I can not stay quiet ...

[belayer_StLouis]

If you guys want to discuss politics go some place else. Enough with the political diatribes - whichever side you are on.

[packsaddle]

Mrs. Beavah must be at least as nice and forgiving as Mrs. P.

Your scenario is not comparable. First, the crash scenario cannot exactly reproduce the dependence of the son's life on the continued life of the mom. The crash scenario doesn't intimately link his life to hers in the manner of the fetus, a manner in which his ends if hers ends, no matter what. It only makes SAVING hers dependent on ending his...not quite the same thing.

Second, the son would be uninjured and in order to save the mom who is also perfectly conscious and perhaps capable of returning to normal health, the rescue effort must cut the still-living and uninjured son in half.

Puts a different appearance on it doesn't it? Still comfortable?

I hope not.

I also hope you noticed that part about 50% of pregnancies while using IUDs being ectopic. Interesting. They are rare but they exist.

 

While your approach to what I would call 'viability' is rational, it doesn't address the question of 'life'. It doesn't really address viability either. I doubt that those who think life begins at conception are comfortable with it either.

At the end, where we have the technologies available, we increasingly CHOOSE the manner of the ending, or we choose to continue the effort. We 'pull the plug' so-to-speak, sometimes on the very basis you mentioned.

But if you mean to extend similar choice to the other end of things, you must also take into account the fact that the patient with heartbeat and brain activity, but unable to respond in any way, is also connected to life-support - the mother.

The difference is your assumption that continued life-support will revive the patient. If you COULD substitute a machine for the biological life-support that the mother provides, then the analogy would be a lot better. But as we all know that is not yet possible.

 

The present, and I think fair, approach is to give the responsibility for this difficult decision to the person who bears the burden of the decision: the mother. Not the state. Not the federal government.

The individual.

I actually think your answer before was a good one, to win hearts (and, I might add, minds). If the argument against the choice of abortion is compelling enough, if it has sufficient merit, then individuals making the choice will choose not to abort. But THEY will choose. Not the state, not the feds, not Rooster7, not TheScout, and not you.

If, however, your argument does not have sufficient merit, perhaps THAT is the place to address further attention, and not to take the shortcut of government removing the right to choose.

 

And as I indicated before, however, while the 'right' might be eliminated someday, the 'ability' won't. It will just be more expensive. All about money, as Rush says.

 

[SMT224]

I just got back from our weekly Troop meeting, and it was great - 35 boys looking good in full Class A, most working on menu's and packing chuck boxes for our upcoming camping trip, others working on perfecting knots. The Scouts talked about the upcoming 2009 planning sessions, Troop elections, and the October & November camping trips. It was a bunch of guys happy being Scouts.

 

No republicans, no democrats, no conservatives, no liberals - no arguments -- just Scouts!

 

That's where it's at folks. That's why we're here. And I know all of you know just exactly what I'm taking about - and that makes all of us brothers, despite our various views on these other things. Let it go for now! First and foremost, we're Scouters!

[packsaddle]

SMT224, thanks for the reminder. So true.

[Rooster7]

packsaddle - I appreciate your concern, but no particular thread ever drove me away. I just thought it was time to give it rest. But to address your point, is there any topic on this site that hasn't been hashed out over and over? I use this forum as a sounding board and to hone my arguments. Occasionally, I hear something new which causes me to rethink an issue. But mostly, I'm just sharing my view and noting whether or not others have similar thoughts and experiences.

 

belayer_StLouis - please observe the folder's name under which this thread falls. I hope that clears up any confusion you may have had.