Chief of the Scout Board of Uganda is also the MP who wants to execute gays

[Beavah]

Yah, I'm with Scoutfish, eh?

 

I'm not a real fan of pointless gestures. Lots of folks are, I guess. Makes 'em feel good to "take a stand" and make a pointless gesture. Less work than actually doin' the hard labor of makin' real change.

 

Makin' real change takes sacrifice and commitment. If yeh really want to change hearts and minds in Uganda, you have to actually go to Uganda. Get involved with people. Learn their culture. Teach their children. Promote da values of Scouting with your boots on the ground. Put your life on the line in an area that may be hostile to you and your ideas.

 

Much easier and more righteous-feelin' to denounce 'em from 3000 miles away.

 

Barack Obama is titular head of da BSA. Should WOSM de-certify the BSA when da U.S. does somethin' folks elsewhere don't like?

 

Beavah

 

[The Blancmange]

First they came for the communists, and I did not speak outbecause I was not a communist;

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak outbecause I was not a trade unionist;

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak outbecause I was not a Jew;

Then they came for meand there was no one left to speak out for me.

 

-Pastor Martin Niemller

[JerseyScout]

President Obama (who serves as head of the BSA as well as some place called the United States of America) called the legislation "odious". At the "million-man march" to support the legislation in Uganda yesterday (actual attendence: about 500), they were holding signs up that said "Barack Obama Back Off, Homosexuality is Evil." Therefore, I think the BSA has it covered. Yay!

[BklynEagle]

The Blancmange's qoutation of Niemller is good, but there is an inherent flaw in applying it to the current discussion. Herr Niemller was a German referencing actions which took place in Germany. The legislative behavior of Member of Parliament (MP) David Bahati is an internal political issue of Uganda. For better or worse, the gentleman in question also happens to be the Chief of the Scout Board of Uganda, but that is separate from his activities as an Ugandan MP, much like many of our respective forms of employment or daily activity (for you lucky dogs who are retired) are separate from our being Scout leaders. For BSA to offer commentary on the proposed homosexuality bill in Uganda would be about as necessary, useful, or appropriate as the Worshipful Society of Fishmongers offering commentary on the space program.

 

If the Ugandans really don't like the bill, let them bring forth their own opposition to it. And rather than a reflective Niemller, let it be an active Bonhoeffer. But above all else, let's keep the BSA out of international politics.

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

I'd say the BSA is already involved in international politics, by their characterization of gays as "immoral" and "unclean" in court, and defending that view. Antisemitic attitudes (such as private "Restricted clubs" that excluded Jews) were fairly common in the US, until several million Jews were killed, and that kind of took the gloss off. Such attitudes by the BSA don't magically restrain themselves to American borders, and given that some BSA supporters justify the BSA's position on gays by referring to the bible, it's hardly surprising if some people decide that gays should be executed -- after all, that's what the bible says, too.

[Huzzar]

That's a bit of a stretch, but nice try...

[evmori]

And there goes Merlyn rattling the sabers again! This has nothing to do with the BSA and the Merlyn's only purpose in posting this was so he could bash the BSA! Yeah I know, Merlyn, I'm putting words in your mouth! Deal with it!

[Scoutfish]

Merlyn

 

Are you talking about BSA or thinking BSI ( Boy Scouts International)?

 

Because BSA is an AMERICAN group. Or did you think it mean Boy Scouts ALL over?

 

I'm sure the MP of Uganda doesn't care what any AMERICAN group thinks wether BSA, Mary Kay, ACC, NFL,IRL, WKRP, NCAA, IRS or DEA.

 

And let me ask you: What are you doing about it other than crying about what you think BSA ought to do about it? (Translation- your are not doing anything except pointing out that somebody else isn't doing anything!)

 

Kinda reminds me of a saying concerning a pot, a kettle and the color black.

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

As we all know, demonizing a group of people for years never causes any problems, ever. And certainly groups that did the demonizing never have any responsibility for those problems that never happen.

[evmori]

Did you really expect Merlyn to do anything except whine, Scoutfish?

[le Voyageur]

 

The thought of Scouting in Uganda is at best, an oxymoron. It's a beautiful, wonderful, almost magical country. But, the government is nothing more than a murderous thugocracy...thus, I'm not suprised at this ruling; nor am I suprised by the lack of any outcry from our side of the globe, where ethnocentric Americans are more concerned about fashion makeovers, spring fashions, celebrity chefs, movie stars, and the current sitcoms. Sometimes, even I weary of all these ugly Americans, and wish they could live just a week in the shoes of a third world outcast......

 

[Pint]

Statement from the UK Scout Association on this subject:

taken directly from http://www.scouts.org.uk/noticeboard/168/statement-on-ugandan-private-members-bill

 

*******************************************************

Statement on Ugandan Private Members Bill

 

23/02/2010

 

In mid-January, Headquarters became aware of a Private Members Bill being tabled in the Ugandan Parliament by David Bahati MP, who is also the National Chairman of The Ugandan Scout Association.

 

We noted that the legislation being proposed appeared incompatible with our understanding of Scoutings values and principles. Our immediate response was to raise the matter directly with the World Organisation of the Scout Movement (WOSM) who have responsibility for coordinating Scouting on a global level.

 

Following these representations, and progress thus far, we are now issuing a formal statement that details the latest position in the development of this issue

 

Statement:

 

Since the mid-1990s, The Scout Association has been clear and unequivocal in our equal opportunities policy and practice especially regarding sexual orientation, as befitting our role in contemporary society.

 

We are recently aware that the Ugandan Parliament has received a Bill that calls for the death sentence for repeat practicing of homosexuality. This Bill is presented by a Ugandan MP (David Bahati) who is also currently the National Chairman of the Uganda Scout Association. In terms of our own policies and understandings, we find the Bill not only discriminatory and contrary to the sanctity of life, but also completely incompatible with our interpretation of the values of our worldwide Scouting Movement.

 

We have already drawn our grave concerns on this to the attention of the Secretary General of the World Organisation of the Scout Movement (WOSM), and we are subsequently aware that the issues are now subject both to WOSMs direct engagement with the Chief Scout of Uganda (Mrs Maggie Kigozi) and to ongoing global consideration by members of the World Scout Committee.

 

We hope that the bilateral and very positive educational and solidarity projects that have been fostered for many years between Scout Groups in the UK and Scout Groups in Uganda on such matters as health and community development will not be prejudiced or compromised by this situation; we await the formal and public response from the Scout Association of Uganda and from WOSM, whereupon we will review our position.

 

Alan Craft, Chair of Trustees,

 

Derek Twine, Chief Executive

 

23 February 2010

******************************************

[John-in-KC]

Pint has the right of this, in his example from Scouts UK.

 

Three people, and only three, should be commenting to the leadership of WOSM: They are the CSE, the President of BSA, and the National Commissioner.

 

Everyone else is doing human hydraulic relief pressure tests facing into the storm.

[GernBlansten]

So would it be inappropriate for Obama, the honorary president of the Boy Scouts of America to make a statement?

I'd sure like him to.

[Scoutfish]

 

 

Yes, it would be inappropriate as an honorary Boy Scout.

 

No, Definantly not inappropriate as leader of a country in a diplomatic way.