OldGreyEagle Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 One thing to remember is that while Boy Scouting is over 100 years old, Venturing is still less than 15 years old. Ok, Boy Scouts started in 1910, by 1925 what was the normal experience with troops in most communities? Were all the troops that started in 1910 thriving and growing and just exploding in membership or did some troops grow and prosper and others fizzle? it can be hard to remember what it took to make Boy Scouts part of American Culture and that Venturing has so many other things to overcome that did not exist when Boy Scouts was starting. Venturing can be a hard row to hoe if the youth really don't beleive its their program, if they dont know how to or want to develop their schedule, but it can be done. It just takes the right mix of adults, youth and situation. As time goes on, results will improve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadenP Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Barry If anyone from National told you crews are folding faster than troops are full of it, the facts show otherwise. The reason it may seem like that in your area is the way many new crews are formed. In my experience a couple of adults who like say kayaking for example get their kids and a couple of their kids friends and start a crew with no experience or training, after a couple of trips the adults kids get bored hanging out with mom or dad and quit,the adults lose interest so the whole unit folds. The problem was the unit wasn't organized correctly in the first place, too limited in scope, the adults called all the shots, and the number of teens were way too few. The few crews in our council that failed were just like that example. Now we have a council Venturing committee whose main job it is to make sure any newly formed crew has all their ducks in a row before they can be chartered. The result has been we have had no crews fold for over five years in our council, we have a very active and well organized VOA supported by the council committee who organize activities and train new youth officers. Venturing is probably the strongest and best organized scout program in our council. We may be the exception to the rule but Venturing is very successful in our council thanks to many volunteers dedication, the council professional scouters still don't get it but those of us who have volunteered our time to our crews sure do. Venturing is NOT boy scouts, it never was and should NEVER be run that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagledad Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 >>If anyone from National told you crews are folding faster than troops are full of it, the facts show otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SR540Beaver Posted March 8, 2012 Share Posted March 8, 2012 Baden, I understand the Venturing program and it's elements perfectly and I'm not anti-Venturing in any way. I'd love to see it grow and thrive. But I've watched them come and go. What I've typically observed was they were started to provide a program for girls. Some guys would join because they thought it would be cool to be in a program with girls. Then the guys realize that it means two meetings and two campouts and they are getting to an age where they work and they drop back to just the troop. Numbers dwindle, meetings get boring, they drop to once a month, they decide to go bowling or a movie instead of camping, they leave for college and the crew dies. Our council has poured a lot of time and energy into Venturing, even to the point of hiring a "DE" just for Venturing. While we have some very small, successful crews, success and growth just isn't the norm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadenP Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 SR540 From your post it sounds like the Venturing DE and the rest of the professional staff haven't got a clue how to develop the Venturing program in your council. It is more than just devoting time it also means understanding how to develop a program to attract 14-20 year old teens. If your crews are small it probably means they may be too specialized, or have interests that are not appealing to teens. Are they youth led. Are they coed? If not then they are doomed to fail from the start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle92 Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 I hate to say it, but from way back in the day, unless you were an Explorer, few DEs in my PDL-1 class knew how the program worked. I was lucky, I was a Sea Explorer, and an AA for a post. Unless things changed, Venturing doesn't get adequate coverage at PDL-1. Worse is Sea Scouts. Kinda sad when you are wearing your Sea Scout khakies, and your SE asks's what's up with the uniform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagledad Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 Yes, while I dont agree with BP to what makes a Scout unit successful, I do agree with him that our Council struggles with the Venturing program. BP says its a Council problem, not national. Maybe, but Ive been shown otherwise and havent seen anything new to prove different. I only say that to suggest that program quality flows down hill which suggest the possibly that National is struggling with Venturing and it's bleeding into the Councils. My experience through the years has convinced me that the success of younger scout age units is dependent on the quality of the older scout age program. I would like to learn more about BPs Council. Whats the name of your Council BP. Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGreyEagle Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 One of the reason National struggles with Venturing is because a lot of the professionals dont have a good graps on it. I mean, you get past Bill Evans and who is there? 3-5 people who were part of the original group? Most professionals look at Venturing as Boy Scouts with girls, or as a way to do "High Advenure". Unless you plan on shooting pistols while on a hunting trip, I am not sure being a Venturing Crew allows you to do more/better high adventure than a boy scout troop. Councils can struggle putting on COuncil Venturing Events because there isnt the depth of Venuring experienced leaders that the Boy Socut program has cultivated over the years. This base will grow, it just takes time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oak Tree Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 You've got to have a mission. Not to hijack the thread, but it kind of sounds like Venturing doesn't it? Yes, it does, to me at least, and obviously to some others too. I think that one of the biggest problems with attracting people to Venturing is that it doesn't have a clear "brand image". If you sign up for the local basketball league, you'll play basketball. If you sign up for Boy Scouts, you go camping. The church youth group has a certain niche. But what is Venturing?Venturing is a youth development program of the Boy Scouts of America for young men and women who are 14 years of age OR 13 years of age and have completed the eighth grade and under 21 years of age. Venturing's purpose is to provide positive experiences to help young people mature and to prepare them to become responsible and caring adults.Well, sign me right up. What kid wouldn't want to do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SR540Beaver Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 I think the main thing working against Venturing is the demographic you are trying to reach. 14 to 21 year old boys and girls with emerging independence and added responsibilities find it difficult to dedicate themselves to something new.......even if it is fun. They tend to stick with things they've been involved with in the past like their troop, sports or church youth group. Even those things suffer with a job. College of course is a game changer if they move away from home. I don't care how great the program is or can become, it's usually a struggle to get there given the changing dynamic of the demographic. It appears more fail than make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwazse Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 I think the main thing working against Venturing is the demographic you are trying to reach. Yep, I guess we should only focus on program for 11 - 13 year olds. Tell your SMs to stop wishing for a cadre of high school students and a handful of young adults to help his troop grow. They tend to stick with things they've been involved with in the past like their troop, sports or church youth group. Except their friends are in different troops, they play different sports, and go to different churches. Moreover, many are hungry to go deeper in these different areas, but don't have any clue how to do it. Each venturing award helps a youth "bring the pieces together". I don't care how great the program is or can become, it's usually a struggle to get there Most things worth doing are ... It appears more fail than make it. If by "fail", you mean that some of the best kids in your district get a crack at starting something new that may just last beyond their tenure while enhancing their lives, sign me up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nike Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 While the Venture mission statement is pretty weak, and many of the best and brightest go off to college whence they are ensnared by less wholesome pastimes, my personal greif with Venturing is that BSA set it up to define youth in one program as under 21 and in others as under 18. Then, there's OA where you can be an adult Scouter registered with only a troop but still count as a youth in the Lodge, I think. Let's fix that while we're at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadenP Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 It seems that most of the critics of Venturing are scouters who have no experience or real understanding of the program. Nike, Venturing's statement is not weak rather it is open ended to give greater flexibility to the interests of the crew it is NOT suppossed to be run like an older boy scout troop which too many scouters think it is. It truly is sad the condition of the Venturing program in some of your councils, probably because your pro scouters are only concerned with MONEY!!! Venturing is a great program especially when you have dedicated volunteer adults and youth involved. We have large and small crews in our council but all of us adults and youth officers have made it a priority to make all crews successful no matter what it takes. We are not competitive like so many packs and troops who see the demise of a unit as more members for their own group. A scout is helpful not competitive. We do not depend on support from the council rather from each other. Professional scouting IMHO has truly become jaded and corrupt for many years now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagledad Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 What is your council BP. Bsrry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nike Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Perhaps the Venturing mission statement should be reworded to emphasize the youth-led and determined nature of the program. Otherwise, how is the current statement any different than many other youth programs in other organizations? We have a pretty active Venture program in Europe that is pre-dominately youth-led. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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