The Economy...

[GernBlansten]

GW is correct. If magically we could start producing oil from ANWAR, it would be sold on the global market to the top bidder. It would do nothing to reduce our retail costs.

We would be better off if we reserve those oil deposits until we consume all foreign sources. Once depleted, our oil will be so valuable, we will the emperor of the planet.

You want to stick it to the oil man? Use less. If your SUV gets 15 MPG, get a used Honda Civic that gets 30. It'll pay for itself within the year. If you have the coin, get a hybrid that gets 50.

I have a different take than most on energy costs, its time for Americans to take their medicine. Gluttony , sloth and greed are coming home to roust. High gas prices will make Americans rethink their lifestyles and move towards alternative energy and conservation. These are good things. They never would have considered them with cheap energy prices. My view is a long term one, and I think America will be a better place for our children if we learn to use fewer fossil fuels today.

[FScouter]

This would work if gas prices were determined by supply & demand. However, they are determined by NYMEX - New York Mercantile Exchange - the same folks that determine pork belly prices.

 

Right. And NASDAQ sets the price for Google shares.

[evmori]

If gas prices were driven by supply & demand, we would be paying about $1 less per gallon. NYMEX has no business setting gas prices! Make the oil companies a utility & cap the profits!

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[OldGreyEagle]

Ah, the conspiracy theorists are work. Let's see the reason that gas is high is because we have Bush and Cheney in the administration. Let's not talk about how long it's been since a US refinery was built and brought on line. You know, refineries, the things that actually produce gas? When was the last time any sort of supply was developed in the US?

 

Prices are set by supply and demand, why else would big trucks and RV vehicles present such attractive prices right now compared to a year ago?

 

As India and China grow and they develop a middle class that use internal combustion engines, the demand for petroleum products will go up and the price as well. Yeah, lets Nationalize the oil industry. What industry has the US govenment every "done" that was done well. The Post Office? Thats why UPS, Fed Ex, DHL, etc exist, because the goverment can't perform up to the needs of industry. Anybody remember Amtrak? Is it still in existence? The Nationlized railway system? What is it's track record (get it track record?)

 

Medicare, Medicaid? Anybody wanna system like that? You want to see what nationalized healthcare would look like? Anybody here familiar with the VA system? Anybody want to have that be the standard for health care?

 

I am surprised no one has brough up the myth of the 60-70-80 miles per gallom carburetor, you know, the one that GM developed but were being paid by the oil compnaies to keep off the market? How long before that comes up again?

[Scouter&mom]

Gern suggested trading your SUV for a used Honda civic... Well let me ask, If I trade my paid-for crew cab truck for that used Civic, who would haul my scouts and their gear around? Do I just pull my support

 

And please tell me where to find that used civic for a reasonable price. I have spent the last 6 months looking for a used car for my son. I can buy a new one for the same price as a used one that I feel like will get him back and forth to band practice and Scout camp without leaving walking miles of country roads.

 

 

[GernBlansten]

I parked the crew cab truck and fired up the motorcycle and the 5 year old Accord.

Took out the truck last weekend to haul the scouts and trailer to camp. Got 9MPG with the load. Hurt to fill her up when I stuck her back in her stall. But she's ready for the next outting. Until then, she'll just sit with her tank filled with liquid gold.

 

When I was a young driver (during the first gas crunch), I drove a 15 year old Beetle. Learned a bit about keeping it running. Walked home a few times too. But then, we had to buy our own cars, parents didn't give them to us.

[evmori]

Prices are set by supply and demand, why else would big trucks and RV vehicles present such attractive prices right now compared to a year ago?

 

Check out this site.

 

http://www2.barchart.com/mktcom.asp?section=energies

 

Pay attention to it for awhile. Notice the swings. Then explain how supply & demand is driving fuel prices.

[FScouter]

Ed, NYMEX is a commodities exchange marketplace. Willing sellers and willing buyers go there to buy and sell commodities futures contracts. They basically gamble what the future price will be at some time in the future. NYMEX is simply an infrastructure, a building in which the buyers and seller make trades. The building does not set gasoline prices.

 

If you want to claim that the price of gasoline has nothing to do with supply and demand, state your case with some facts.

[talen333]

Ed- This is from the Gas Buddy site you said to look at:

 

The components which go into the price of a gallon (or liter) of gas are many and complex.

 

First, the basic economic laws of supply and demand play a large part. For several months after 9/11, auto gas hit very low prices. Since air travel was dramatically reduced for months afterward, refiners produced less jet fuel, which freed them to use more of their oil supplies and production capacity to make gasoline. Supplies of gas went up, and so the price of that gas went down.

 

As an example of the opposite effect, Hurricane Katrina severely disrupted both the pumping of crude oil from wells in the Gulf of Mexico and operations at the Southern US refineries that would normally make that oil into gasoline and other products. Supply went down, so prices for the supply that was available went up - sharply.

 

[evmori]

Ed, NYMEX is a commodities exchange marketplace. Willing sellers and willing buyers go there to buy and sell commodities futures contracts. They basically gamble what the future price will be at some time in the future. NYMEX is simply an infrastructure, a building in which the buyers and seller make trades. The building does not set gasoline prices.

 

If you want to claim that the price of gasoline has nothing to do with supply and demand, state your case with some facts.

 

And the NYSE does exactly the same thing with stocks - sets the price.

 

I already stated my facts, FScouter. You have chosen to ignore them. Maybe you should do a little research before you claim the facts I have presented are incorrect. You might learn something.

 

talen,

 

If the price was based on supply & demand, why does the price continue to go up?

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10(This message has been edited by evmori)

[FScouter]

Thanks for the lesson Ed. So if I understand you correctly, the buyers and sellers in the marketplace (NYNEX or NYSE) set the price. But the supply of the seller and demand of the buyer has nothing to do with the price they agree upon.

 

What is it that they use to determine a price?

[evmori]

Supply & demand does come into play but not as much as it should. It seems lately, the price is driven by what the market will accept.

[talen333]

Ed-

 

According to the other website you were saying to look at futures are going down. This is directly relating to the drop in demand,if you read the articles on the site.

[John-in-KC]

Ed,

 

Speculation, since Biblical times, has been part of the forces acting on the market. Is speculation rational economic behavior? Irrational? Certainly for some, at the moment, it's profitable and for many end user schmucks like us, not so profitable

[Venividi]

"It seems lately, the price is driven by what the market will accept"

 

Sounds like demand to me. What am I missing?