Honorary president of the BSA comes out in favor of gay marriage

[bacchus]

Calico, "In other words, you got [sic] nothing, you got [sic] nada, to support your contention. If I were you, I'd sue your school teachers for not teaching you the skills needed to prevent you from embarassing yourself in public like this."

 

George W. Bush and his father both appeared at jamborees. That's more than "got" nada.

[NJCubScouter]

Does anybody really determine their vote based on who did or didn't personally attend a Jamboree?

 

I never saw the President's speech that was shown at the last Jamboree. Did he say nice, supportive things about the Boy Scouts?

[bacchus]

I would really love to see you guys at camp and sit around the fire talking about this stuff. For one thing it would tone everybody down a bit, but also we could discuss these things reasonably.

 

Although I doubt there would be many people saying, "I know Obama has us $50,000 per person in the hole with this national debt thing, let's let him string us along a little farther," or "I don't mind not having a job as long as it's for the good of the country."

 

Just joking there, but it would actually be kind of cool to meet you guys and find out what makes everybody tick.

[Oak Tree]

Did he say nice, supportive things about the Boy Scouts?

 

Yes.

 

I can't point to anything the President has said that's negative about the Boy Scouts. I was at the jamboree and I'm glad we didn't have the security nightmare.

 

I suspect, though, that his position on gay marriage and gay rights in general puts him strongly at odds with the national BSA policy. At some point I wouldn't be surprised if he were to decide that he can't continue to be the honorary president of the organization. I don't think the BSA is going to kick him out, and I don't think he'd do anything prior to the election, but if he's elected for a second term, I wouldn't be shocked if he decided to step down as honorary president.

[NJCubScouter]

I don't think the BSA is going to kick him out, and I don't think he'd do anything prior to the election, but if he's elected for a second term, I wouldn't be shocked if he decided to step down as honorary president.

 

I have insufficient information to make a prediction either way, so I guess my response would be that I would not be "shocked" either way. But since your speculation involves a second term for the President, given the other choices I am willing to do what it takes to find out.

[John-in-KC]

There is a particular National Chartered Partner of the BSA.

 

That Partner has more units under Charter by a factor of 4:1 than any other Chartered Partner in the Nation.

 

When they change their point of view on this issue, BSA might, might mind you, have room to change.

 

Until they change though, the existing position won't change.

 

So, Merlyn, there's the person you have to influence: The President and the legislative body of BSA's single largest chartered partner.

 

Otherwise, we're pole vaulting over a mouse turd.

[Fehler]

Will this disqualify President Obama for receiving the Silver Buffalo?

[Engineer61]

"Engineer61, I think that a meeting of your group #3 could probably be held in a phone booth -- and you can't even find a phone booth anymore."

 

"Anyone who is not voting for Romney specifically because he is LDS is not likely to be voting for Obama either. They are much more likely either stay home on election to to vote for some third-party fringe candidate."

 

"I suspect, however, that most of those who are prejudiced against LDS'ers will probably put that issue aside for the moment and vote for Romney anyway. "

 

I suspect it's a bigger issue that you think....especially in the South and the Midwest.

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

John-in-KC writes:

So, Merlyn, there's the person you have to influence: The President and the legislative body of BSA's single largest chartered partner.

 

No, I helped get rid of the BSA's single largest chartered partner years ago, because they couldn't legally charter BSA units. I just like pointing out irony, like how some of the Jamboree subcamps were named after atheists, and now, how the honorary BSA president is in favor of gay marriage.

[bacchus]

John, "I suspect it's a bigger issue that you think....especially in the South and the Midwest."

 

They call that the ABR (anyone but Romney) vote. Actually they already came around; they had their choice to vote ABR during the primary to get it out of their system. With the good president trying to distract from the economy and make this a social issues campaign (such as this very thread) the republicans are getting behind Romney. The most recent fallout from the SSM announcement was a 8% lead in the polls for Romney.

[John-in-KC]

Merlyn: Do you want to use one of your lifelines, or is that your final answer?

[NJCubScouter]

So John, does that mean the BSA motto should be changed to "Might makes right?" Or maybe "My way or the highway?" That's what it sounds like. I suppose that either one would be more in keeping with the current political climate than "Be prepared." Of course, I always thought the BSA was supposed to be a youth organization rather than a political organization.

[Beavah]

Nah, NJCubScouter, "might makes right" refers to an effort to force a position on da majority. What we're talkin' here is that a majority of da representatives that vote on da national policy hold a particular point of view. This is nuthin' other than a statement that in a democratic organization, the decision goes to da majority.

 

Merlyn, in gettin' charters moved from public schools to churches, guaranteed that the BSA would maintain its current policy. That's what we call "poor strategy." Or, if yeh prefer, "my way or the highway" reasoning. If instead those same chartered partners worked for change from within, spreadin' their version of Scouting to all da public schools in the land who agreed with 'em, they could have forced a change on the BSA quite easily.

 

Merlyn counts it as a win, but actually it was a win for us Christians who are generally supportive of da policy.

 

Beavah

 

[packsaddle]

"..."might makes right" refers to an effort to force a position on da majority."

Huh? I'm astonished.

Sheriff Joe Clark understood that phrase to mean something quite different and his might was aimed at a MINORITY...who ALSO understands that phrase to mean something quite different.

And there are plenty more Joe Clarks out there who still see things the same way. To them it means that if they have the 'might' pretty much everything else is irrelevant. And that 'might' is handed TO them BY the majority and almost exclusively applied to a minority.

 

Edit: "If instead those same chartered partners worked for change from within, spreadin' their version of Scouting to all da public schools in the land who agreed with 'em, they could have forced a change on the BSA quite easily."

Pure speculation. Show us some evidence that such a thing could realistically have happened.(This message has been edited by packsaddle)

[moosetracker]

I agree with Packsaddle about the Might makes Right.. Well mostly, it could be the majority, but it could be the wealthy also, or just the one with the muscles if it is a small fight.

 

The forcing of the schools is interesting.. I originally thought like Beavah (only on the opposite side of the fence) as in sarcastically thinking "Gee.. Thanks Merlyn"..

 

But Packsaddle has a point to.. In order to keep the schools, all BSA needed to do was allow it to be CO's descretion.. They did not.. Was it because it by then became an ego thing, where they would cut off their nose to spite their face, and back down to the group that took them to court over the issue? Or was the finacial backing of LDS still more desired then keeping the chartered Org school districts?.. Or do we simply need to wait for the younger generation to come to power?

 

Now, if we still had the schools with us, we may have had more of a nagging voice that over time would wear them down... We just will never will know. But there use to be more CO's who were on our side of the fence. Which we lost when we lost the school's support.