A brief quiz on American History

[Gold Winger]

What always astounds me is that citizens of other countries cry "Americans, stay out of our politics!" but the feel free to stick their noses into our and the silly press and sillier liberals run around circles wailing, "Other people don't like us!" They've never liked us. Even when we're saving their butts, they don't like us. Even when we give them billions in food and aid, the don't like us. They take our money. They take our food. Then they spit on us.

[gwd-scouter]

Another tidbit of American History - not so long ago.

 

You may have heard on the news that there is a gas shortage in the Southeast. There is indeed. "No Gas" signs posted at stations, others with long gas lines. Reports are that this is because of refinery shut downs after hurricane Ike. So folks line up, fill up, and the station runs out in a couple of hours. Can anyone say rationing? Deja vu.

[gwd-scouter]

Calico - where did you find the information on Obama's house deal? Why have I never heard any of that on the news? The right-leaning news people keep asking why investigations into Obama's relationship with Rezko haven't happened. The left-leaning folks don't say anything at all.

[vol_scouter]

packsaddle,

I will vote in the actual election here, nothing else counts. As your post attests, many take into account what other countries want but they scream if there is any hint of Americans preferring one candidate in their own election. So if we are arrogant, then they are much more so. As far as loans, etc., countries do these things for their own benefit not because they like or dislike the president. If your situation were to be the case, then either the world likes President Bush much more than the liberal press says or it makes no difference. Once again, I want a president that always puts the interests of the US first - NO EXCEPTIONS. Often, the best interests of the US involves good relationships with countries - friends and foes.

 

It is not arrogant to be concerned about the US over all others. It is the only reasonable course since NO other country have our best interest at heart. If Obama is so concerned about the opinion of other countries, then in my opinion he is unfit to lead.

[packsaddle]

vol_scouter, In case you're wondering, the 'election' website I posted isn't being held on behalf of any particular country (except perhaps the USA), nor on behalf of any particular candidate. It is essentially an unscientific referendum among the readership of a news weekly, and if you were to examine it carefully, you would see that it is read by heads of state all over the world, as well as elsewhere in top levels of world governments, including ours. And it is not a particularly 'liberal' medium, being almost totally concerned with business and commerce and unabashedly pro-American.

 

They are conducting this 'survey' among their readership to get a 'feeling' of how persons around the world, at that level, view the two Presidential candidates. It is just for fun. And it ISN'T a direct survey of world opinion of the CURRENT administration...such opinion is already clear enough. But around the world, there is almost no preference for John McCain among the readership who have responded. THAT is interesting. The 12 world-wide electoral votes for McCain versus the over 8000 electoral votes for Obama do make a statement even if they are non-binding. The fact that so far the strongest 'support' for McCain comes from Andorra (a toss-up) and Venezuela (only leaning toward Obama) is just amazing.

 

You're correct about this survey not being the official election and that our election will be the one that does count. However, as the current economic crisis clearly shows, the world does matter.

 

Edited part: GWD, some stations around us had tank trucks arrive only to be sold out again in less than an hour. And yes, while I don't remember the rationing that took place during WWII, I do remember the effects of the oil embargo back in the '70s. Shades of things to come. I understand that GM wants to sell their Hummer division. One the forum members might even be able to afford to buy it just now, although it'd be worthless to me. I am totally unsympathetic to GM. They were on the right track when they had developed the electric car and then they dumped it for Hummer. They should pay the price.(This message has been edited by packsaddle)

[vol_scouter]

Packsaddle,

 

Once again you have made the argument that one should vote for Senator McCain because the world leaders believe that Obama will give them more of what they want not what is best for the US. Clearly, it is best that we have a president more interested in our best interests than those of other countries.

 

As to GM, it made a mistake. However, the profits come here rather than to other countries. It is in the best interest of our country for profits to come here rather than somewhere else.

[packsaddle]

vol_scouter, By all means, if that's what you think, you really SHOULD vote for McCain.

 

"As to GM, it made a mistake. However, the profits come here rather than to other countries. It is in the best interest of our country for profits to come here rather than somewhere else."

 

Me, I'll stick with free enterprise and the marketplace rather than protectionism and tariffs. Profit should go to the successful competitor. Does that make me a 'liberal'?

[vol_scouter]

Packsaddle,

 

I will vote for who in my opinion is the best for our country, without regard to the opinion of foreign governments. I re-read my post, I did not refer to protectionism or tariffs. I did not call you a liberal or any other name. GM gave the consumer what they wanted at the time. Electric cars are still not a viable option for many Americans though hybrids might be reasonable. As long as the leaders of or country (both state and national) insist on larger and larger tractor trailer rigs, people will and should for the safety of their families drive the largest vehicles that they can afford. Until both parties work on an energy plan in the interest of the country (meaning us), then we will respond in the ways that seem best.

[packsaddle]

"I re-read my post, I did not refer to protectionism or tariffs. I did not call you a liberal or any other name."

I re-read my post. I never claimed you did.

As for GM, we're agreed then that the market should treat them to whatever fate they deserve in the market? And if the market decides that profit and jobs should go to a company based in another country, so be it.

[vol_scouter]

Packsaddle,

 

In regards to GM or other American companies (which can be difficult to ascertain which are actually American), we agree that the government should not do anything except to assure fair trade practices.

 

I lived in a foreign country for awhile. It is a wonderful small country. Its' citizens are proud of their products and buy preferentially from their companies. They understand that it is better to buy from their own companies rather than foreign companies. So where we will likely differ is that I believe that not buying from GM is short sighted on the part of our citizens. Certainly, if American products are clearly inferior or considerably more expensive, they will suffer in the market place. If the American products are reasonably priced though maybe a little more expensive and comparable quality, I believe that we should support American firms.

 

American cars are now among the top-rated for quality and if you price all features, they tend to be less expensive. Buying foreign cars ultimately damages our country. We are better off with Ford, GM, and Chrysler with their payrolls and profits here than totally without. Japanese companies build factories in area in which there is a young work force and close the plant to avoid paying retirement - is that good for us? Our council is getting ready to buy a new fleet and I voiced the opinion that we should try to buy American. I was told not to worry because the foreign companies will not give a good fleet discount. So without American companies, we will pay more for our fleet. Without American company profits, our economy will fail (if both parties in DC don't doom us before).

[ScoutMomSD]

GREAT thread - lots of fun!!! I love politics.

 

1) Beavah - whats with the redneck nascar talk? I am sorry, I have seen this a lot and just have to call it out. I dont get it - are you proving your lack of education - seriously - if this is about scouting and being a good role model, I prefer those who can speak and spell. JMO.

2) I am sick of BOTH sides quoting old white guys who mean nothing to today's economy. Hoover, FDR, Reagan, and now McCain is talking about Teddy Roosevelt? Those under 20 are probably thinking "wow a president was named after a stuffed bear" - thats a joke ps. Today's economy works in lightning speed, including investments, cash management, etc. Quote Buffet, Gates or someone who actually has some current knowledge.

3) I have at least 5 core issues that I consider to be essential to my life and my children's future and because those are issues that the Democratic party holds dear, that is how I will vote. Yes I like Obama and think he has the ability to speak well and motivate people AND agrees with my issues, he is my choice. I am a values voter - if you support my values, you have my vote.

4) The same folks that are offended at questions about McCain's houses are the same folks who stood in line to "cast the first stone" at Kerry regarding his marriage and "stuff" with Theresa Heinz. They both married rich chicks, can we move past that? So they are both the Anna Nicole Smith's of their parties, so what?

 

I want both candidates to tell us more about the economy, how their stated plans will be affected by the economy and to be more specific.

 

sorry, I get riled up with politics.

[vol_scouter]

ScoutmomSD,

 

I am also interested in politics. If it didn't affect us so much, it would be funny. The interesting thing to me is that I likely would agree with the 5 values that you allude to but I have a totally different conception on how best to get there. It is my belief that while we may have differing solutions, we don't care that much which is used as long as it works. For example, we all wish affordable, comprehensive, health care with choice of hospitals and physicians with coverage expanded to the currently uninsured. We may disagree which plan is best but if one were to be enacted and it fulfilled our criteria, I do not believe that the public cares which plan was chosen.

 

We are tired that our congress doesn't compromise to solve our problems but rather play politics. President Bush has not performed all that well but he has warned that Social Security will go broke i the middle of this century and proposed a plan. The Democrats criticized the plan which is fine but they never offered an alternative. Nothing has been done and the clock is ticking. President Bush also warned of the current economic crisis and once again nothing was done. There are many such examples. I expect that both parties must give some to move forward but they both stick to strict ideologies. This is destroying the country. The examples provided were issues that the Democrats have failed to work out but they were just what came to mind. The root cause of our current economic crisis is the Community Re-investment Act change that was pushed by President Clinton but passed by a Republican controlled congress in 1999. Both parties are ti blame.

 

Enough ranting. May whoever we elect be truly the best for our country.

[ScoutMomSD]

VolScouter -

 

I appreciate that you are not name calling and that you can speak without bringing the old rhetoric. You and I should fly to DC and figure this thing out!

 

I agree the partisanship is wrong. I freely admit that the Dems in congress have not been as aggressive and I think that they are coming across as wishy washy.

 

Thanks

[CalicoPenn]

GWD,

 

Both the Chicago Tribune and the Chicago Sun Times have done in depth articles on the house purchase/land purchase, with timelines - they were done just as the national media was just starting to sniff around - but you know TV news - they don't apparently read newspapers, unless they're based out of Washington DC or New York, and they don't tend to pay attention to relatively dry recitations of factual information.

 

Calico