800 Pound Gorillas

[NealOnWheels]

In several other threads there are claims made that the LDS has large influence over the BSA due to the number of youth members registered and that these numbers are inflated.

 

Doing some research I found some December 2008 data. A copy of the data can be found on Merlin's website: http://www.westley.org/bsa2008.pdf

 

From that data it looks like the LDS has 14.2% of the total youth membership. That hardly seems to be a stranglehold on the BSA.

 

Should we also be concerned about the United Methodist Church having 13.0% of total youth membership?

 

Or how about the Catholic Church weighing in at 10.3%?

 

If the LDS is the 800 pound gorilla then the Methodist Church is the 731 pound gorilla and the Catholic Church is the 580 pound gorilla.

[OldGreyEagle]

Isn't the Internet fun? Whatever did we do before it?

 

Based on the BSA's own website found at:

 

http://www.scouting.org/About/FactSheets/operating_orgs.aspx

 

A quick analysis shows LDS to have 33% of all BSA units while having 15% of total membership. Second place is held by the Methodists with 10% of the BSA Units and 14% of the membership. In third place are the Catholics with 8% of the units and 11% of the membership

 

Of course the question is, do we trust these numbers?

 

Note: I sometimes speak in terms of hyperbole, especially in allusions(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

[NealOnWheels]

Good - even newer data. Thanks OGE.

 

Something interesting to note - average unit sizes:

 

LDS: 11

Methodist: 32

Catholic: 32

Presbyterian: 33

Lutheran: 29

Baptist: 25

Episcopal: 33

 

LDS seems to be an outlier. Not sure why

[BadenP]

Neal

LDS may average 11 unit size because that includes the ones who the church registers and who never participate in any activity or meeting, the truer number is more like 5.

[packsaddle]

"Isn't the Internet fun? Whatever did we do before it?"

 

Well, some of us had lives.

[qwazse]

Based on previous posts, it seems that BSA has been the 800 lb gorrilla in LDS's youth ministry (via addressing racial inequities, training adult leaders, etc ...). It cuts both ways!

 

At the same time, I don't think we would want to do anything to offend 15% of our youth membership or 33% of our units (small though they may be).

[DeanRx]

Those are some nice numbers - I've never really seen any data on the breakdown of affiliations within BSA.

 

The REAL numbers though, come with dollar signs attached. Not, how many members, but how MUCH MONEY does each of the major CO's generate for BSA overall? Good luck finding that data. I doubt Irving wants to part with such information.

 

The other 5000 pound Gorilla in the room is how much does BSA spend per year in the courtroom to uphold the policies that enforce the "values" of the LDS (and the other major religious CO players)? Again, good luck ever getting any disclosure on how much of each scout's $15 national gets goes to fight the "good fight" in the courts to keep the gays and non-believers at bay instead of being spent on program.

 

The one number that is published is the CSE Mazzuca's salary at around 1.16 million a year. More than Girl Scout's highest paid pro (530K) and more than the United Ways' CEO makes (973K). This is via http://www.bbb.org/charity-reviews/national/#S

 

CEO of 4-H (603K)

CEO of American Red Cross (204K)

American Leigon (234K)

CEO of YMCA assoc (552K)

 

Don't look at roll call numbers to determine who charts the course... look at who funds the paychecks of one of the highest paid non-profit CEO's in the United States. That's where the influence lies.

[theysawyoucomin']

Some low brow, bi racial, near sighted,hair thinning, overweight, Christian, hetero,Father, conservative,gun owning, Marine vet(Kuwait and Beirut),Committee Member wonders why they lawsuits just don't stop.

 

So we are off AP Hill and a little village near me can't be our CO. Does that make America better? Do they feel like big winners?

 

Then not a dime of the $15 would be spent on frivolous, whiney lawsuits. Could probably get more boys with the saved money.

 

Cut Mazzuca's pay, pay him what the POTUS makes along with a house near Irving not a dime more.

 

Sounds pretty easy to me but given all the labels that apply to me, you can see how I think that way.

 

A court in California just ruled it was ok to lie about being a MOH recipient under the heading of "freedom of speech". We have not all lost our minds like the 9th Circuit.

 

 

[Scoutfish]

Well, just for the sake of arguement, what if the LDS did have the most numbers?

 

Is it, or "would it be" that far from normal if the LDS did have some pull?

 

You know what I mean.

 

If any group is made predominantly made up of any one ethnicity, sect, or just a particular line of thinking...well usually ( not always) that gropup has more pull just for the sake of having the most vested members.

 

Okay, it may not be LDS. Maybe ( again, for sake of arguement) if BSA is predominantly made up of people who are also members of PETA, then policies might reflect a lean towards PETA "like" stances and policies.

 

Kinda a majority thing.

 

Again, not argueing wether LDS is or not, but just saying that any group that does have a signifigant majority, usually does have a slight or at least noticeable influence.

[Gary_Miller]

Scoutfish, by George i think you got it.

[JoeBob]

In what direction has the LDS taken the BSA that we didn't want to go?

LDS seems to be saying out loud what many Christians, hobbled by PC, are quietly thinking.

Just my opinion.

 

JoeBob

[The Blancmange]

 

LDS seems to be saying out loud what many Christians, hobbled by PC, are quietly thinking.

And things that other Christians might find offensive and divisive. Your point?

[JoeBob]

"And things that other Christians might find offensive and divisive."

 

What things?

 

What policy has LDS forced on BSA that we don't like?

Why are we discussing the undue influence of %15 of BSA membership in such an oblique way?

What have they done that you won't name?

[GernBlansten]

What policy? Local option for membership. LDS have said they will disenroll their membership from BSA if non-LDS units are allowed to choose their own leadership in alignment with their own values.

[Gary_Miller]

Any unit is allowed to choose their own leadership as long as that leadership is in alignment with the policies set forth by the Boys Of America.

 

Non-LDS units are allowed to choose their own leadership already, and I have yet to see the LDS Church dis-enroll their membership because they have this choice.