Sentinel947 Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 As an Eagle, I applaud them for their courage. But while agreeing with their stance, I personally would not send my badge back. Especially with the little impact it will have on their decision. It seems to me an idealistic but pointless gesture. I feel the media has gotten all over this and tries to demonize the Eagles that haven't sent theirs back yet. I realized early on in this that if I quit every group that I am in that I have political disagreements with, I wouldn't have a church, country, family or friends. Just my take. What is yours? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJCubScouter Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I agree that it is a pointless and useless gesture. If I had an Eagle badge, I think my attitude would be, it's mine and you're not getting it back. I suppose I could send in my Life patch, but that would be even more pointless and useless. And I'd have to take it off my old uniform, where it has been firmly attached for approximately 39 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMT224 Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 "Werfen Sie nicht das Kind mit dem Bade ausschtten" -- Thomas Murner, 1512 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattlePioneer Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I'd be inclined to send them a letter regretting their decision, but noting that records of their obtaining Eagle have permanently expunged. While "Once and Eagle, always an Eagle" is the norm, I think you have to respect a decision made on principle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSA24 Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Not many politicians get their way by stomping out of the capitol angry never to return. As Eagle Scouts, they should know that. They should also have learned how to manage a long-term project. If they want change, they need to become the leaders who make the changes, not leave. That's why when people say they disagree with the policy I encourage them to join. Join us, change us! (This message has been edited by BSA24) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callooh! Callay!1428010939 Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 "applaud them for their courage" Courage? Courage to face what risk? The risk of being heroes and darlings of supporters of the cause for which they renounced Eagle? The risk of free publicity? The risk of leaving BSA at around the point at which a great many boys leave anyway? The risk of parading their ostensibly superior morality before friendly audiences? The risk that when, as the OP suggests, the media tries to "tries to demonize the Eagles that haven't sent theirs back yet" that they will stand out as squeaky clean because they did send theirs back? Is there risk that a University admissions board might hold Eagle renunciation against them, or is this something they'll highlight in their admissions essay, knowing that it'll count in their favor? At some point in the distant past it would have been courageous. But today quietly and without fanfare would be the appropriate way to signal one's change of heart. Making a public spectacle of one's self as an Eagle-martyr today is courageous in the same way that Al Sharpton's defense of civil rights is heroic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwazse Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 There's nothing to say it won't have an impact, but I think a public commitment on their part to serve other youth organizations that require parents to support homosexuals as potential leaders over their youth would be more productive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertrat77 Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Sum effect of Eagle badge turn in: zero. Sure, a staffer at National will have to accept the medal, patch, certificate, whathaveyou...probably log the items and circumstances in a database, then file the items in a '60s-era metal creaky six-drawer cabinet with the other Eagle stuff returned over the years. I'd log that job out at 20 mins, give or take 5, if someone stops by the cubical to chat. Maybe add ten if there is a surprise birthday cake in the break room. The former Eagles will have their moment on TV. Any other value is entirely self-perceived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeBob Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 "a public commitment on their part to serve other youth organizations that require parents to support homosexuals as potential leaders over their youth" I'm not normally a gay-basher. I frankly don't care. But I was wondering how many folks on the forum found the above position to be highly bland? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosetracker Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 At some point in the distant past it would have been courageous. But today quietly and without fanfare would be the appropriate way to signal one's change of heart. Huh?.. What change of heart? People don't accept Eagle because the dislike homosexuality. BSA did not discriminate until the 1991 with an internal document and did not make it public until 1992.. Still the discrimination policy was not well known until probably the past 5 years.. Some kids still may earn the Eagle clueless of this policy and if known be shocked and not agree with it.. So I doubt many who returned the badge did so because they had a change of heart.. Though some may have evolved, as acceptance has been going up quickly over the past few years. Still, I doubt they got their Eagle, knowing they were doing so because their values of disliking homosexuals was in tune with BSA. I also think it is not going to change BSA's position.. Better to stay associated to the organzation and make it publically known that BSA is full of it to try to pretend all parents are in unity on this issue.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callooh! Callay!1428010939 Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 "Huh?.. What change of heart? People don't accept Eagle because the dislike homosexuality." What change of heart? Um.... how about the change from accepting Eagle to not accepting it? Let's not confuse tangents with foci. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZMike Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 The whole thing reminds me of the young John Kerry throwing his Navy medals on the front steps of the capital to show his hatred of the military. A few decades later, he was trumpeting his military service when it became politically expedient to do so. (He also displayed those medals he supposedly threw away, so who knows if he really disposed of them.) I would agree that if someone renounces their status as an Eagle Scout, their names should be removed from the rolls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bando Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 With my medal, I take the position that the BSA can't take it away, nor do I think I have the right to return it. I applaud the stand these fellow Eagles are taking, but it's not the way I will voice my opposition. I will work for the necessary reversal of this policy from within the BSA, with my Eagle medal pinned above the Eagle knot on my uniform shirt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 My point when it was suggested was that we have a lot of anonymous people on the internet whining. I Challenged BSA24 to stand up at his sacred roundtable and in front of his Scouting Friends open a dialog regarding his support of gay membership...... I doubt anyone on this forum has the guts to do it. I read what moose and seattle are spewing, So what do you think the folks would say at roundtable???? Unit level, how many have had a heart to heart with your COR, He has voting power at the council level right?????? A district or too of COR could beginning the change.... Or would he throw you out for such talk... So how many of you have written a letter signed your real name and dropped it in the mail to national????? Did you sign the online petition??? How valuable is that???? Not very I am told. I get tired of all the whining about it.......... It is put up or shut up time folks...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bando Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 I stood up in front of over a hundred people at my Eagle COH, some six months or so after the SCOTUS Dale decision, and clearly voiced my opposition to the LGBTQ membership policy. Didn't make too many friends on that one, and I didn't care. It was the correct position then when I was 16, and it's still the correct position today. As a currently registered adult, I'm open with anyone who asks that I oppose the policy. People who know me know my position on the issue, and I make no attempt to hide it. While the policy does not affect my membership status, it negatively affects the strength of this organization in its ability to help young people be the kinds of well-rounded, well-adjusted, and worldly leaders our society needs. It's a manufactured, adult issue negatively impacting the BSA's influence in the lives of today's young people, and I have a huge problem with that. It's not the easiest thing sometimes, but clearly stating an opposing view to an institutional policy seldom is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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