Are Taoist boys allowed to join BSA?

[skeptic]

Beavah;

 

You are not surprised are you? Pseudo intellectuals generally have very narrow minds. Not sure how much more precise you could have been.

 

Shield up.

[Kahuna]

Beavah! Others! You are arguing with Merlyn. Maybe you have nothing else to do (which I seriously doubt), but you are really wasting time.

 

It gets so tiresome when these threads get to be about Merlyn's personal idiosyncratic tirades. Merlyn knows nothing about Scouting except what he reads in the legal transcripts and doesn't deserve the attention he gets. It's a mark of the tolerance of this forum that he hasn't been designated a troll and kicked off as he would be on most other forums.

[sherminator505]

One thing I've noticed about Vincent D'Onofrio: it seems that the roles I've seen him play are somewhat wrinkled characters. I've noticed that several actors today end up typecast to a degree despite their best efforts.

 

Helen Hunt, for example, always seems to get paired up with flawed male characters. And of course, Jack Nicholson more often than not plays a certain kind of character that I really can't name in this forum.

 

Oh, yeah. Hello, Merlyn.

 

Anyway, I was wondering if any of you have actually met some of these actors, and are they really all that much like the characters they play?(This message has been edited by sherminator505)

[GernBlansten]

"Gern, dats a bit odd for you, eh? I would have expected you were more of a Stripes fellow."

 

I'm a HUGE Kubrick fan and thought FMJ was his second best work, right behind Dr. Strangelove. Of course, he only directed half of FMJ, but wrote the screenplay. Care to guess which half of FMJ was all Kubrick?

[vol_scouter]

Merlyn,

 

Once again you show your true colors who loses and then insults others. Please quit making a fool of yourself. As to giving platelets, most platelets come from for profit companies who pay the donors - I worked part time at one when I was a resident. So I imagine that you are not doing donating out of the goodness of your heart but for money.

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

vol_scouter, I don't get paid for my platelets. It's just like you to just make up complete crap in an effort to mindlessly slander me. I bet you kill dogs in your spare time, eh?

 

Beavah, I'm only quoting what the BSA's own youth membership form says, and it says you have to subscribe to the precepts of the DRP to be granted membership. The other statements you quote don't negate that; if parts of the DRP only talk about adult leaders, that's about adult leaders, but it doesn't change their statement that says "Only persons willing to subscribe to these precepts of the Declaration of Religious Principle and to the Bylaws of the Boy Scouts of America shall be entitled to certificates of membership". If that's only for adults, why does it say "persons" and not "adults"? If it isn't for all membership, why doesn't it say "adult membership" or "leadership" instead of "membership"? If it's only for adult membership, why is it on the youth membership form?

 

If you want to argue that the BSA isn't competent at creating membership forms, I'll agree to that, since they have yet to put their sexual orientation requirement on a membership form that I know of.

[DeaconLance]

To try and equate the Western definiton of atheism with the fact that some forms of Taoism, Buddhism, and Hinduism do not have a god in the Western sense is short-sighted. They are belief systems that believe in a higher path, a spirituality, and an afterlife and the BSA accepts that as sufficient.

[vol_scouter]

Merlyn,

 

Most platelets in this country come from paid donors though the Red Cross and blood banks will perform plasmapheresis for platelets. By your own admission, you do not work with children but rather try to deny youth scouting opportunities in communities other than your own. So my comments are based on what you have let us know about yourself and based on giving patterns have a likelihood for truth. If you donate for the benefit of your fellow man, then I offer an apology.

 

Every organization that I am aware has rules that require interpretation. Since you have never been a scouter, you have no understanding of the interpretation of the DRP. You are not correct in your interpretation as all the other experienced scouters have pointed out. Arguing the point only makes you look angry and silly.

[Scoutfish]

 

 

 

WRONG Merlyn! You are not quoting anything from any youth application!

 

Read it again VERY CLOSELY!:

 

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/524-406A.pdf

 

Now Merlyn...that application does say: "The chartered organization must provide an adequate and safe meeting place and capable adult leadership,

and must adhere to the principles and policies of the BSA." That would be the 3rd paragraph of the second page ( or first page if you consider the previous page a cover page)

 

AND...In the first paragraph of the right hand column of the second page...it says:

 

" Leadership is restricted to qualified adults who subscribe to the precepts of the Declaration of Religious Principle, the Scout Oath, the Scout Law, and the BSA Standards of Leadership."

 

AND....The second paragraph on the right hand side of the second page says:

 

"Excerpt from the Declaration of Religious Principle

The Boy Scouts of America maintains that no member can grow into the best kind of citizen without recognizing

an obligation to God and, therefore, recognizes the religious element in the training of the member, but it is

absolutely nonsectarian in its attitude toward that religious training. Its policy is that the home and organization

or group with which the member is connected shall give definite attention to religious life. Only persons willing

to subscribe to these precepts of the Declaration of Religious Principle and to the Bylaws of the Boy Scouts of

America shall be entitled to certificates of membership."

 

But it doesn't say a youth has to subscribe to or agree to or follow the DRP in order to join. Not in any way, shape, or form.

 

So Merlyn..You were saying :

 

"Beavah, I'm only quoting what the BSA's own youth membership form says, and it says you have to subscribe to the precepts of the DRP to be granted membership."

 

But you are wrong! Just look and see for yourself.

"

 

If that's only for adults, why does it say "persons" and not "adults"? If it isn't for all membership, why doesn't it say "adult membership" or "leadership" instead of "membership"? If it's only for adult membership, why is it on the youth membership form?

 

*Leadership is restricted to qualified adults who subscribe to...*

 

 

OOOPS! It does say "leadership" and "qualified adults".

 

And if you go to the actual application part on page 5, you will not see any statement asking, telling,or demanding that any youth member agree to or promise to follow the DRP.

 

 

 

[Scoutfish]

And didn't R. Lee Ermy's standout role start with "Hamburger Hill" ?

 

And while not related, Robert Duvall in Apocalypse Now was great!

 

"I love the smell of napalm in the morning!"

[vol_scouter]

To clear up the discussion, from Wikipedia:

 

"Ermey was cast in his first movie while attending the University of Manila in the Philippines, using his G.I. Bill benefits. He first played a Marine drill instructor (SSgt Loyce) in the 1978 Vietnam-era film The Boys in Company "C", which brought Ermey to the attention of Stanley Kubrick in later years. Ermey then played an Air Cavalry Officer in Apocalypse Now, doubling as a technical advisor to director Francis Ford Coppola on that film. He also served as Louis Gossett's technical advisor for the film An Officer and a Gentleman. For the next few years, Ermey played a series of minor film roles until 1987, when he was cast as tough drill instructor Gunnery Sergeant Hartman in Stanley Kubrick's Full Metal Jacket; Ermey also served as the technical advisor on the film."

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

vol_scouter, I do not get paid and I do not accept your pathetic excuse for an apology. Maybe you should stop slandering people and act honestly.

 

Scoutfish, you apparently missed where I said that the parts that talk about adult leaders don't change this line: "Only persons willing to subscribe to these precepts of the Declaration of Religious Principle and to the Bylaws of the Boy Scouts of America shall be entitled to certificates of membership."

 

Yes, elsewhere it talks about adult leadership. I SAID it did. However, that line quoted above does not. If it only applies to adults and adult membership, why does it say "persons" and "membership" instead of "adults" and "adult membership"?

 

As for expert opinion in this forum, there are still people who think public schools can charter discriminatory BSA units legally. That's about par for this group.

[Scoutfish]

Well, I change my direction to say:

 

"Standout" just might be a matter of personal interpretation.

 

Just as in the fact, somebody somewhere thought "Ishtar" was a great movie! Great enough to produce, that is.

 

LOL!

 

Seriously, somebody liked it!

[vol_scouter]

Merlyn,

 

Your anger is palpable. I overstated my point and apologized. In my readings of these forums, though not exhaustive, I have never seen you apologize or even be willing to admit that you are wrong as in the current case. The issue of scouting regarding schools has not come up in this thread so you have to change the topic because you are once again shown to be wrong. Please cease showing your anger and contempt because it does not serve you well.

[Scoutfish]

"Parts"

 

Well,the application isn't in parts. It is a whole application that does not require youth membership to adhere to the DRP.

 

Look on the application where it says " Requirements for joining"

 

Read under neath, beside and past the part titled "Requirements for joining"

 

Nowhere, I REPEAT NOWHERE does it say youth have to follow the DRP to join.

 

You can take parts, and qoute them, but any fool can take "parts" and independantly..make them read anything you want. You can take parts from AA writing and policy and prove the existance of God if you want to, but that would be stupid to take the time and tell atheists that their own policies say God does indeed exist because "If you read "that" part."

 

Remember, there is the truth, THE WHOLE TRUTH, and nothing but the truth. Partial is also incomplete and not the whole truth.

 

George Washington could say : "Father, I did not saw down your tree." and he would be 100 percent truthful wouldn't he? But that does not mean he didn't fell the tree, chop it down or cause it to lay parallel to the ground.

 

Show me the line that states that youth have to agree to the DRP and follow it in order to recieve a certificate of membership.

 

Likewise, find anywhere that states a child ( using the under age 18 definition) can make such an agreement legally.