Misuse of the Program

[Fat Old Guy]

Bob White, it is obvious that you have trouble with the English language. "Minister" and "proselytize" have very different meanings.

 

"What I think would be irrelevant since it is not my program."

 

Maybe that's the difference between you and the rest of us. We care about the program because we consider it to be ours. Why is it our program? Well, without us, the membership, BSA would cease to exist.

[Bob White]

You still have not sited any part of the program that would restrict a scout from sharing his religious belief with another person.

 

Do not assume that because I realize it is not my program that I do not care about the scouting program . I am confident that those who have read my posts with an open mind know otherwise.

 

But I think it would be wrong to believe the program would crumble should either you or I quit tomorrow.

 

I would also hope that this topic could be discussed without further personal attacks.

 

The topic was misuse of the program.

 

Bob White

[Fat Old Guy]

"You still have not sited (sic) any part of the program that would restrict a scout from sharing his religious belief with another person."

 

Still have problems with English, don't you? Proselyitize. . . get it? Got it? Doubt it.

 

"But I think it would be wrong to believe the program would crumble should either you or I quit tomorrow."

 

Oh, Bob White! Are you really this thick or is it just an act?

[Bob White]

So now that we understand how you feel about me personally how about addressing the discussion.

 

You still have not sighted any part of the program that would restrict a scout from sharing his religious belief with another person.

 

How would a scout performing his "Duty to God" be a misuse of the BSA program?

 

How is a parent, who realizes that a higher percentage of scouts than non-scouts attend college, be misusing the program?

 

I am just trying to understand your points here. There are a lot of ways to misuse the program I just do not see these two as doing so.

 

Please disuss the topic not me if possible.

 

Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Fat Old Guy]

I have been discussing the issue, you're the one that is avoiding it. Proselytize, let's try that slowly . . . prahhhh, sell, uh, ties.

 

Big difference between a Scout saying, "I feel Jesus in my life" and "This weeks campout will include a baptism for all Scouts."

[Fat Old Guy]

"Individual History Report" from Troopmaster; sorry for the abbreviation."

 

That's okay. I avoid Troopmaster when possible.

[Bob White]

If a troop is all of one faith, (and the event is approved by parents, and church) the BSA has no rules or guidelines against it. As much as you do not like it personally, it is not a misuse of the scouting program, it is simply an aspect that you are unfamiliar with.

 

Scouting is a youth outreach program of the chartering organization. If a church can use other clubs within the church to spread its teachings and bring others to its church, it can also use its scout units. Many religious organizations have scout units that consist of only the members of that church, which certainly makes this easier to do.

 

It is not a misuse of scouting. In many ways, it is the application of the Oath and Law.

 

So, am I to assume that you cannot defend an opinion without personally attacking me?

 

Bob White

[Fat Old Guy]

You still are having trouble with simple words, aren't you?

 

 

[Hunt]

Could a church send out door-to-door evangelists in Scout uniforms? Even if it's not prohibited, does this seem appropriate to you? I must confess, I'd be surprised and somewhat disturbed if uniformed Scouts showed up at my door to evangelize for a specific religion.

I'm not saying it's wrong for the scouts to evangelize--far from it--I just question if it's really right to use the Scout uniform as a "foot in the door" when the mission doesn't really relate to Scouting.

[Bob White]

I am unaware of any church that has chosen to use uniformed scouts to go dorr to door. Keep in mind however that there are many, mant other ways to bring others to your church besides door to door, and whether or not the scout is in a uniform he is still a scout.

 

There are many other ways to be dicussed that are actual misuse of a program that I did not see the validity of using scouting to spread a religious messgae or to further a college education to even consider them as misuse.

 

The poster who originated seems to have no actual evidence that either behavior is prohibited or even cautioned against, by the BSA.

 

There are leaders who steal money from units, bar parents from campouts, do not allow the SPL to select the troop officers, chase scouts out of the program, fail to invite youth into the program, don't use scout methods but wear the scout uniform, use scouting as a tool to be "the Boss" of something in their lives.

 

To me that is misuse of the program. those are the things we should be concerned and appalled by. Not a scout performing his Duty to God.

 

Bob White

[Hunt]

Well, OK...but do you mean that you think it would be OK for a church to use uniformed scouts in this way? Or you just think it's not worth talking about because nobody is doing it?

[evmori]

"but do you mean that you think it would be OK for a church to use uniformed scouts in this way?"

 

I'd say no regardless if it is being done or not, but that is just my opinion.

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[Bob White]

It's nice to have opinions, but some facts would enhance and validate them.

 

I have never known a church to send scouts door to door in uniform, but I have known churches who used their scout unit to do so out of uniform.

 

There are enough actual misuses of the program going on that we could focus on rather than imagined ones. Plus, I am not aware of any regulation that prohibits a religious organization from actively using its scout unit in its church activities in or out of uniform. It cannot force a member who does not belong to that religion to participate, but that is the only restriction that I am aware of.

 

Perhaps DS knows of a specific regulation that would keep the scouting members of an approved Church based charter organization from fully participating in the churchs religious obligations while in uniform. I know of none, and no poster, at this point in time, has provided any evidence that such a rule exists.

 

Thank you Hunt for addressing the topic maturely

 

Bob White

[Fat Old Guy]

" Or you just think it's not worth talking about because nobody is doing it? "

 

Bob White never thinks anything is worth talking about unless BSA has an official position either for or against. "Hypothetical" isn't even in his vocabulary.

[Zahnada]

I have some quick side-questions from parts of the discussion that interested me.

 

"If a troop is all of one faith, (and the event is approved by parents, and church) the BSA has no rules or guidelines against it."

 

If there's one person who either isn't the same religion or doesn't feel comfortable with whatever religious event is being sponsored by the troop, does that veto the activity? Or is this person just given the choice not to participate?

 

 

"How is a parent, who realizes that a higher percentage of scouts than non-scouts attend college, be misusing the program?"

 

This sounds like a great stat for us to use when discussing scouting with others. Do you have any actual numbers or a source that I could quote if I'm trying to talk a boy into giving scouting a try?

 

Thanks.