Atheism

[Pint]

Scouting is a world wide movement, a vast majority of Scouts in any country belong to the same Scouting body, in the case of the USA its the Boy Scouts of America, in the UK its The Scout Association of the UK, Canada Scouts Canada, Scouts Australia and so on.

All these national Scouting body's are also members of the World organisation of the Scout Movement (WOSM), Despite the fact the we follow varying Scouting programmes, wear slightly different uniforms we are all members of the World organisation of Scouting.

 

Scouting is based on some key fundamentals, no matter where you are in the world, or

no matter what National Scouting organisation you belong to( with the odd historical exception)

 

and these can be best summed up by the Constitution of the World organisation of the Scout movement, available here

http://wsb1.scout.org/en/our_organisation/governance/constitution/constitution_of_w_o_s_m

 

Article 2 of the constitution states that:

 

"The Scout Movement is based on the following principles:

Duty to God

Adherence to spiritual principles, loyalty to the religion that

expresses them and acceptance of the duties resulting

there from.

Duty to others

- Loyalty to ones country in harmony with the promotion

of local, national and international peace, understanding

and cooperation.

- Participation in the development of society with recognition

and respect for the dignity of humanity and for the

integrity of the natural world.

Duty to self

Responsibility for the development of oneself."

 

 

 

In the UK the Scout Association is not a religious movement, its a youth movement with a religious policy, for Adults atheists can not become full leaders, however they can become associate members if they so wish. Youth members who state they are atheists are still allowed to join as they are seen to be still looking, and developing.

 

Back to the global situation, do a search on google for Baden Powell+religion WOSM+Religion and so on there's plenty of material there that will help you understand each National Scouting Association's policy. As for the odd exceptions to the rule see here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scout_Promise

[evmori]

Go ahead Merlyn. This should be a hoot!

[SSScout]

Great scientists:

"I believe in Spinoza's God, Who reveals Himself in the lawful harmony of the world, not in a God Who concerns Himself with the fate and the doings of mankind."

"I'm not an atheist and I don't think I can call myself a pantheist. We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many different languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangement of the books but doesn't know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God".

"God does not throw dice".

= Albert Einstein=

und so wiess

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

The DRP Ed. Hoot away, that's all you add to the discussion in any case.

[SSScout]

Scientists...

"If one proceeds directly and straightforwardly in this matter, without being deflected by a fear of incurring the wrath of scientific opinion, one arrives at the conclusion that biomaterials with their amazing measure or order must be the outcome of intelligent design. No other possibility I have been able to think of..."

= Fred Hoyle =

 

"If we say that God has always been, why not save a step and conclude that the universe has always been?"

= Carl Sagan =

 

"Anybody who has been seriously engaged in scientific work of any kind realizes that over the entrance to the gates of the temple of science are written the words: Ye must have faith. It is a quality which the scientist cannot dispense with."

"Both Religion and science require a belief in God. For believers, God is in the beginning, and for physicists He is at the end of all considerations To the former He is the foundation, to the latter, the crown of the edifice of every generalized world view. "

= Max Planck =

 

And do your own research on Kurt Godel and St. Anselm's proof of the existance (or not) of God...

[Dimemaker]

Slightly on topic but curious for my own edification.

 

Can an Atheist who recognizes a duty to God be a Scout/Scouter?

 

 

[AT1988]

 

I love that child in the library metaphor.

 

Is there anyone who has never doubted the existence of God to one extent or another? I know I'm in no position to throw stones.

 

We are all searching, wondering. . . scouting around for the truth until the day we die.

 

 

[OldGreyEagle]

One thing about max Planck, he was constant

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

Before anyone complains about OGE's pun, remove the planck from your own eye...

[evmori]

OK.

 

Bigot - a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion.

 

Hmmmm.

 

Merlyn posts

 

Yann, the real reason is because the BSA was taken over by bigots years ago.

 

And after stating

 

I'm not a troll Ed, I'm ready to back up my assertions with arguments.

 

he posts

 

The DRP Ed.

 

I guess I was wrong, Merlyn. Not only are you a troll but also a bigot just like you claim the BSA is.

[bnelon44]

The DRP comes from page 250 of the 1st Edition of the Handbook for Boys, 1911. It isn't anything new.

 

The hanbook is online here:

http://books.google.com/books?id=a7I2AAAAMAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=handbook+for+boys&cd=3#v=onepage&q=&f=false

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

Ed, feel free to back up your assertions/personal attacks. Just stating something doesn't make it so.

 

bnelon44, the new part is how the BSA enforces their DRP. They certainly didn't tell public schools to kick out atheists when they chartered units.

 

 

(fixed typo)(This message has been edited by Merlyn_LeRoy)

[evmori]

No need to back anything up, Merlyn. You fit the definition for both.

[bnelon44]

>bnelon44, the new part is how the BSA enforces their DRP. They certainly didn't tell public schools to kick out atheists when they chartered units.

 

They didn't in 1911 and they don't today. In 1911 they had to promise to abide by the Oath and Law (read the Tenderfoot Requirements in the 1911 handbook,) as they do today. They weren't members until they could pass the Tenderfoot Requirements in 1911. In 1911 as it is in 2010 if someone says "I don't believe in God" so can't promise to live by the Oath, they are counseled sometimes the DRP is discussed, sometimes not, and if they still can't promise to live by the Oath or Law, they are not allowed to be a member. Nothing has changed. You have to do a duty to God.

 

There is no mysterious morphing of the program by any nefarious forces over the last couple of decades. The DRP and Duty to God has always been in the program.

(This message has been edited by bnelon44)(This message has been edited by bnelon44)

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

I figured you wouldn't back up your assertions Ed.

 

bnelon44, the BSA certainly didn't tell public schools that atheists couldn't join when schools chartered units.