BSA policies vs. membership: where's the proof?

[evmori]

I counted over 20 MB pamphlets with a revision date prior to 1999.

 

Change is good. But change just for change sakes usually isn't good. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. And the BSA ain't broke. I would say if the BSA allowed avowed homosexuals & atheists to join, the flood gates would open & the membership would dwindle down.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Prairie_Scouter]

Ed,

I'm sure you're right that members would leave if BSA opened their doors to gays, but I'm not so sure that there would be a huge loss; there's no way to tell, of course. You'd certainly lose the more conservative religious members. You'd probably have the entire LDS contingent review their relationship with BSA (strangely, while there have been rumors for years that the LDS church is pushing the buttons on the gay membership issue, I have Mormon friends who say just the opposite, so who knows?). But, I wonder if the majority of the members would sit down, look at the big picture, and wonder what the big deal is. The program needn't change, and that's what the Scouts really see. It's interesting to conjecture about, tho.

[Bob White]

But, I wonder if the majority of the members would sit down, look at the big picture, and wonder what the big deal is.

 

Keeping in mind of course that the largest group of members are between the ages of 7 and 10 1/2 years old. The second largest group 10 1/2 to 15. I am perfectly happy to train them to organize a meeting and a campout, but run a corporation?

 

Keep in mind that this corporation is operated primarily by charter organizations and their contracted staff, not their volunteer program leaders.

[Hunt]

If the BSA's membership policies are truly based on values, they shouldn't be changed, even if changes would bring in more members. As I've said before, my church would probably increase attendance if it served free beer at worship services.

 

Of course, when a lot of people, including some churches who are COs, start telling you that a policy is out of date, that is a reason to take a look at it, and to make sure you can clearly articulate your reasons for the policy. As I've also said elsewhere, I think BSA has done this effectively with respect to requiring a belief in God, but not effectively with respect to the ban on openly gay leaders. This has led many people to assume, rightly or wrongly, that BSA is simply following the dictates of large and influential religious COs, who might leave the organization if the policy was changed. (Of course, if changing the policy is the right thing to do, that shouldn't matter either.) To be clear, I well realize that BSA has reaffirmed the policy, but I don't think it has clearly articulated the reasons underlying the policy.

 

As far as MBs go, that was just an example, but I think when you look at the list, there are many MBs dealing with "old timey" hobbies like coin collecting, stamp collecting, model building, etc., and not many dealing with more up-to-date interests of today's boys. For example, there should be several MBs dealing with computers, not just one. I think the whole system for creating and updating MBs needs to be rethought, with printed pamphlets being replaced with on-line information, and a more dynamic process for updates. But I'm not claiming, repeat NOT CLAIMING that this alone is driving boys away or harming recruitment: I'm just giving it as an EXAMPLE of how I think BSA could better adapt its programs to changing times without abandoning any values. And I think that BSA has to increase the speed of adaptation to match the increasing speed of change in our culture--again, I'm primarily talking about adaptation in program delivery, not in program elements, and certainly not in values.

[Bob White]

Merit badges completed by scouts in 2004 in subjects related to Hobbies (non-REQUIRED)

 

coin collecting 5,062

dog care 3,977

gardening 1,866

Home repair 5,866

Indian Lore 32,477

model building 2,892

pets 7,498

radio 5,394

stamp collecting 1,394

 

As compared to

American Business 917

American Labor 686

Bugling 710

Entrepreneurship 1,006

Plant Science 637

Journalism 1,232

 

We seem to have less interest in business and bugling.

 

 

 

 

 

[Bob White]

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Hunt]

Merit badges--OK, it's a tangent, but kind of an interesting one (to me, anyway).

 

I think those numbers are still pretty small, and that something like "Web Design" would get bigger numbers. (I know I've seen the list of all the 2004 MBs earned somewhere recently--can you give a link to it?) Look at Indian Lore--don't you think the reason it's so much bigger than the others is that boys are making little wigwams at summer camp? And I'm willing to bet that the vast majority of the others with any significant numbers were offered at Merit Badge days.

 

What hobbies are large numbers of boys interested in these days? What I see most is video and computer gaming--is there some way to take advantage of that interest? Again, this is just an example.

[evmori]

Where'd you get your data from, Bob?

[Hunt]

It's here:

 

http://www.scouting.org/factsheets/02-500.html

 

Maybe we should spin a thread to Advancement and talk about what, if anything, these numbers mean.

[Prairie_Scouter]

Sorry, Bob. In my post above, I was referring to the adult members, not the youth members.

[iaeagle]

In regards to the orginal idea behind these postings:

 

The BSA offers its program to other organizations: Relgious, Community minded organizations, social and faternal organizations, etc. as a means to help the youth in their community. One of the largest areas of CO's are Relgious organizations. If the BSA were to allow atheists, or gays into Scouting as leaders, these organizations would pull their charter - thus providing no program for the youth in our communities. Without the support of the CO's there would be no Scouting.

 

Recruiting vs. Retention

 

I agree with the posting that Recruting numbers are remaing fairly constant or growing - especially at the Cub Scout level which obviously feeds the Boy Scout and Venturing Programs (the national Commissioner recently sent out a letter to all Councils expressing the importance of building stroger Packs as about 90% of all Boy Scouts come from Cub Scout Packs). I believe this because I was recently helping at a Cub Scout Roundup where a small town pack which typically recruits 5-12 boys a year, recruited 39 boys that night. These boys join Scouting to have fun - the program, if ran as close to the "book" as possible will keep these boys in it. If not we will never see these boys again or their friends.

 

The "hole" with membership is Retention. Without a properly ran program at all levels the boys will leave. This loss is seen at rechater times, Tiger Cub to Cub Scout Transistion, and Webelos to BS transistion. Without the "BEST PROGRAM" in town, we wont keep the boys. The program is the responsibility of the local leaders and CO's. It is only at this level that Scouting happens, not what some office in TX says.

 

[Bob White]

Of the 10 largest charter organizations only five are religions. Any guesses who they are?

 

Who has the most units? who has the most Scouts?

[evmori]

If you look at the 2004 numbers, it seem the biggest hole is from Bears to Webelos - down 3.6%. Total Cub Scouts are down 2% while Boy Scouts are only down 0.8% Looks like we are losing them before they get to Boy Scouts. Or there are a lot of Webelos not crossing over to Troops.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10