George W.s War

[TheScout]

I was just making the point that the action against the Barbary pirates seems to be the epitomy of a world police action. The United Kingdom, France, and the other great maritime powers negotiated a settlement with the pirates to leave them alone.

 

Jefferson made a bold move in using force to stop their terroristic attacks on American merchant interests, especially considering the meager state of the US Navy at the time.

 

Though I agree with you in principle about Jefferson, he is a complex character and the Barbary actions and his serious consideration of a preemptive war against France was worth making note of.

[Horizon]

I agree with you on the complexity (another problem with forwarded net glurge like the OP).

 

I would not consider Barbary to be world's cop, though. We went there in defense of our OWN direct interests, rather than pay tribute. That is different from, say, Kosovo, where the US was NOT directly threatened and had zero merchant interests either.

[TheScout]

True, but I would contend it was an overseas policing operation of a regime that didn't have to be taken out. Like I said, everyone else used diplomacy to quiet them.

 

Don't get me started on Kosovo. The KLA was a bunch of gangsters and drugrunners and the Serbs rightfully cracked down on them. Then we stepped in, violating the territorial integrity of Yugoslavia, leading to the creation of another Muslim nation in Europe.

 

Now as we support the territorial integrity of Georgia we look like hypocrites to the Russians who would love to get us back on this issue for bothering their Eastern Orthodox Slavic Serbian friends.

[OldGreyEagle]

Could some of the Political Scientists in the Room go over the Monroe Doctrine for me, I think it relates

[Horizon]

Monroe Doctrine was Monroe's statement that we would stay out of Europe, and that Europe needed to stay out of the Americas. He did not want the European powers having any more colonies, and did not want them to try to regain any of their colonies either. Part of this was in hopes of not having to watch our Southern border while were were trying to get control of the Oregon territories.

 

So on one side it was more isolationism (we would stay out of Europe), but on the other side we were becoming a cop ("protecting" the nations of Central and South America).

[TheScout]

It seems that died a horrible wound under President Wilson when American boys entered the trenches of France in World War I. And then it finally died when President Roosevelt used American "neutrality" to support the United Kingdom and the USSR against a Germany which had no qualms with the US. He went as far as waging an de facto undeclared naval war against Germany in the North Atlantic.

 

Odd to think liberals back then were the warmongers and conservatives were the proponents of peace.

[OldGreyEagle]

And when Ol' Teddy Roosevelt said one should "Speak softly and carry a big stick" did he mean oak or hickory?