Eventual Co-Ed Scouting

[ehcalum]

Didn't know if this should be posted here or under Program. What are your alls opinions if the BSA were to become co-ed on all levels, not just Venturing and Exploring. This doesn't have to be a direct all units must be co-ed, but can be more of a Units Choice. I ask because it seems the total youth aviable and FOS numbers are down, and thus making Scouting co-ed would be a wise move. I would like to see at least the Boy Scout program go co-ed to increase diversity, community, and teamwork. Let me know what you all think. Thanks

[tortdog]

I will get flamed for this one, but my view is strongly against co-ed scouting. Any organization in which a substantial portion of the activities include overnighters should not include young men and women. Such only invites sexual misconduct, and would leave the sponsoring organizations exposed to liability.

 

I fail to see the wisdom in making it easy for young men to engage in sexual relations with young women.

[TheScout]

Agreed Tortdog. There is no reason why unmarried boys and girls need to be going on overnighters together. The BSA has existed for 95 years as boy only and should remain that way. The thing that the American public admires about the BSA is the commitment to the same values over time. Something that very few other segments of American society can claim.

 

I question your contention that "total youth available" is going down. The American population continues to rise rapidly and the youth population does as well.

 

Lastly, the fact that FOS contributions down is a tough argument. The BSA can't make changes for the sake of money. This will make it no better than most other American organizations.

 

Thanks.

[SemperParatus]

I would not think co-ed scouting would be well received by the majority of boys and girls, especially at the younger ages. The 'average' cub scout age boy does not want to 'hang' with girls in his spare time. The 'average' brownie is not interested in hangin with boys. I would suspect that the programming/requirements would be rewritten to be more 'sensitive' to the gender differences and in the end you would end up with a program that neither gender can fully embrace. There are plenty of co-ed activities that boys and girls can be involved in, scouting should not be one of them.

 

[GopherJudy]

I don't think it's a good idea either. I was a teenager in the 70's when girls were trying to get into Boy Scouts, etc. & I thought it was wrong back then & I think it's wrong now. There was even an episode on "The Brady Bunch" when Marcia was trying to get into a "boy" organization & then Peter "retalliated" by joining a "girl" organization. There is an organization for girls it's called Girl Scout!! I see nothing wrong with organizations just for boys & one just for girls!

 

On another note & I guess showing my age again, when my son Mark visited a troop as a Webelo I, the SM was female & I was rather surprised! I thought that the leaders in Boy Scouts were all male! Now I'll go & get my cane, my pet rock, my mood ring, put on my bell-bottoms & my fringe vest & put on Partridge Family album! LOL!!

 

Judy

[OldGreyEagle]

Ok Judy, get your walker and lets do the time warp again...

[SemperParatus]

Hello, world, hear the song that we're singin'

C'mon get happy!

A whole lot of lovin' is what we'll be bringin'

We'll make you happy!

 

We had a dream, we'd go travelin' together,

We'd spread a little lovin' then we'd keep movin' on.

Somethin' always happens whenever we're together

We get a happy feelin' when we're singing a song.

 

Trav'lin' along there's a song that we're singin'

C'mon get happy!

A Whole lot of lovin' is what we'll be bringin'

We'll make you happy!

We'll make you happy!

We'll make you happy!

 

***

 

NOW THAT'S A SONG!!!

[Eagledad]

Hi All

 

Anyone who has helped at a church youth camp with youth in this age group would understand that a boy run type program would be impossible.

 

Barry

[Sturgen]

BOY Scouts

[evmori]

No. This has happened before & will happen again! The BSA will survive as a boy only organization.

 

Scouts Canada went coed. Anyone know how this helped/hindered them?

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[LodgeChief]

BAD IDEA!!!!!

This is the BOY Scouts of America. If girls have an urge to be a part of the BSA so bad, then they need to join a Crew. I don't know if I really even agree with that, to be honest. There are other organizations that are co-ed.

[Trevorum]

I also would be opposed to gender integration of BSA.

 

However, not for the reason given by tortdog. Mixed gender youth groups can engage in a wide variety of activities, including outdoor camping, without fearing hanky-panky. The teenagers I know are responsible young adults and Taliban-like separation is not only unnecessary but insulting to them. Adult supervision is the key. Many youth groups already do this sort of thing, including church groups. Indeed, most of the Scouting organizations around the world are successfully coed without devolving into dens of iniquity.

 

Here in the US, young people who want coed activities already have a wide variety of options, incuding Campfire, YMCA, church groups, and school groups. But boys who want to hang with other guys without girls around have the Boy Scouts of America. BSA has developed the premier youth program for BOYS. There is nothing wrong with coed groups, but this element is just not part of BSA. Integrating Boy Scouts would not be a terrible thing, but the resulting organization would be very, very diferent from what we have known for the last 95 years.

[kenk]

"There is no reason why unmarried boys and girls need to be going on overnighters together. Any organization in which a substantial portion of the activities include overnighters should not include young men and women. Such only invites sexual misconduct, and would leave the sponsoring organizations exposed to liability."

 

Isn't that what the Venturing program is doing with boys and girls 14 years and older? I actually envision fewer problems with a co-ed program with younger kids.

 

Its not that the program advancement requirements are boy-only material. Most of the requirements are quite gender-neutral.

 

While there are likely to be girls out there that would hate to camp or hike, there are pobably nearly as many boys who feel the same.

 

I certainly have no problem with female leaders in Boy Scouts (or with male leaders in Girl Scouts).

 

The real reason that Boy Scouts isn't co-ed is because, well, that is just the way it is. There is nothing wrong with having a PRIVATE program just for boys. It works very well. If it ain't broken, don't fix it.

 

The boys have Boy Scouts and the girls have Girl Scouts.

 

[tortdog]

So desiring to keep young men/women separate in overnighters is akin to the Taliban???

 

I thought it was just good judgment. In my experience, trusting that the adult supervision will absoultely protect kids from hanky-panky is hopeful, but not realistic. Kids outwit adults all the time (I did). Further, I don't think we can rely on "good" kids to not engage in hanky-panky. If we make something available to get into trouble with, even good kids make mistakes.

 

My preference? Don't make it available while they are young. I mean, we do have statutes based on the premise that people under 18 do not have the maturity to make certain decisions for themselves.

 

Beyond my original argument, I strongly agree with that presented by others. Girls and boys ARE different. Sure, there's overlap. Sure there are some girls who might be more into traditional BSA activities, but there's a reason for the poem.

 

Also, I don't want my boys to be angling for dates with the girls while I'm trying to teach skills. When I go out with the boys, I'm pretty sure that John is not oggling Jeff. I'm okay with that. It's easy. Sure coed groups can be taught, but its EASIER when you remove the factor of guys-girls.

 

That's reality.

 

Lastly, I think one reason the no gay-leader rules is prudent is it removes (theoretically) from the equation sexual interaction between adult leaders and youth. If every leader is hetero male, and ever child is hetero male, theoretically the adults will never sexually interact with the children. However, if you have hetero male adults with hetero female children, you introduce one more potential liabilty. So why go there at all?

 

(I realize we now have female scoutmasters. I realize that it CAN be done. First, I doubt many boy scouts are oggling the female scoutmaster (and vice versa). But reality is that female teacher & male student sexual contact occurs. I only argue that removing a female-male overnight interaction makes one less thing to worry about.)

[Bob White]

Scouting is as co-ed as it will get unless the GirlScouts close their doors forever. The BSa will not do anything that could diminish the enrollment of the Girl Scout program. Ain't gonna happen.

 

FOS is a council by council fundraising. There are over 300 councils all doing their drives at different times and with different methods and goals depending on local administration. It is highly unlikely that you have the available data to know if FOS in Scouting is up down or even, except in your own council or adjoining ones.