my eagle i was also a brotherhood member of the order, and a freshman in highschool.

 

i dont recommend getting it young, especially that young. but different strokes for different folks. i'm the kind of person who sets goals and gets done what i can. waiting around can be a waste of time and cause people to get bored and not follow through. i knew i'd get busy with other things and didnt want to risk not getting it like my brothers had both almost done. so i dedicated most of my time for a year and a half working on rank advancement and am glad i did. i went to every merit badge powwow the council and my district offered, worked hard, and learned a lot. about scouting, about the things the merit badges were teaching, and also about life, and about "doing your best" (as the cub scout program so greatly stresses) right now i dont have time to spend on merit badges like i used to. i havnt gotten an eagle palm in almost a year. or a merit badge since october.

 

and to set the record straight i was almost 12. my board of review was 2 days before my birthday. so its not AS extreme. lol.

 

the NYLT (national youth leadership training) program the national BSA piloted in my council last year talks about goals. i was staff for this and memorized the standard they thing goals should have. they say goals should be SMART goals. (Spacific, Measurable, Attainable, Relevent, and Timely)

 

the goal of eagle at that age was my biggest one at that time. and probably the biggest one so far. i set a time that was attainable, and i caught the spirit of scouting. thats the purpose of the eagle. to grow as a person, to make goals and achieve them, to work and sweat, to become a leader, with values with ethics and values as your guide.

 

i think if you set a goal, and follow through. be it eagle at 11, or eagle at 17 and a half, you arent a "paper" eagle, you've learned the things that Baden Powell wanted you to learn, and became the person that everyone since has strived to become. thats what the eagle scout is. thats what its all about. goals as extreme as this are what pushes us to our highest limits, the individuals envolved, and the scouting program. no one goes higher than the eagle.

 

wow that got long

 

WWW

[eaglescout2004]

You were a HS freshman at 12?

You had your eagle at 11?

You are lodge chief at 14, after being chapter chief for the past two years?

 

Sorry, and no offense, but I really find it hard to believe all this...

[SemperParatus]

BSS,

 

Please explain...if you were smart enough to skip two grade levels in school, how come you don't know the rules of capitalization?

[wWw_Dan]

At all the Lodge Events I go to, the young people (12-13) there are very cool/helpful/intelligent and so on. However, at Ordeals some of the inductees are horrid. But, usually they are the kind of people that just grab the sash and leave anyway.

 

Just my experience on young OA members.

[Nutiket]

I was elected to the Order of the Arrow at age 11, completed my Ordeal at age 12, then became a Brotherhood member at age 13. Now I am 13 and just finished Eagle, and you can not possibly say that I did not earn it. I am the farthest thing from a "paper eagle". Yes it is rare, but you will occasionaly see that special Scout who will shock everyone with what they accomplish at their age. Our lodge (Waupecan Lodge 197) is completely run by 13-17 year olds and it is actually pretty neat, because everyone gives 120% every time they do something. I believe that the young Scouts will start to take over, because they are the ones who believe and have the drive within themselves to make these things happen. Scouting is rapidly changing and there are people who do not believe in this change, but this is what will become of Scouting as a whole.

 

WWW

Nutiket

 

[sst3rd]

Nutiket,

 

I don't doubt your Scouting Spirit. I actually am one of those old Scouters. Here's my problem, and I could use your specific assistance. I'm the SM, and our Troop has an OA Election every August, with a Call-Out Ceremony at our August trip. Very traditional all around, and our Scouts look forward to it right after a great summer camp. Those Scouts now elligible, are all 12 years old. They've been in the Troop about a year and a half, and have two summer camps under their belts. I've never approved OA Election candidates this young before, and our Lodge is pressuring the Council Scoutmasters to keep the "Scoutmaster's Approval" requirement at a very high level. Our Lodge is tired of young Scouts being elected, taking their Ordeal, and never hearing from them again. I do fault the Scoutmasters for not preparing possible OA candidates for their OA Election. I interview all Scouts meeting the election requirements, and discuss the obligation that they will make if they are elected into the OA. Our Lodge wants us to screen these candidates strictly.

Anyway, if I don't "give" a little, our Troop simply can't have an OA Election this year. These Scouts are Spirited, smart, dedicated, and enthusiastic. However, they are immature in the way they act. But hey, they're just 12 years old. So, do I allow the election, or wait until next year?

 

WWW

sst3rd

[wojauwe]

sst3rd,

 

It is up to you to choose who you feel shows scout spirit and has the potential and desire to fullfill their duties as scouts and arrowmen.I'm the chapter advisor for a chapter that elected 145 candidates this year and so far we've had 55 inducted.We have one more ordeal coming in October with 377 uninducted candidates in the lodge.

We've put so much emphasis on makeing sure that units are aware that they can select all eligable

scouts,that most troops elect all eligable members.

Consequently our numbers are inflated.

I'm trying to get scoutmasters to be a little more selective with scoutmasters aproval.

At a minimum I like to see them only offer up candidates who want to enter the OA and will attend an ordeal.

At the least we will get a years lodge dues and a days work at our camps.

I don't think it's right to use age as a criteria.

If they have the heart and the will to take on the challenge,the maturity will come later.I would rather see a young enthusiastic arrowman who will grow into maturity and leadership than a more mature scout who is so busy that we only get 1% of his focus,as my chapter chief.

It is good to educate troop on the responsibility of being an arrowman,before you interview them about their desire to enter the OA.Pick good scouts who have a desire to become better scouts.

What happened with our chapter was that many of our larger troops put up every first class scout and made ballots that contained a box that said "all of the above" consequentially 35 boys elected in one troop of who 12 have attended one of our 5 Spring ordeals.

Find a middle ground between that and only aproving the super mature scout.

Yours in Brotherhood,

Quilawelensitchewagan Wojauwe

[wojauwe]

sst3rd,

 

It is up to you to choose who you feel shows scout spirit and has the potential and desire to fullfill their duties as scouts and arrowmen.I'm the chapter advisor for a chapter that elected 145 candidates this year and so far we've had 55 inducted.We have one more ordeal coming in October with 377 uninducted candidates in the lodge.

We've put so much emphasis on makeing sure that units are aware that they can select all eligable

scouts,that most troops elect all eligable members.

Consequently our numbers are inflated.

I'm trying to get scoutmasters to be a little more selective with scoutmasters aproval.

At a minimum I like to see them only offer up candidates who want to enter the OA and will attend an ordeal.

At the least we will get a years lodge dues and a days work at our camps.

I don't think it's right to use age as a criteria.

If they have the heart and the will to take on the challenge,the maturity will come later.I would rather see a young enthusiastic arrowman who will grow into maturity and leadership than a more mature scout who is so busy that we only get 1% of his focus,as my chapter chief.

It is good to educate troop on the responsibility of being an arrowman,before you interview them about their desire to enter the OA.Pick good scouts who have a desire to become better scouts.

What happened with our chapter was that many of our larger troops put up every first class scout and made ballots that contained a box that said "all of the above" consequentially 35 boys elected in one troop of who 12 have attended one of our 5 Spring ordeals.

Find a middle ground between that and only aproving the super mature scout.

Yours in Brotherhood,

Quilawelensitchewagan Wojauwe

[wojauwe]

sst3rd,

 

On another point.Your lodge's pressure to be more restrictive,probably would not be something that National would be real enthused about.The focus has been put on numbers in the proffesional ranks.

This is something that I've had philosphical problems with for a while.I've become concerned that the OA has become less special with the more liberal selection process.I've finnally come to terms with the fact that there will be a lot more people wearing flaps than there will be active members.

In fairness there are boys who would not of passed a stringent aproval process who have, when given the opportunity stepped up and become fine arrowmen.

If their scoutmaster would of been too pickey we would of missed out on a great asset to the order.

It's not always easy to see the potential.I've been pleasently surprised a few times after what at first seemed to have been a poor election result.

 

YiB,

wojauwe