Things in our lives that may conflict with Scouting

[EagleScout316]

Thanks for any prayers. But I gotta just say, it's really easy to say that it's Satan's work at hand, and just as easy to say that it's God's work at hand. But no one on this planet will ever completely know for sure. Atleast I consulted a priest before anything else. Does money always have to be about greed and joining Satanic forces? What exactly is the right thing in this situation? It's too bad that no man in the world can really say, as God is God, and man is man. In the end, I guess I'll just have to follow my own heart. Let's hope I'm right.

[evmori]

Thanks for any prayers. But I gotta just say, it's really easy to say that it's Satan's work at hand, and just as easy to say that it's God's work at hand. But no one on this planet will ever completely know for sure. At least I consulted a priest before anything else.

 

God will never place you in harms way. Satan will all the time. What did your priest say?

 

Does money always have to be about greed and joining Satanic forces? What exactly is the right thing in this situation?

 

No money isn't always about greed & joining Satanic forces. But if the money comes from questionable sources, it probably has something to do with either greed or Satan or both.

 

What's the right thing to do? Pray about it. Pray for God's guidance.

 

 

It's too bad that no man in the world can really say, as God is God, and man is man. In the end, I guess I'll just have to follow my own heart. Let's hope I'm right.

 

Don't hope. Know. Apparently you aren't 100% sold on doing this since you seem to have so much conflict about it. Wonder if that means something? I'd bet it does.

 

Excellent analogy SR540!

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

A blessed Christmas to all

 

[fling1]

ES316 asked a specific question, and is still waiting for an answer:

 

"If anyone knows of any exact ruling about working in bars while being an Assistant Scoutmaster, please get back to me on this."

 

Here's mine: It is up your Chartering Organization (CO) to decide who is fit to hold a leadership position in the unit. BSA has some high-level filters on the subjects of religious principles and homosexuality, but you've already cleared those hurdles since you are already installed as an ASM (and we'll take an Eagle scout at his word for your compliance with these requirements). However, your Institution Head (IH) and Chartering Organization Representative (COR), as representative of the CO, are able to apply additional criteria for moral character as they see fit.

 

For example, the CO may require unit leaders to be church members in some cases. Or they may require leaders to be non-smokers or non-drinkers. They may decide that a leader is unfit after discovering a Playboy magazine subscription (search the archives for a lengthy thread on the question of Playboy reading). They get to define the moral fitness of their leaders in any terms they like, so long as they don't allow leaders that the BSA specifically disallows (gays and atheists).

 

I'd say chances are at least even that your CO would frown on having a registered leader (particularly in the SM staff) of their unit work at a gay bar. "Frown on" meaning "not allow". You'd have to ask your COR and IH directly to know for sure.

 

Hope this helps.

[Mike F]

fling,

I was alluding to your point in my first post, but you spelled it out perfectly. Its not the word of one member of that staff that matters even if he is a priest. Its up to the COR and IH because they are the ones that have to make these decisions for the unit they sponsor.

-mike

[EagleScout316]

And how do I know who my IH and COR are, if neither of them is my priest?

[SR540Beaver]

Ask your Committee Chair. Each year when the unit recharters, the CC has to get the IH's signature on the paper work. Also, for every adult registration turned in (like yours), the COR has to sign it. Any registered adult in your unit should be able to tell you who the COR and IH is. With all due respect, you should know who they are.

[NeilLup]

Hello ES316,

 

If you are concerned about whether this potential job jeopardizes your participation in the BSA, there are two levels at which you might have concern.

 

1) Your unit -- if your unit is Catholic Church sponsored and you have spoken with your priest, then you are probably in good shape. Still, if you wish, you can identify the IH and COR in addition to the CC and SM and mention to each of them that you are considering taking this job. If I were one of those, I would probably say "Why are you telling me" but that's your business.

 

2) Your local council - If there is a report that someone is an avowed homosexual, then the report goes to the local council Scout Executive and the exec does an investigation and decides what to do. So, if you are really concerned, make an appointment to talk with the Scout Exec (not the District Exec, the top guy only), mention the job opportunity, mention that you are not gay if you choose, talk about the potential financial rewards, and ask the SE if he/she sees any problem with your taking this job. If you do that and there ever a complaint made to the Scout office, then it will go to the Scout Exec. who will say "Yeah, I already know about that." Of course if your SE changes, then you probably want to meet with the new SE.

 

When you say a "gay bar" I presume that they don't have a sign in the window saying "No straights allowed!" It is a public accomodation and any member of the public is welcome. Rather, it is common knowledge that most of the clientele is gay.

[Eamonn]

EagleScout316

I think you have the "Official Answer" to your question.

I really like what NeilLup posted.

Some years back I worked as the Executive Chef in a up market restaurant. Most of the waiters were gay. They did a wonderful job and made a lot of money.

After work when we had closed we all would sit around and have a few adult beverages.They all knew I wasn't "interested" and they respected that. Of course there were some waiters I liked more than others, but there were some waitresses I liked more than others.

Many of the customers were people who were highly respected people in the community and while a few years later when I opened my own restaurant made mention of the fact that "All the waiters were gay" It never seemed to be a "Big" thing.

I was at times playfully teased by the wait staff about spending time with little boys!! Which I found funny as at that time I was serving on a Council Committee and had next to no contact with any youth members.

Our busiest day of the week was Sunday brunch. With what we called the "After Church crowd" Many of whom were regulars, many of these requested a particular waiter and knew that he was living an alternative lifestyle, but seemed happy to leave a good tip.

When I first read the title of this thread, I thought it was going to be about how we manage our time!!

Selfish as it may sound. One thing I have learned over the years is that I'm the most important thing in my life. I have to look after me before I can go about helping to look after others. When I'm not feeling good for any reason I know it has consequences on the people around me.

I at one time risked every penny I had and for a while wasn't making hardly any money. I didn't like it and wasn't very happy. Sure we can look back now and say they were the good old days and smile about them, but they weren't any fun at the time. I thank God that Her That Must Be Obeyed stood by me and supported me.

Looking back on them "Good old days" I can say that in many ways the Scout Oath and Law were a big help. But I know that if I had quit Scouting within a couple of years many people would remember me as the white haired guy who talked funny.

Keeping family,work and church before Scouting is to my mind very important.

How I live the oath and law is up to me.

I know that if I were to quit active involvement in Scouting tomorrow, the values I have learned from being involved would stay with me till the day I die.

I'm starting to understand how two people of the same sex can have deep feelings for each other. I don't think I'll ever understand gay or homosexual sex. I happen to agree with the BSA that a homosexual life style is not a good model for young people, just as I agree that God is a vital part of Scouting.

If you don't think you should be working someplace, you are hurting yourself and you are not going to be happy. If your not happy;living the oath and law becomes a big challenge.

But if not having the cash you need is going to hurt you are not going to be happy and here we go again.

At the end of the day it's all about you.

Your values.

Your standards and your happiness.

I spent years clogging peoples arteries with butter and heavy cream. Now I spend my time explaining low cholesterol diets. Life is strange.

Eamonn.

[scoutldr]

I don't blame the chef for my arterial blockage. I'm the one who decides what to swallow.