Multiple Registration for Adult Volunteer Scouters

[Owl62]

It is my understanding that adult volunteers may register in multiple Scouting positions. Say as an Assistant Scoutmaster in a Boy Scout Troop and as a Cub Scout Den Leader. Or as a Boy Scout Troop Committee Member and a Unit Commissioner.

 

Some questions:

 

Is there a maximun number of postions that adult volunteer Scouters can register into?

 

What is the BSA policy on which registered position is considered the "Primary" registered position?

 

("Primary defined as the position where the adult volunteer Scouter actually pays the BSA membership fee)

 

Should a membership card be issued for each registered position?

 

If an adult volunteer Scouter is registered in one or more different unit (Pack, Troop, Crew) positions, AND a District or Council postion which is considered the "Primary" registered position?

 

Can an adult volunteer register in more that one District or Council position, and if so, which one would be the "Primary" registered position?

 

And as a followup to these questions, which uniform should a multiple registered (ACTUALLY registered) adult volunteer Scouter wear? Is it the uniform of the "Primary" position at all times or the uniform for the each registered position when actully participating in those other positions?

 

What I really need here are answers from someone who ACTUALLY knows what the official BSA policies are not what they think they are.

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

[Bob White]

Is there a maximun number of postions that adult volunteer Scouters can register into?

 

Over all, no, however there are some program limitations. For instance, you cannot register in two positions or more in the same unit, unless you are the COR, and then there are limitations as to what you can be.

 

What is the BSA policy on which registered position is considered the "Primary" registered position?,

 

The position where you paid your registration fee.

 

Should a membership card be issued for each registered position?

 

DSTEELE your turn!

 

If an adult volunteer Scouter is registered in one or more different unit (Pack, Troop, Crew) positions, AND a District or Council postion which is considered the "Primary" registered position?,

 

The position where you paid your registration fee.

 

Can an adult volunteer register in more that one District or Council position, and if so, which one would be the "Primary" registered position?

 

The position where you paid your registration fee.

 

And as a followup to these questions, which uniform should a multiple registered (ACTUALLY registered) adult volunteer Scouter wear? Is it the uniform of the "Primary" position at all times or the uniform for the each registered position when actully participating in those other positions?

 

Either is appropriate.

 

Bob White

 

[acco40]

Uniforms are not required, however, why not wear the uniform in question for the position you are at the time. I own multiple uniforms because I hold multiple positions.

 

I won't get into the Commissioner & Unit Leader dilema.

[Bob White]

I will add a caveat to my previous post.

 

There are some District positions that make you ineligible to hold a unit position and vice-versa.

The rules for Commissioner service do not allow you to hold a unit leadership position while a unit commissioner. The only exception is unit committee, even then only if you were on the committe PRIOR to becoming a unit commissioner.

 

Bob White

[dsteele]

Owl62 --

 

What you're about to read from me is not as binding as what you would get from your own council service center, but it is an answer to your questions from a professional scouter who has earned the "Darth Vader" knot (the black and white one) about 5 times over.

I know the BSA policies inside and out for the most part. I like to let people know what the policy is, but I've also been on the professional side of the house long enough to have formed opinions and those who ask questions of me get rulings as well as my thoughts. I can't seem to separate the two.

 

There is no maximum of the number of positions a volunteer may be multiple registered in. Bob White is correct, the only position that can be multipled (didn't know that was a verb, did you? ) within the same unit is the Chartered Organization Representative.

 

You can be a Den Leader/Assistant Scoutmaster/District Committee Memeber/ Council whatever at the same time.

 

You pay only one registration (membership fee.)

 

Bob White is also correct in that your primary registration is where you paid. However, the primary registration is also where youre main mail comes.

 

It's also where your registration "counts."

 

Primary registration can be switched betweeen positions without a transfer fee, by the registrar, as long as you're already registered in a position.

 

Let me go back to mail. All registered adults get Scouting magazine. Cubmasters, Webelos leaders, Assistant Scoutmasters and Den Leaders, get Program Helps in their Scouting Magazine -- if they are primarily registered in those positions. The magazine goes to your primary position. Scoutmasters and Assistant Scoutmasters also get Troop Program Features inserted in their Scouting Magazine.

 

Registered Commissioners get both the pack and troop program helps/features in their Scouting magazine. If their registration is primary as a commissioner. If they're riding on a unit as a committee member in their primary position they get the magazine -- but that's it.

 

The mailings from the council follow a similar vein. Some mailings are intended for all unit leaders (CM, SM, and Venturer Advisor) and usually to the commissioner staff as well, so they know what's giong on -- but the labels are printed by primary registration -- if the unit commissioner is primarily registered as a troop committee member he/she will not get the mailing.

 

 

Let me re-iterate the above by answering a question with a question.

 

The question is "Where should my primary registration be?"

 

My answer with a question is "What do you want to know?"

 

I think the best bet would be to have your primary registration, if oyu are a unit commissioner, as a commisssioner. Pay your own ten bucks a year and be on the district charter as a commissioner. Multiple everywhere else. You'll receive all the program helps in your Scouting Magazine and get all the mailings that include unit leaders in your district. You'll know what's going on. If you're only interested in what's going on in your pack/troop/crew, then register as primary there.

 

Now to the next question -- Can a membership card be issued for each registered position.

 

Yes. I don't know why you'd want that, but yes. If they can't be printed from Scoutnet, your registrar can type them by hand. My opinion is that you need only one to prove that you're a member of the Boy Scouts of America, but if you want one for each registered position, it can be done. Easily.

 

I hope I've answered where you should have your primary registration. It's up to the individual to decide. The decision, however, affects the mailing list. It really doesn't effect the numbers professionals or the council. The profession does not count adults in the membership numbers. Commissioner ratio to units counts and there is a report that counts district committee members -- we need them -- but no one has a critical achievement for the number of adults registered 12/31.

 

The question of which uniform to wear is thornier. The literal answer is to wear the uniform of your primary registration full time. The reality is that people wear the uniform of the position they're doing. I don't have a problem either way as long as they're in proper uniform when they should be. So leave the velcro on the back of the committee member and commissioner patch and switch shoulder tabs between meetings -- it doesn't bother me either way as long as you're in full uniform.

 

I hope this helps. I also hope I didn't make anyone angry. That wasn't my intent at all.

 

DS

[Owl62]

Thanks for the replies.

 

DSteele:

 

For clarification regarding Commissioners:

 

What unit postions, can a Commissioner hold or not hold and be a Commissioner? I think it was at least implied that a Commissioner can only hold unit committee positions - not SM or ASM, etc.

 

Also, if a Scouter is both a Commissioner and holds a unit registration, must the primary registration be the Commissioner position?

 

And the the same quesions as about but for District Committee?

 

 

 

Also, can a Scouter be registered as both a Unit Commissioner and a member of the District Committee? If so, which position would be primary?

 

It was said that the primary position is the one the Scouter paid the membership fee for. But who gets to decide which position is primary, the Scouter, or the District/Council?

 

I am told that the software used at National, will only accept one registered position above the unit level. Is that true?

 

About the registration cards, other than the unit roster (which in really, most unit members never see), if a Scouter does not receive a membership card, how would he or she know for sure that they are registered, especially at the Distict level or above?

 

This is important because I think that a Scouter must be registered in a position to wear the uniform of that position. But I think there are lots of Scouter out there who serve in multiple capacities but are not registered in them and still wear the uniform and insignia (Example: an Assistant Scoutmaster, who "serves" in the District Committee, but is not actually registered there - sometimes they wear the silver shoulder loops and District Committee position patch. I think that Scouters must wear uniforms and insignia ONLY for positions that they are actually registered in.?

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[dsteele]

Owl62 --

 

With your leave, (by which I mean if you don't mind) I'll answer your questions within the next 24 hours.

 

Even without your leave, I'll answer your questions within 24 hours. You have several and there are answers.

 

I do have to say, before I go to bed, that it sounds like you're wearing too many hats. Take a break is my advice. I'm not implying that you're not doing a good job -- I don't have enough information for that. I can tell you that I served as the professional for the same district for 8 years (each year we earned Quality district) but I burned out on that district. After a while, people just assumed we would get the job done simply because I was there. After I left it all fell apart. It didn't fall apart because I left, it fell apart because I was there too long -- the volunteers became used to me being the fall-back and lost all sense or responsibility.

 

I'll answer your questions tomorrow. For now, I bid you good night.

 

DS

[Mokgamen]

When councils were switched to the ScoutNet system in 1999, most local councils began to produce a membership card for each registered position (including multiples), so in many cases, people are now receiving membership cards for all of their registered roles.

 

Scouters are encouraged to wear the correct uniform for each position in which they are active. Separate shirts, or switching emblems using velcro--both are common. The loop colors and trained emblem should match the leadership position patch being worn. Unit numbers should not be worn on uniform shirts for district and council positions (except the chartered organization rep., the one position that wears silver loops and the chartered org. unit number, a very unique role as a member of the council and the liason to all units within his chartered organization).

 

Although there is no limit to the number of positions an individual can hold, practically an individual can only do a few positions well. There is a big difference between a Scouter who is registered as pack, troop, team, and crew committee chair (because the chartered org. uses one committee to supervise all 4 units), and a person trying to be a good unit commissioner and also a Scoutmaster of a troop (two roles which each involve more time commitment that a troop committee chair).

 

A unit commissioner who does a good job visiting and serving 2-4 units, who has enough drive and energy to also serve on a district committee could be also registered as a district-member-at-large. Those are two very different roles (commissioners are appointed, district members-at-large are elected annually). And maybe the person is also a merit badge counselor.

 

Mr. Steele points out something very important about where you pay your primary registration--your Scouting magazine inserts are directed at your primary position. A paid-registered unit commissioner will get inserts for both Cub Scouting and Boy Scouting.

[Proud Eagle]

Here is what is probably a dumb question...

 

Can you be registered in multiple councils at the same time?

[NWScouter]

You can be registered as a commissioner and as a unit leader at the same time. You should not serve your own unit as their commissioner but that is up to the district commissioner to assign. I served as a Scoutmaster for 10 years while serving as a unit commissioner for a Cub Pack and also I served as an Asst. District Commissioner during that time. In our Council we have many Scouters serving unit positions and District Committee and Commissioner positions.

[Bob White]

You are incorrect NWScouter. From the Commissioner Fieldbook of the BSA and on the BSA national website.

"Commissioners must not be registered simultaneously as unit leaders. Some commissioners may be registered on a unit committee because they have a son in the unit or because of previous personal history in the unit, but their principle Scouting obligation should be with commissioner responsibilities. Commissioners may be currently registered in only one commissioner position."

 

Bob White

 

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[NWScouter]

Bob White,

That the first I had heard of that rule. I as said served 10 years as a scoutmaster while serving as a commissioner. I know that many of our commissioners serve as multiples. I called our council registrar and she had never heard that rule and scoutnet allows one to be both.

So go figure.

 

[Owl62]

Bob White:

 

What is the definition of a "unit leader"?

 

To my knowledge in say a Boy Scout Troop, registered adult leaders include:

 

Chartered Organization Representative

Troop Committee Chairman

Committee Member(s)

Scoutmaster

Assistant Scoutmaster(s)

and maybe:

Physican and Chaplain

 

Which of those are "Unit Leaders"? Unless it is defined somewhere in BSA policies, I interpret a unit leader in a Boy Scout Troop to be the Scoutmaster.???

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

[Eamonn]

It seems that we have he answers to all the technical parts of the question.

I seem to have lost a few friends in our district as I went out of my way to knock a few hats off.

I know that at times we all take too much on.

You only have to look at my profile to see that I'm wearing one hat too many.

However I think that the most important role or job in Scouting is that of a Unit Leader.

The job or role of both the District and the Council is to support the unit.

When we have unit leaders serving on the District and Council are they serving and supporting themselves?

Some Scouters seem to take great pride in telling me how many "Hats" that they "Have" to wear.

Sad to say some have got a little upset when I asked them to step down from the District.

Some have got mad when I have asked people with no or very little Scouting background to step into District positions.

One even asked me if I had landed from Mars.

He didn't laugh when I said "No - England."

We also have to look at what happens when the person who is wearing all the hats is no longer active?

When my finance chair steps down. I will be looking for one person to fill one position. Not ten people to fill ten positions.

There are those who will say that if it's not broke don't fix it.

I will say that as long as we are doing too many jobs or filling too many positions that we are preventing someone else from coming on board.

Just the thoughts of someone who needs to practice what he is preaching.

I will step down from the Training Chair. At the end of this year. But will be joining the Region. I did try !!

Eamonn

[Proud Eagle]

Eamonn,

 

Someone would have to be nuts to think what you are trying to do is bad. So long as you are filling positions with people capable of doing them, you sound like you are right on target. It would be great if there was no need for people to fill multiple positions within Scouting. However, I think we all know that is sometimes necessary to get the job done. So while it may not technically be allowed to be a unit leader and a unit commissioner, there are times that is necessary to get the job done. The same could be said of any number of other situations. If you make delivering a quality program to the boys priority one I can't see how you could go very far astray.