A Modest Proposal

[OldGreyEagle]

So, I have an idea that I need to have the pitfalls exlained to me. It seems like the country is in a Bailout frenzy, so here's the idea. Acording to urban legen there is 800 billion out there for the Banks. I have heard various numbers bandied about, such as 700, 500, etc but they always end in Hundred Billion Dollars. So, in the words of Ross Perot, here's the deal.

 

There are approximately 300 million people in the US, so I will call it 310 million just to be safe. Since we have all these hundreds of Billions of dollars laying around, why not take less than 1 billion and send every US citizen 2 million dollars. That would be 620 million, certainly any country that can come with 500 Billion dollars for its Financial Institutions can figure a way to give .001 of it to each individual. Talk about spreading the wealth, instantly the whole problem would go away. Everyone pays off their credit cards, mortgages and buys new electronics, cars, durable hard goods, recovery is on the way. This can't be that hard, right?

[Apache Bob]

OGE - I think you have a great idea but maybe your math is just a little bit off.

I thought that 1 billion was 1,000 million.

I could work with as little as, oh, 35 thousand, in small bills, of course.

 

[Beavah]

Yah, what may be hard is da math, eh?

 

With 310,000,000 people, if yeh want to give each person 1,000,000 dollars, then you need to be giving away 310,000,000,000,000 dollars.

 

That's 310 TRILLION needed. Givin' away 800 billion only give each of us about $2500.

 

Or, more properly, givin' away 850 billion, plus da 3 trillion or so the Federal Reserve is floating, plus the new $500 billion Obama is proposing, plus another $500 billion in pork, auto bailouts and such. Let's call it 5 Trillion, or about $15000 each. With interest on the debt and inflation caused by the debt, that's over $100,000 per person that we're shelling out over the long haul.

 

So after you pay your $100K+ plus over the next 20-30 years, and our spouses pay theirs, will anyone have anything left to give to our kids? Don't forget, each of them has to pay $100K+ for this too... on top of payin' for our medical care and social security.

 

Oops. Forgot the $10 Trillion of previous debt left to us by the bush administration, eh? Make that between $300K and $400K each of us and each of our kids and grandkids owes.

 

B

 

[Aquila calva]

Bush bankrupted America!

 

Obama had nothing to do with it. Now he has to figure out a way to deal with the aftermath of the Bush-Cheney disaster.

 

It is a world-wide disgrace of epic proportions.

[sheldonsmom]

Yep, Bush did it all by himself. He went and spent all that money all alone. Congress had nothing to do with. Bush went and wrote all those checks without anyone saying a word. Nice job. I want to be president so I can spend all that money.

[scoutingagain]

Beavah has it right, and I have no reason to doubt his math.

 

The US Govt. does not have the money it is currently committing to bailouts of CitiCorp, Banks, auto industry etc. It is borrowing the money from others that have it( i.e China, Saudia Arabia, and others.) About the only good news is that prople are still willing to lend the US Govt. money.

 

So like any other loan, you can have your $$ today as long as you or your heirs are willing to pay more later. We have probably already crippled the economic status of our sons and daughters with just the initial debt run up in the 8 years plus. We're beginning now to stick it to our grandchildren.

 

For many of us we consider our parents part of the "Greatest Generation." What will future generations consider us?

 

SA

[scoutldr]

I don't have any grandkids, so in the spirit of "debt redistribution", your grandkids can pay more than their share.

[packsaddle]

Bush did preside over the spending spree. He had the ability to veto. How many years into his administration did he wait to use it?

To be fair this trend of deficit spending began during Vietnam with Johnson and with the change Nixon implemented that allowed us to 'print money' to pay for things. Then I well-remember the criticism Carter took from Reagan for his $67 billion deficit. I also remember Reagan's promise to balance the budget in five years. Then he promised a huge tax cut and at the same time a huge spending increase (sound familiar?). After all it worked for JFK whose tax cut was the largest ever. He was merely more responsible with the budget.

The math is simple. I don't blame Reagan, Carter, or Nixon. They merely did what the public wanted...the same thing that many of us have been doing with credit card debt.

But NONE of them did it with the skill and intensity of G.W. Bush. I guess, to be fair, I can't blame him alone either. We elected him. And a majority of Americans supported his policies and actions so we all can share that blame.

As Beavah says, the debt is staggering and it is staggering this nation. And like I have said many times before, I am not optimistic.

 

I do have a solution. Not many will like it.

 

First step: Abolish Social Security. Immediately. Let people keep all the income that no longer goes to the tax. Abolish Medicare and Medicaid. Immediately. Same deal.

Abolish all other entitlements except those for veterans. Let everyone, regardless of age or health, experience the unseen hand and the magic of the free market. Darwinian forces will provide the needed correction.

The baby boom is just beginning to retire. I'm supposedly on the bleeding edge. The best thing we can do for our children if we get really ill or can't support ourselves...is die - quickly.

 

Next step. Tax all inheritances and estates fully as if they are regular income. Our children will have the benefit of off-loading the retirees from their shoulders and greater freedom to do for themselves. They will still have the remainder, after taxes, of their inheritance. If I were them, I'd take the deal.

 

Finally: Not one penny of the saved and increased revenue can go to anything other than debt service...until all the debt is paid. The remainder of the federal budget will fend for itself.

Coupled with this, institute the Fair Tax and never allow another budget deficit. Ever.

[SR540Beaver]

sheldonsmom,

 

The last I checked, a President either vetos or signs a bill sent to him by Congress. If he vetos a bill, a majority vote by Congress can override it. Evidently Bush lost his veto pen and only had the pin that signs legislation into law. HE signed off on all that spending regardless of who may have proposed it. So yeah, ultimately the buck stops with him.

[NJCubScouter]

Packsaddle says:

 

...G.W. Bush. I guess, to be fair, I can't blame him alone either. We elected him.

 

We elected him? Well... did we? We did the second time, although some people even doubt that. But the first time, we'll never really know. The Electoral College did elect him the first time, but that may have included electors from Florida who weren't actually elected by the people from Florida. I'm not trying to stir up a big discussion about this, but every time I see it stated that Bush was elected, I still feel a need to put the "asterisk" on there.

 

But, Packsaddle, your point is otherwise a good one. I never expected Bush to be a good President, so I never voted for him, and I got what I expected. Now, would Gore and/or Kerry have been any better in handling an economic crisis, or in not allow it to get as serious as it has before doing something? I know what I think the answer is, but if I say it, I would expect people to say, "prove it." And I can't prove it. But I know what I think.

 

As for OGE's idea... great concept, and if the numbers worked out, it would be difficult to argue against it. Oh well. (This message has been edited by njcubscouter)

[TheScout]

I don't see where that idea is authorized in the Constitution.

 

But I guess nobody cares about that anymore . . .

[vol_scouter]

NJCubScouter,

 

The votes were recounted more once including the New York Times. None of the recounts resulted with a Gore victory. Before you bring it up the SCOTUS merely instructed the Florida Supreme court to follow Florida state law and not to make up laws as they go. As to counting ALL of the votes, most states do not count absentee ballots for the POTUS unless the vote difference between the two is less than the total number of absentee votes. So ALL of the votes have not been counted for years. Bush has been a poor president and a disappointment to all. However, having suffered through Gore as my senator, I doubt that he would have done as well. I do not know about Kerry.

[scoutldr]

I agree with Pack, except for the inheritance tax. That money has already been taxed. Social Security and Medicare are bankrupting the country. It's simply not sustainable with the influx of Boomers arriving with their hands out. When I look at what the taxpayer is paying to keep my MIL alive...with advanced COPD, now diabetes and multiple other problems. One IVIG treatment alone is $8000 and she gets it every month. Not to mention oxygen 24 hrs a day, at least 6 doctor visits a month, and a trip to the ER by ambulance followed by a 2 week hospital stay for pneumonia about once a quarter. After the last hopitalization, she developed a drug-resistant bladder infection and the antibiotic was $940 for 12 tablets, which didn't cure it. She hasn't worked since she was 20 years old, so she's paid nothing into the system. With her husband's survivor pension, social security and company stock dividends, she has more disposable income than I do, but she lives with me as a dependent (whom I can't claim due to her income). The problem is the thinking that we have to keep people alive, no matter what, and the entitlement attitude. She's in this condition due to 60 years of smoking. Whither personal responsibility and accountability? WHen do we say, "Sorry, but you are responsible for your condition." And I say this knowing full well I am going the same route (due to weight). But I swear, I will NEVER expect my kids OR the taxpayer to take care of my sorry butt. When I run out of money, I'm done. One way or the other. Like the Indian elder who one day decides "it is time to die". Unfortunately, due to the financial shenanigans going on, that day will be a lot sooner than I had planned. Like one of the financial gurus said the other day..."you think this is a crisis?...You have no idea how bad it's going to get." The bottom is still a long way away, folks.

[OldGreyEagle]

see, this didnt go the way I thought it would, but I blame me and my math skills, I should have started with the figure 310,000,000 and then added the 6 more zeroes to have 310,000,000,000,000 and then I would have stopped and gone on to other pursuits. And no, I have not worked for any financial institution, but perhaps others with my financial acumen have.

 

Anyway, the reason for my proposal was to examine what would happen if the government mad everyone "rich" with a single stroke of the pen. OK, every one gets one million dollars in their bank account. Then what happens? I run to the Porche store to buy my dream car, but guess what? No one is there, all the Porche store employees are off in line to buy a Lotus but can't because all the employees of the Lotus store quit as well. Each of us has a million dollars but no where to spend it because since we all have a million dollars, no one "has" to work because we all have what we always wanted, plenty of money. After reality sets in, we realize that if everyone has a million dollars, then in effect no one has a million dollars. People have to work to get enough money to "entice" people to do things, like drive trucks of food to the store, grow the food, run the stores etc. In other words function like a society. Now, if this was tried, would we learn our lesson? That throwing money at a problem is not the answer? That we realize a society requires people working together?

[Apache Bob]

OGE - I still think you are right in this.

 

What if only you and I got the million and no one else. Would that be Scout like?

 

Have a good Thanksgiving.