Fund Raising Question

[KoreaScouter]

It happened to be in Virginia, too...

 

KS

[shemgren]

The fundraising method that the BSA expects units to follow is that the unit gain their funds by vaule given activities, such as breakfasts, dinners, popcorn, candy sales, etc. not direct solicilation of funds. See the back of the Unit Money Earning Application, the Scoutmaster's Handbook, the Cub Scout Leader Handbook.

 

BSA units are not non profit groups as defined by the IRS because they are owned by a CO, which may or may not be a non profit organization and gifts given to units are not tax deductable gifts.

 

BSA councils are non profit organizations as defined by IRS code 501©3, therefore gifts to them are tax deductable gifts and the councils gain a good portion of their income by direct donations, such as the United Way, the Friends Of Scouting program, endowments, grants, etc.

 

One of the hallmarks of the moral code of the BSA is that the Scouts are taught that they need pay for things they do. We do this through the paying dues to the unit, direct payments of costs by the Scout or his parent(s) and the units providing fundraising opportunities for the Scouts to raise the funds needed to do the activities they plan to do or purchase the equipment needed.

 

On occassion, units do recieve direct donations, but according to BSA rules and regulations,they are not to solictate these donations directly, as laid out in Article XI, section I, clause 2, which reads in part, "Adult members and youth members shall not be permitted to serve as solicitors of money in support of personal or unit particiaption in local, national or international events."

[silver-shark]

Several of the responses here list solicitation of monetary donations as a no no. Our troop has asked businesses for food donations in the past, specifically for a spaghetti dinner that we held. The parents and boys cooked the food and bussed the tables, etc... We ended up making 100% profit on the event due to these food donations. Did we break a rule here, or is this O K since we still performed all of the work?

[ASM514]

I think we have found a way to make it work. You know this has taken some months to figure out which put us way behind in our efforts, but now I am sure we have it set. Our Co is working on a plan to set up a non-profit youth organization and raffle off the computers. The proceed will be distributed to local athletic groups and of course, our scouting units. Also, they want to sell these systems to other non-profits complete with raffle tickets for thier organizations. This would include volunteer fire companies, church groups, and just about any other group. Our CO would also donate those profits to our units. Does this sound like a plan to make this work? Sounds like making money off of a raffle without running a raffle, but many raffles without participating in any of them.

 

ASM514

[packsaddle]

Yep, In that case BSA would be baffled by the raffle and perhaps a trifle stifled.

[Bob White]

Just be sure that the troop and the BSA are not mentioned in the advertising, promotion or sale of the raffle tickets. That would be a violation of the fundraising policies.

 

Bob White

[evmori]

Bob,

What a great way to side step the policy! And when someone asks the Troop where the funds came from that bought the new tents what are you going to tell them?

 

If the Scouts participate in the selling of the tickets & receive a portion of the income from those tickets it make no difference what the ticket says or how it is promoted. It is a violation of the fundraising policy!

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Bob White]

No Ed,

 

The BSA does not prohibit the Chartered Organization from using raffles. If an individual sells raffles for the charter organization and the organization gives the money to it's youth organization(s) then the BSA has no problem with that. What you cannot do is imply that the BSA is supporting the raffle.

 

The BSA does not prohibit you as an individual from selling raffle tickets. It prohibits scout units, and scout members from using the name and images of scouting when selling raffle tickets. There is a big difference.

 

By the way when someone asks where the money came from you tell them the truth "it was given to us by the Charter Organization."

 

Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[evmori]

Don't know, Bob. I have to question this one. It seems like ill gotten fruits to me. I would stay away from it & find another way to raise the funds. There are many other fundraisers a unit can do.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Bob White]

And there are many other fundraisers that a charter organizations and any other organization can do, none of which are controlled by the BSA, UNLESS whoever is raising the money represents themselves as raising the money using the trade mark emblems of the BSA.

 

I have sold raffle tickets for my son's school without wearing my scout uniform and the fact that I am a scouter is not relevant to the fundraising. Other non-scouters took part in the fund raiser as well. The raffle was just part of the over all event non of which had anything to do with scouts but had scouts and scouters involed as members of the school.

 

The PTO that sponsored the event gave some funds that year to the pack. was that money raised in the raffle? Maybe, but who can tell it all went into one pot. was it raised using scouting's name or emblems? No, did scouting care the event took place? No. Should we have refused the money from our charter organization? Of course not.

 

Bob White

[packsaddle]

Ed, what BW says IS consistent with BSA's "don't ask, don't tell" approach to other issues. See the similarity?

[Bob White]

Not at all packsaddle. This is a matter of trademark protection that's all. If you worked for Ford Motor Company you could not go out in Ford apparel saying you were raising money as a Ford employee for a Ford project unless you had Ford's permission.

 

Being a member of the BSA does not give you the authority to use the image and symbols of the BSA any old way you please.

 

The BSA has no authority over other organizations. If the local Moose lodge holds a dance-a-thon and afterwards gives some the proceeds to a local scout unit that's fine. The fact that a scout unit cannot do one bar the Moose from doing so. Nor does it make their donation tainted in any way.

 

The BSA is just protecting their image and property by limiting how it can be used in public. This extends well beyond the financial field. You cannot for instance wear the uniform while campaigning for a specific candidate running for office or a specific politaical party. To do so would suggest that the BSA endorses that candidate. You can however wear the uniform if passing out flyers urging citizens to exercise they obligation to vote in an election.

 

This is not anything like don't ask don't tell. This is "You don't own it, so you can't use it anyway you want to."

 

 

Bob White

 

[evmori]

So Bob if a Troop is offered funds they know are from an illegal activity they shoudl accept them?

 

Now I know you are going to say these aren't the same but technically they are. One is an illegal BSA fundraising activity and the other is just illegal!

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[silver-shark]

Gentlemen

 

BSA has stood up and said that, gambling, of any type is inconsistent with the Aims and Methods of Scouting, whether it is legal or not in the area that it is done, and is therefore unacceptable.

 

Accepting money from an activity that is inconsistant with OUR ideals is inappropriate whether the deed is done by the unit or someone else.

 

This is no different than accepting a donation from the Drug Lord of a country where drugs are legal.

 

Right is right, wrong is wrong, and gambling is a vice that is justly illegal in most areas whether we like it or not.

 

Gambling is quite different than endorcing a political candidate. BSA is not saying that politics or elections are unacceptable, but merely that taking sides in such an event could be controvercial, thus possibly causing hard feelings and damaging the integrity of the BSA.

 

All in all, I don't think this is an issue of "image", but of the ethical values we are trying to instill.

[Bob White]

Whoa! Not all activities that the BSA restricts troops from using are illegal. Raffles in some states are a legal activities. The BSA does not say that raffles are inappropriate activities for others, just that the BSA does not want them used by troops in scouting's name. That does not make them illegal. Legality is determined by state and local laws not the BSA.

 

A troop cannot sponsor a BINGO game, But several churches that sponsor scout groups use Bingo as a fund raiser. If that church gives money to the troop how in the world you you be able to determine which fundraiser that money came from and why would it matter? If you knew your neighbor went to Vegas to gamble once a year would you refuse to sell him popcorn because that money may have come from gambling?

 

The BSA does not have the authority or the interest to tell others how to raise or spend money. Their only interest in this area is controlling how the image and name of the BSA is used for fundraising.

 

In Upstate NY scouts in uniform pick up litter and soda cans at Saratoga Race Track, the oldest thouroughbred horse track in the country and a mainstay of the community as well as a National Historic Site. In return the track pays the various scout groups based on the amount of trash collected. Guess where the track gets that money? From thousands of people gambling. How many of you live in states that subsidize the education budget with money raised in the State Lottery. Ill gotten gains you say? Tainted by gambling is it? Then give it back and pay more in property taxes instead. Let's not be so quick to say all gambling is illegal, it's not. Whether it is moral is a personal decision. The BSA only says thet troops cannot gamble (among other activities) to raise money, not that gambling is illegal.

 

Bob White