When businesses suffer, we all suffer

[funscout]

I have some friends who own their own businesses and they are very worried about the future under Obama. Even though Obama claims that he won't raise taxes on the middle class, he is planning on increasing taxes on businesses. When these companies have increased taxes to pay, they have to pass on that cost, they can't just "eat" it. Businesses will have to raise prices on their goods and services and/or lay off employees. So, we middle class workers will be hurt after all. One of my friends owns a business that has been in the family for over 50 years and now she and her relatives are afraid they will lose the company.

 

Please write to Obama and ask him to cut government spending rather than raising taxes. Many of us have lost part of our retirement, and we can't afford to be paying even more for goods and services.

 

 

[Tokala]

I have my own business and the best years I had were from 1993-January 2001. Since then, it's been a struggle. I'm in manufacturing and we've taken the hit so shareholders get a bigger dividend check.

 

I'm amazed at all the mass hysteria today about how Obama is going to have carte blanche to make all of these changes. Let's face the reality that government is much more complicated.

 

Back in August, the GAO released a report that revealed this gem:

"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Most U.S. and foreign corporations doing business in the United States avoid paying any federal income taxes, despite trillions of dollars worth of sales, a government study released on Tuesday said.

 

The Government Accountability Office said 72 percent of all foreign corporations and about 57 percent of U.S. companies doing business in the United States paid no federal income taxes for at least one year between 1998 and 2005."

 

So, maybe these taxes that Obama is going to impose on businesses will be on the 57% that have for many years enjoyed a "wealth distribution"?

 

Link:

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSN1249465620080812

 

 

[SR540Beaver]

Part of Obama's plan all along is to cut government spending.

[scoutingagain]

"One of my friends owns a business that has been in the family for over 50 years and now she and her relatives are afraid they will lose the company."

 

So the business has survived at least four other Democratic Presidents and they're afraid they'll lose it because of Obama?

 

 

[Gold Winger]

" I'm in manufacturing and we've taken the hit so shareholders get a bigger dividend check."

 

If it's your business, are't you one of the stockholders? So the hit that you're taking gets redirected into your own pocket.

[Tokala]

"If it's your business, are't you one of the stockholders? So the hit that you're taking gets redirected into your own pocket."

 

I'm the only shareholder. I also only employ 1 person: me. I used to have enough work to subcontract and hire parttime help. That hasn't occurred since January 2001.

[Beavah]

Yah funscout, I reckon they should be worried about da future, eh? Not because of Obama, though.

 

They should be worried about the future because the Bush Bailout, Federal Reserve money-printing, unfunded wars and unfunded entitlements and financial deregulation have made a mess of things. All of us are goin' to be experiencing a higher cost of borrowing. That's what happens when yeh double the national debt. All of us are goin' to be experiencing a resumption of inflation of commodity prices, includin' oil. That's what happens when yeh print money and don't have an energy policy.

 

Things are goin' to be tougher under Obama. We're all goin' to need to tighten our belts and sacrifice to undo the damage to our economy and interests that has been done. We should see some businesses that leveraged themselves too far in good times, or whose management failed to plan for changes of conditions, fail. IMO, they should be allowed to fail, because that's how capitalism and markets work. Bein' big, or bein' small, shouldn't get you a bailout, whether you're a bank, an auto maker, or a small business. We all should pay for the costs of infrastructure that makes our businesses possible - police and fire protection, roads to deliver supplies and finished products, education that gives us workers, soldiers that defend our liberties.

 

It's goin' to be tough for a while. We just got hit by a financial Category 5 hurricane after we dismantled a bunch of our dikes because a few guys wanted to make a bundle of money buildin' houses on sand. And you-know-who has been runnin' FEMA. It's going to take a lot of effort to dig out, and a lot of sacrifice. It isn't goin' to be better under Obama, it's goin' to be worse. If Obama does his job, and more importantly if Congress and us citizens do our jobs, after 8 years of serious sacrifice we might have managed to leave our kids and grandkids a somewhat stronger nation, and one that's still free.

 

That's a daunting job, for sure. One we might not be up for. It might be that after 2 years of pain da borrow-and-spend Republicans make a comeback, eager to bankrupt our children and sell off our businesses to avoid sacrifice even in time of war. Your friends are right to be worried.

 

I think there's a chance that we're still da home of the Brave, though. I think Americans can rise to the occasion, face their fears and worries, role up their sleeves and grab a shovel. Pay for the services they get, instead of borrowin' from the Chinese. I think we can even get to an energy plan that leaves Venezuela and Iran choking on their oil.

 

But not without sacrifice, and not without some pain.

 

Beavah

 

 

 

[funscout]

It's because Obama plans on taxing businesses MORE on top of the currently bad economy that people are worried. I know of some people who will be laid off if Obama does follow through with his tax increases. My husband's company has already warned them to not expect a Christmas bonus this year, since Obama got elected. In past years we have used the bonus to pay our property taxes. Now we'll have to take the taxes out of our savings. Sure, we'll find a way manage it, but we won't be able to give to charities any more, since we won't have the extra money.

[funscout]

I forgot to add that we'll have to wait and see if Obama keeps his promise about not raising taxes on the middle class. During his campaign, former president Clinton promised not to raise taxes on the middle class, but he broke that promise. Hopefully, Obama is more honest than Clinton was.

[Lisabob]

Funscout, let's have a reality check moment. Christmas bonuses were in jeopardy regardless of who won the election. You may have noticed that the economy was in the tank, the stock market was a disaster area, and companies large and small were being squeezed and throttled BEFORE the election too. Or is that Obama's fault as well?

 

I'm sure there'll be plenty of blame to place on the Obama administration once he's actually in office and taking actions. No need to blame him for "causing" things to go south before he ever sets foot in the oval office too.

 

 

 

 

[packsaddle]

"I think there's a chance that we're still da home of the Brave, though. I think Americans can rise to the occasion, face their fears and worries, role up their sleeves and grab a shovel. Pay for the services they get, instead of borrowin' from the Chinese. I think we can even get to an energy plan that leaves Venezuela and Iran choking on their oil.

 

But not without sacrifice, and not without some pain."

 

I'm with Beavah on this although I am not sure I share his optimism. The problem of energy is not something we can drill our way out of and there are good reasons why we should continue to rely external sources of energy. The problem is not how much is produced but how it is used.

What Beavah's really describing is a significant change in lifestyle and we've clearly demonstrated an inability to do that voluntarily. The pain part may be the result of circumstances that force the change on us. But I am confident that the way we've lived in the past...may be in the past. Perhaps that alone is reason for optimism.

[SR540Beaver]

funscout,

 

What the heck is a Chritmas bonus? I have literally not seen one of those since about 1986. For the 2 or 3 years preceeding 2008, I got a whopping 1% pay raise. For 2008, increases were frozen across the board. The one silver lining was that it was truely across the board. No one from the CEO down gets any kind of increase, not even stock options. My company is doing it's best to weather the storm that has been building over the last 4 or more years.

 

Will Obama make it better? I don't know, we'll have to wait and see. What I do know is that what has happened in the recent past got us where we are today and I don't want to stay on that path to sure ruin.

[Narraticong]

LisaBob, it sounds like you are asking for Obama to be cut some slack for things that were caused before he came to office. Hmmmm, 9/11 was being planned while Bill Clinton was in office. While he was getting us involved in various hotspots around the world, Clinton was totally dismantling our military. First World Trade Center Attack took place on Clinton's watch.

 

Eight months after election the USA gets rocked by terrorism. No matter who was president, the road would be tough. Mistakes made? Certainly. Am I a Bush fan? No. But Obama wants to blame everything that happened during the past eight years on Bush. He and the Democratics choose to take no responsibility.

 

So, I'll cut him the same slack. As soon as he takes office, it's his game. He'll have a Democratic majority to work with and should get whateer he wants. Fix it now, or take the blame.

 

[SR540Beaver]

Totally dismantling our military? Surely you exagerate?

[Lisabob]

Narraticong, you are reading too far into what I said. I don't recall discussing Bill Clinton, Al Qaeda, or 9/11 in this thread.

 

But if you insist...we can go back at least as far as Ronald Reagan and George Bush #1 with blame for 9/11. After all, both presidents helped fund the Islamic "freedom fighters" in Afghanistan, which (directly and indirectly) allowed for the rise of Al Qaeda in general and Bin Laden in specific. We could probably go further back to Jimmy Carter's botched handling of US responses to the Iranian revolution in 1979, which helped to give rise to the spread of Islamic fundamentalism (Shia versions in the case of Iran, but certain Sunni interpretations as a partial backlash too). We might decide that we need to go further back to Ike and his cronies in the '50s, who actively suppressed a non-religious, popular leader who promised open elections in Iran after deposing the (US-backed) Shah the first time. We helped overthrow Mossadeq for the unforgivable crime of being pro-communist and therefore assumed he'd be worse for us than a corrupt, illegitimate and much-loathed western puppet of a fake monarchy (check out the "Eisenhower Doctrine"). Or maybe we should go back further to....oh heck, never mind.

 

My point is not that crises and problems have no historical shadow. My point is that of all the claims made, the argument that Obama is somehow going to be responsible for the lack of a Christmas bonus this year, is one of the more wild-eyed and unfounded ones I've heard in the last couple of days. (Sorry funscout, but there it is.) As if things were coasting along just fine until about 11pm on Tuesday and then, BAMN! all of a sudden the economy just imploded out of the blue, as soon as CNN called the election for Obama. C'mon now people, think! We all know better than that.