So.... the Right says staying in school is bad?

[Hal_Crawford]

What an illegal immigrant (or a US citizen without health insurance) gets at an ER hardly constitutes any sort of comprehensive health care. It only applies to life threatening conditions or active labor otherwise it is tough luck and goodbye.

 

Hal

[Narraticong]

"The Right fears that the Presidents message of personal responsibility and staying in school will actually take."

 

Uh, I don't think so. Please let me know just which of the "changes" Mr. Obama has thus far proposed encourages personal responsibility? In reality, his entire political career is based on the premise that government needs to take care of everyone. Isn't that essentially what a traditional "community organizer" does?

 

Since the days our government began getting involved in "public welfare", I can not think of a program which has caused people to be more responsible for themselves. Instead, they tend to be an incredible drain on the economy and have resulted in generations of Americans who believe they are "entitled" to government handouts.

 

No thanks, I'm just not buying what he has to sell. Actually, I probably did buy it and now he wants to take it away and redistribute it to someone else...

 

It has nothing to do with THE President speaking to school children, instead it is about THIS President speaking to school children.

 

Ken

[BrentAllen]

Sorry to disagree, Lisa, but that is just the attitude that has put this country in such a mess, IMHO. We treat our elected officials (not just prez, but also reps and senators) like rock stars, celebrities and heroes, when the truth is they are just citizens like the rest of us, and they work for us. Due to their superiority perception, they now have unbelievable benefits, which we all pay for. And when politicians are spending hundreds of millions of dollars for the opportunity to work for us, something has gone terribly wrong. The power they wield has turned to corruption. They expect to get paid back for all that money they spent getting elected. They forget who works for who, and expect to get compensated, in ways other than their salaries, for just doing their job, to represent their constituents. It's time the tables were turned, and I think that is about to happen.

 

In the interest of full disclosure, I would have considered in an honor to meet some of our past presidents - Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln, Theodore Roosevelt, to name a few. That would be due to the things they accomplished in their lives, not just because they were elected president.

 

As for the speech to the kids, I'm not in favor of it. Our schools will allow parents to opt out. I'm not sure what I'm going to do with my daughter. I'm not worried about my son, he can tell BS when he sees it (yes, even from me). The White House is supposed to post the text of Obama's speech tomorrow, so parents can read it beforehand. If all he wants to talk about is working hard and staying in school, I have no problem with it. The problem I do have is the White House has already admitted they were wrong with the lessons plans they provided, and have scaled them back. Asking kids to write letters to themselves about how they can help Obama, instead of asking how they can help their country, is just wrong. It smells of third-world and communist dictators building up themselves, teaching children they are to serve the person, to be loyal to that person. If he gets into health care or global warming or any other political topics, I'll opt her out. We'll see tomorrow. Hopefully it will just be about education.

[scoutldr]

Ed said, "If the address is at noon, there is no valuable school time lost since that is the lunch hour. And how do we know this speech has less value than the regular school lesson?"

 

In my school system, "lunch" begins around 1020 and is for 20 minutes. The rest of the day is spent on instruction. My objection is the effectiveness of the message..."take personal responsibility and stay in school"...if they don't already know that then having BHO say it isn't going to matter. Those who diss the public schools are dissing me and my wife and sons. The schools we attended were and are excellent, and we are all successful citizens. The difference was we had a 2 parent household, we all have the same last name, and we spent every evening helping them with homework and/or doing Scouts. WHy doesn't BHO focus on WHY parents are failing their kids by not providing a stable household to grow up in? How about a "Parenting Czar"? Being poor is no excuse for allowing your kids to roam the streets every night.

[Lisabob]

Brent, I disagree.

 

I don't know how old your daughter is. But I have always thought it better to allow children to be exposed to different points of view, even and maybe especially those I disagree with, rather than attempting to shield them. Kids are smart. Talking honestly with them about what you like and don't like about something some political leader says isn't going to scar them or something. If you opt her out, she'll undoubtedly hear about it from her other classmates anyway, without even the benefit of having heard it first-hand herself.

 

And it isn't that I think we ought to treat our leaders like rock stars who, by the way, I have little use for. There is something to be said for seeing the people in positions of great power, and recognizing their common humanity. Also I think it matters to teach children to respect their president for the sake of the position and all of our shared history that it represents even if not for the sake of the individual. Whatever my views of President Bush were (and they weren't positive, by and large) I tried very hard to teach my kid to appreciate the difficulty and gravity of the job. Like him or loathe him, he's still the President of the entire United States and not just those who voted for him. That's one reason I hustled to get my kid to one of McCain's events. I wanted him to see that here was an honorable man who (had he been elected) was going to have one tough job to do and who deserved some respect for attempting to do it. I figure it is better than teaching my kid to blindly hate the "other" side. But hey, that's just me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lisabob]

Wow scoutldr, no snooty classist bias there. I teach plenty of poor and working-class students. The stereotypes you are perpetuating here are totally off-base and do not hold up to the light of day in the overwhelming majority of situations.

 

And what in tarnation does this: "we all have the same last name"

have to do with anything at all. As if patronymics (or matronymics) had anything to do with propensity for academic achievement.

[Lisabob]

"WHy doesn't BHO focus on WHY parents are failing their kids by not providing a stable household to grow up in?"

 

You know what else, scoutldr, "BHO" has done this too. Just a quick web search shows speeches on the importance of parental responsibility in April, May, and June 2008 and June and July 2009. He has made this speech, or some variation of it, to mostly white, mostly black, and racially mixed audiences. He has made it to women and men and children, of all economic backgrounds.

 

 

[SMT224]

If this were a Republican Administration, and a Democrat made any kind of a statement similar to those now being made by the right on this issue, there would be an instant attach along the lines of "Support the President" and "America Love it or Leave it". If such an event were to occur, Rush would be frothing. But, since this is a Democratic President, such rhetoric is fair in their partisan eyes.

 

I personally believe America is far more important than any one political party or individual who currently happens to be the President. I fear that we are moving along the lines of other areas of the world where political issues have become so divisive that absolutes become more important than national unity on the fundamentals of democracy.

 

 

[Eagle92]

Hal,

Not to digress on healthcare, but according to EMTALA, which is federal law, if you show up to an ER, even if you have something as minor as a headache, they must see you and treat you, so that cannot just kick you out. People do abuse the system, like the homeless alcoholicI believe the NY Times reported on, that knew exactly what words to use to get a free ride to the ER and a free stay overnite. He's on a first name basis with the ED staff, as he averaged 3 times a week over a 5 year period. The paper estimated that over the 5 year period, he wasted over $1 million in ambulance, medication, staffing, and room costs, and he never paid a dime.

 

Also let's not forget the hospitals in CA that have closed down because of the large illegal alien population using the hospitals without paying for services. Even charging those who do pay extra couldn't cover the expenses, and they had to close.

 

We have a large illegal alien population in NC, and they do use the local hospital's ED as if it was a physician's office. I could tell you some stories as I do work in a hospital. Trust me illegal aliens do cost all of us.

[mmhardy]

Since the days our government began getting involved in "public welfare", I can not think of a program which has caused people to be more responsible for themselves. Instead, they tend to be an incredible drain on the economy and have resulted in generations of Americans who believe they are "entitled" to government handouts.

 

 

I hope your not suggesting that programs like the VA, Social Security and Medicare are a drain on our society. Or maybe you are?

 

I think that Obama is making the address to students and their families to wake up and ensure that education is important. With a 30% drop out rate the No Child Left Behind Act is a proven failure.

 

 

 

[Hal_Crawford]

According to the president if the Hospital Association of Southern California, illegal immigrants are only a part of the problem and that this maskes the larger issue of the need to insure the uninsured. http://www.hasc.org/lott.cfm?ID=73623

 

Makes you wonder if those hospitals were really closed by illegal immigrants or by a broken health care system. You know, the one our president says should be fixed.

Hal

 

 

[SctDad]

Hal

 

I work in EMS and if ANYBODY calls 911 and wants to go to the ER, then we HAVE to take them. Wether or not they pay. We have taken people to the ER for tooth pain. Nothing that we can do because it is not severe enough, and there is no way for us to say that they are faking.

 

In the ER anyone that comes in gets seen by a doctor. No matter what the complaint.

 

Bev Perdue has been trying to make it where illegal immigrants can attend community colleges free of charge. Not ony taking seats from citizens, but also takes funding. How is that fair, when there are a lot of hard working people who just cannot afford it for either themselves or their kids, cannot send their kids because al the state aid goes to illegal immigrants.

[Hal_Crawford]

I believe that is a misrepresentation of Gov. Purdue's position.

 

http://projects.newsobserver.com/blogs/perdue_on_comm_college_memo

 

http://www.wataugawatch.net/labels/Beverly%20Perdue.html

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bev_Perdue

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SctDad]

Hal

 

May I pose a rebuttal

 

I reviewed the references that you posted, and I noticed one thing. They are all dated in 2008 prior to the election as far as I coud find. The only mention I couldl find in the Watuga watch was about 3/4 of the way down in the Swing, Misses article. Posted on May 13th 2008. The stuff from Wikipedia is in reference to the election race in 2008 and the News and Observer link was originaly posted in 2007.

 

She has recently (Summer 2009) started pushing for the bill that would allow for illegal immigrants to attend Comm Colleges free. I have seen this on the news several times, and if you ask my wife, I still have the same opinion. NO.

 

I do commend you on the references for your opinion, I have just seen them in the past and I feel that now she is gov. she is changing her mind. You know what I mean, standard politics.

[Beavah]

Yah, hmmm...

 

I think it's right and proper for da President of the United States to address the nation's school children. Any president. Every president.

 

I thought it was very telling how P.O.'d Rev. Jesse Jackson got over President Obama's lecturing to African American families about parental responsibility and personal responsibility. I believe Jackson said "I'd like to kick his a**". In many of his talks on that topic, President BHO sounds an awful lot like a traditional conservative. I think his message is a good one.

 

Problem is da "right" and to a large extent the Republican Party has abandoned traditional conservative values, eh? Leastways, when they aren't waivin' em to raise money. I honestly don't recognize 'em anymore. Won't give 'em a dime. They've become the party of ugly anti-intellectualism. They'd rather see America fail than give up their narrow parochialism. As a long-time Republican supporter, I'm completely disgusted.

 

I reckon President Obama is in a unique position to speak to urban minority kids, eh? That can be a powerful message to a group who really needs it.

 

Seems like if yeh want to reduce da burdens of the welfare state, a president who talks personal effort and responsibility to those who are receivin' state support is the sort of thing any conservative should support. And so I support it.

 

As for da medical stuff, it's true that Emergency Departments and ambulances get mis-used by the poor and mentally incompetent. And, quite frankly, by a lot of parents who bring kids in with sniffles. I don't think we ever want an ER to be turnin' someone away because of no proof of insurance, eh? That could be us, comin' in from a campout injury. And I know right now that a lot of scouts in our district and council are uninsured.

 

Seems like da proper thing to do is fix the broken system so that we're providin' that basic care in clinics rather than emergency departments. Since we're payin' for it anyways, we might as well be more efficient about it. And, too, I reckon there's somethin' fundamentally wrong about a hard-workin' fellow being laid off, finding another job, and being denied insurance because of a pre-existing condition. Or a doc havin' to order lots of unnecessary tests to up his receivables and guard against run-away liability.

 

Yah, there's a lot that could be better. Seems like we should work on that, together.

 

Beavah