Progressive Parents...

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

Ed, the BSA still issues charters to a few government agencies, like a Venture Crew chartered to the Maryland Dept. of Natural Resources, even though they stated back in 2005 that they would stop doing so. Plus, every BSA flyer that says scouting is for "all boys" is dishonest. There are other examples, such as coucils attempting to convince people that they don't discriminate by signing statements that they will not engage in "illegal discrimination," in order to get United Way funding or $1/year leases from cities. And I've posted before how BSA councils have actually signed HUD grants that require nondiscrimination on the basis of religion, then used that grant money for a scoutreach program that excludes atheists, in violation of the signed HUD agreement.

[evmori]

The chartering organization has just as much responsibility as the BSA in this yet you fail to call them dishonest, Merlyn! And the BSA is for all boys who meet the membership requirements! And the BAS doesn't illegally discriminate! And again HUD has just as much responsibility as the BSA when they issue grants!

 

So go after 'em all or drop the "dishonest BSA" line! You have no proof!

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

No Ed, I call the BSA dishonest, because it IS dishonest. Your bizarre relative morality where it's OK for a BSA council to lie and sign a HUD nondiscrimination agreement (because it's the TOWN'S fault for NOT CATCHING the BSA'S deliberate LYING) is not only dishonest, but immoral.

[eolesen]

Can somebody pass the popcorn?

[evmori]

Nothing bizarre Merlyn! Why is ONLY the BSA dishonest & not the charter partner?

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

Ed, I said the BSA is dishonest, and gave a few examples. I didn't say other organizations are or are not dishonest, only that the BSA is dishonest.

[FScouter]

Wearing my moderator hat,

Ed, you started this, so would you please end it by not responding?

 

 

[OldGreyEagle]

So, are there terms that can be used that describe the factions that are not prejudicial from the start?

[packsaddle]

Which factions do you think are the ones that aren't prejudicial from the start?

[evmori]

The dishonest agencies who accept BSA charters knowing of the BSA membership requirements!

[Trevorum]

OGE asks, "Are there some other terms that could be used instead of progressive, regressive, family values, traditional values?"

Well, Liberal and Conservative come to mind as being pretty well understood.

 

But OGE then also observes, "Using labels just muddies the water". So, back to square one...

[Merlyn_LeRoy]

What are you talking about, Ed? If some chartering organizations are dishonest, that still doesn't negate the BSA's dishonesty.

[Trevorum]

Thinking seriously about this (and taking a page from the "pro-life" vs. "pro-choice" factions), if I were to propose a label for how I feel about BSA membership policies, I'd suggest the use of "Big Tent". This is because I think BSA has a "big enough tent" to accomodate all boys; I don't think we should turn anyone away from a chance to be a Scout.

[GernBlansten]

I specifically avoided the term Liberal because it has morphed into something other than what it truly represents. Much like conservative, since most modern conservatives want nothing to do with conservation. Today, loud mouthed talk show hosts have devalued the term "liberal" to mean anti-American, communist, Satan worshiping, long haired, maggot infested, FM types.

 

I chose Progressive to describe a group of parents who are instep with the progressions being made in our ever evolving society. These parents hold no animous for homosexuality or non-thiesm. These parents would probably not allow their children to join an organization that excludes people who they find to be just other people.

 

Constrast with those who resist these societal changes, I really don't have label for them. Regressive doesn't fit as that would indicate reverting to a previous state. But wait, many of the anti-progressive types do want us to return to the values of generations ago. So maybe regressive is an appropriate term. Not that being labeled a regressive should have a negative feeling, it just accurately describes the attitudes.

[Horizon]

I think Progressive and Traditional do the best at conveying the thoughts, without carrying TOO much baggage. If you add the term "values" to either then I think you are back to having terms with negative connotations.

 

I ALSO think that lumping together the exclusion of atheists with the exclusion of homosexuals is problematic (at least for me). There are some that would welcome atheists, and not homosexuals. Others would welcome homosexuals, and not atheists.