What causes racial hatred: racists or racial friction?

[JosephMorgan]

SST: Why can't people hang out with those who are similar to them (race, culture, religion, career, hobbies, sports)?

 

The idea is that whites will be better off in places like Ireland, Sweden, and America when they are a minority surrounded by people from Africa and Asia.

 

The idea has not been really tested yet, in terms of whites creating a more enriched society via multi-culturalism, but let's hope that this experiment is a good idea, because there is no going back if it turns out to be a disaster.

[Zahnada]

scoutldr,

 

You said: "When given the choice, I check the box for "native American." I was born in Pennsylvania, so I guess that describes me. It doesn't ask for the nationality of my ancestors. "

 

I don't agree with this at all. You can rationalize all you want, but you know what race "Native American" implies. You know what people will assume when they read a form from a "Native American." In this sense, you are misrepresenting yourself and therefore you are lying. If you must protest against the ethnicity section of forms, then don't fill it out or write in "Not Applicable" or something. Don't pretend to be something you're not because you know that "Native American" refers to "American Indian."

 

As to you comments about the boys at the DMV, you know what I find strangely amusing? There's something funny about middle-class, white boys acting out the stereotypes of other races. That's what I see all the time.

[OldGreyEagle]

Zahnada,

 

I dont know if you meant to do this, or maybe you did.

 

One could make the argument that you are excusing the behavior of the group in the DMV because of the behavior of middle class white boys and I dont understand that. Then again, I may have misunderstood you.

 

As far as why there is racial hatred, the best explanation is the song Savages from Disneys Pocahontas, I think it says it all

 

Ratcliffe:

What can you expect

From filthy little heathens?

Their whole disgusting race is like a curse

Their skins are hellish red

They're only good when dead

They're vermin as I said and worse

 

English settlers:

They're savages! Savages!

 

Ratcliffe:

Barely even human!

 

English settlers:

Savages! Savages!

 

Ratcliffe:

Drive them from our shore!

They're not like you and me

Which means they must be evil

We must sound the drums of war!

 

English settlers:

They're savages! Savages!

Dirty redskinned devils!

Now we sound the drums of war!

 

Powhatan:

This is what we feared

The paleface is a demon

The only thing they feel at all is greed

 

Kekata:

Beneath that milky hide

There's emptiness inside

 

Native Americans:

I wonder if they even bleed

They're savages! Savages!

Barely even human!

Savages! Savages!

 

Powhatan:

Killers at the core!

 

Kekata:

They're different from us

Which means they can't be trusted

 

What to do about it? I dont know, I am open to suggestion.

 

[Zahnada]

OGE,

 

Sorry for the confusion. The behavior is unacceptable no matter who does it. I actually forgot if I had a point in that particular paragraph. In any case, such racial stereotypes like the "black gangsta" are used by multiple races. Does that still mean they're racial stereotypes? Just a thought.

[Eamonn]

What is the cause of racial hatred ...

Racial hatred is caused by:

Ignorance.

There is no way that I can agree that diversity in any way helps to give credence to the idea that it breeds disharmony.

This Tribal stuff is a bunch of gobbledygook.

When we offer everyone the same opportunities, and refuse to accept any form of discrimination, we will see that racism, will go away.

The more we seek to be as diverse as possible the sooner this will happen.

In our Law we state, "To Help Other People.."

Not white people or black people.

When my Dad left Ireland seeking work in England, he was met with signs "No Irish Need Apply"

As a teenager in England, there were gangs of whites and blacks, who went "Paki-Bashing" Beating up Indian and Pakistanis.

Not too many years before the parents of these white kids were moving because the West Indian and Jamaicans were moving in.

Much as we try to dress racism up it is discrimination plain and simple - The way to get rid of it is easy - Don't do it.

[dsteele]

I'm watching Condoleeza Rice on Meet the Press at this very moment. I think the only reason it occurred to me that she's an Afican American woman is this thread.

 

I am so proud to be an american when I see her. I find her incredibly intelligent and a strong leader of our people. She is an excellent example of an american. I don't care about her race or gender.

 

I know that some would be against her because of her gender. Some would be against her because of her race. Some would be against her because President Bush chose her.

 

But, I, for one, think she's a great example and see only a National Security Advisor doing the job.

 

Is that so much to ask? It's not race that makes her good or bad, it isn't gender, it isn't looks . . . it's the mind and the thoughts behind it that make her great.

 

I don't understand this racism thing. I truly don't.

 

Not that I have any desire to understand it.

 

I just wish everyone was as ignorant of it as I am.

 

DS

[matuawarrior]

IGNORANCE.

 

 

 

[evmori]

I gotta agree with whoever posted "racial hatred is learned". People aren't born hating others. This is taught. Usually by their parents.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[jbroganjr]

Is it taught or is it just learned?

I believe we should judge people by the content of their character and their actions.

But racism is also learned from other groups/cultures,etc. Today, there is "white guilt" or down with the white guy, even evidence on TV, but the repeated showing of "Dad" being the dumbest guy on earth (Something about Raymond comes to mind).

There is subtle as well as overt racism against Blacks, Asians, every sprectrum, as well as religion (Jew,Christian, Muslim).

And in all of this, predujice is practiced in subset against the same. A "keep down the Joneses" type behavior.

And ignorance is a cause, emotional response another, cultural shaped behavior too.

The answer is that I do not think we will ever eliminate prejudice from the human condition, but through openness, character and perserverance, WE CAN eradicate racism. World wide, who knows, but I like to think tha the greatest country in the world could strive to do this. Multiculturism is not the way though, it only breeds separatism. I stand the multiculturism argument on its head this way, as the reaction tend to be the same for most people. When a "white" based organiztion or church, sets up their own neighborhood (compound) and expounds upon the belief that they must remain separate for their own religious or cultural believes, most of the U.S. automatically sees this group as (insert your own perception here)______________. Extremists, Religious Nuts, Racists, etc.

My point is that the argument for multiculturism does not support this Hypothetical group to be their own thing,rather it warns against their hegemony, all the while multiculturists, speaking out of the other side of their mouth, proclaim the inherant rights of (again insert your choice here)___________ of latins, mexicans, asians, black, martians, plutonians, trekkies, to have their own distinct culture.

 

Assimilation and blending of cultures is the answer. As the NINA (No Irish Need Apply), which was prevelant in the N.E., not just England example shows, the Irish assimalated into the culture, eventually working within the system to bring about change. One highpoint, the election of the first Catholic, Irish American President, JFK.

 

I think having separate languages in this country only serves to hold back spanish or vietmanese citizens from realizing the benefits of the country. Another example of multiculturism.

 

If we could all live side by side, seeing no color, accepting the benefits other cultures bring to the pot, and working forward to bring the lightness of justice and equality to all, what a wonderful world.

Like DS, I do not see color in people. I see who they are and go from there. I find it wonderful to share differences of U.S. culture with cultures from other lands and from different cultures here in the U.S.

 

Yeah, the U.S. is not the panacea that it could be, but we could be alot worse.

 

All man are created equal... lets let everyone know that

[evmori]

Taught or learned makes no difference. People aren't born to hate.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Rooster7]

Jbroganjrs post is excellent. I can relate to his thoughts. I have a few more though

 

IGNORANCE is a popular refrain when this question is posed (what causes racial hatred?), but I dont buy it.

 

Here are three other possibilities for racial hatred

 

Evil (i.e., Adolph Hitler, KKK)

Envy (i.e., Muslim extremists, Non-Jews in Germany prior to WW II)

Exploitation (i.e., slave traders, contemporary politicians Al Sharpton, just to name one).

 

Ignorance may be true for some. However, many folks just like to hate. Adolph Hitler was not ignorant. Many white supremacists are not ignorant. Many Muslim extremists are not ignorant. ETC.

 

Of course, the root cause is always evil. Even the Archie Bunker types cant plead ignorance their whole lives. The fact is - most folks just want to blame someone else for their situation in life. Unfortunately, to truly see how evil this is, sometimes it takes extreme examples like Hitler. I dont like the refrain ignorance because its an excuse. That is to say, it implies that with a little education, a guy like Adolph Hitler would have came around and realized his wrong thinking. I just dont buy it. Similarly, I dont buy the bad education, the bad neighborhood, or the bad society arguments which many use today to invoke sympathy for the murder, rapist, drug dealer, etc. You know the guy the one who just needs a fair shot to prove himself. The guy that all of society should feel bad aboutthe one that YOU caused to shoot, rape, or torture someone else. Ridiculous. Accountability now theres a concept that I sink my angry white teeth into. ;-)

 

In regard to religious bigotry, while I agree that it exists I dont believe it can always be put into the same category as race. What I mean to say is this. Religion is about beliefs. If Im a Muslim, by definition, I believe Christians are infidels and worthy of contempt (read the Koran). Likewise, if Im a Christian, by definition, I believe non-believers are going to hell (read the Bible). However, in the case of a Christian, this does not mean I should hate all others. Quite the opposite, we are called to love the world, our enemies included. Yet, some folks like to portray Christians as hateful because of Gods Word, which foretells the outcome for those who reject Him. This has nothing to do with hate or bigotry on the part of the Christian.

 

[littlebillie]

the only real way to achieve a true world community is to establish and nurture a true commnity of children. And NOT something established according to community demographics to reflect the composition of some particular city or town, but a school ommunity with equal numbers of as many different folks as you can get. just using raw, unbalanced numbers can unduly influence a developing world view.

 

as many black kids as white as brown as yellow as red as whatever.

 

the racial stuff is easy if you start kids early AND if parents are willing to sacrifice their own prejudices for a better future. yes - many are. sadly - many aren't.

 

it's religion that becomes a larger problem. all folks are brothers? yeah that's easy enough. but if your holy book says kill the infidel, and mine says turn the other cheek - well, that particular example gets resolved pretty quickly, I guess, but you see where it goes.

 

a truly devout person, seeking to live up to the letter of God's law, well... "thou shalt not suffer a witch to live" certainly justifies Salem, and indeed, is all the proof needed for the existence of witches. (Well, unless they've ALL been killed off...) we can learn to be skinblind, but the God thing is a LOT tougher...

[KoreaScouter]

Most of us, left to our own devices, will stick with people and things that are familiar to us, or we think we have something in common with. Conversely, we'll hold at arm's length anything that seems different or unlike us. Racism? Probably not, in most cases. Racial hatred? Certainly not, same rationale.

 

Want an example of different races, ethnic groups, and cultures combining and thriving together? Look no further than our armed forces. It's been that way the whole 26 years I've served. You learn real quick that interdependency, teamwork, and shared goals are color-blind -- and by the way, they also don't care where your grandparents came from, or how you worship God.

 

My kids have always lived, played, and gone to school with kids from all racial, religious, and ethnic groups; many interracial families everywhere we've lived (mine included), and it's not an issue. Everywhere we've lived, a snapshot of the local kids at sports, school, or Scouts always looks like a Benneton ad. It's not strange for us, it's normal. Sometimes I've felt guilty for moving my kids from the U.S. to Asia, to Europe, back to Asia, etc., etc., because they were missing out on what American kids who've never had to move away from their neighborhood have had -- a certain stability. I don't think I'll feel guilty any more.

 

Getting along with other people is natural, unless someone or something makes us un-learn it.

 

KS

[JosephMorgan]

Korea: Getting along with other people is natural, unless someone or something makes us un-learn it.

 

I wish that was the case, then the racial hatred that is increasing in America would not be happening.

 

America is Balkanizing. If we are to make multi-culturalism work, we need to honestly undertand what causes racial hatred. Racists are the symptom caused by racial friction. Racial friction is created when 2 or more races are trying to share the same territory.

[jbroganjr]

"I wish that was the case, then the racial hatred that is increasing in America would not be happening. "

I don't know what country you are talking about here. I, the pessimist of this forum, choose to see the glass half full. IN the wake of 9/11, where any muslims rounded up and sent to detention camps, i.e. the Japanese Americans, many of whom where born in the U.S.?

While there where isolated incidents of hate against muslims, in a country of our size and population, the number of those incidents where statistically insignigicant.

If you look at the economic power of minorities in this country, in the year 2003 and compare it to the 1970's, the increase in the standard of living and education of all minorities is beyond compare. If we had the racial hatred you allude to falsely, this would not be a reality.

 

"America is Balkanizing. If we are to make multi-culturalism work, we need to honestly undertand what causes racial hatred. Racists are the symptom caused by racial friction. Racial friction is created when 2 or more races are trying to share the same territory. "

Uh, you really don't make a lot of sense here. Multi culturalism is a balkanizing process. In fact, I would argue that multi culturalism is a mutation of the philosophy behind Jim Crow laws. When groups do not assimate and change into a new form of society, then you end up with multiculturims, which is to say separate but equal. I argue that we are all equal and should not be separate. Yes we will disagree. The founding father s of our country disagreed for months on the form of the government. And if you want ot argue tha tthey did not get it perfect, I'll accede that point, but remind you that their imperfect gov. is still the best model in the world.

Do not mistake the friction as hate. Friction is a natural occurence that has to occur for change to take place. What I mean to say is that in order for the pain of change to occur, the pain of staying the same has to become more unbearable than the pain of change.

 

Multiculturim, today, speaks the message that a certain group of this country should be guilty or made to feel guilty for things beyond their control or responsibility. It further states that folks have to give up what is rightfully theirs to groups that have no claim or merit to those rights, properties.

The law of this land is the measure by which we enforce the equality of all. It is the duty of the citizens of this land to protect the rights and equalness of the land, balanced by the good of the Nation.

One could argue the point, as I was involved with in college, many moons ago about rights. The Bill of Rights grants the freedom of speech. If you truly throw yourself behind that argument, then youwill also have to defend the group that wants to limit your speech as part of their right to free speech. Quite the conundrum, same is true with establishing equality, as different cultures will have different views on what is acceptable to them and not acceptable to the other groups that make up society.

Thus we have Americana, which is the on going process of assimilation of other cultures practices and beliefs. As the certain of these beliefs are accepted into the American Culture, the culture changes, mostly for good. The friction arises out the the discarding of cultural beliefs that do not make up the fabric of American Society.

There are cultures here today, where it is accepted and normal to be secretive and the broader base of America Society, where openness is a key ingredient, find this behavior unacceptable. That does not mean that the greater society then should all change to encourage secretiveness, rather, that the process in which a medium is met, will just be a bit more arduous.

 

Another turning point in our society, as it pertains to racial tension is the ongoing change with affirmative action. Affirmative action is a process that was needed badly to balance the scales of equality in the last couple of decades, but I also believe that it may have outlived its usefulness. A quota system (also a multiculturistic tool) now only serves to create doubt about the equality of the candidates involved with a selection process, either acadamic or commercially based. All people should look to have their talents based on merit and accomplishment, not the color of their skin or the language they speak. That said, the laws of the land and the education of equality and the effort to eradicate the bigotry behind the hatred must be stepped up, openly to encourage an equal based system.

Most of the studies I have read, and there are a lot of them with the Supreme court case concering Michigan, show that the basis of data the muliticulturists rely on are faulty and many times purposely skewed to support a theory.

Michigan has actually found that after 4 years, the student body was less likely to intergrate with other segments of society.

In fact, multiculturism and its advocates have been screaming like chicken little since this junk sociology first appeared about how bad things are. i choose again to see the positive gains towards equality. I also know that this is ahard road and this obstacle must be scaled to get behind it. Your view about balkanization is the choice of not taking this straight on, but finding a path around this obstacle and I am afraid you and the other mutliculturist have gotten lost somewhere.

 

America has learned a great deal about hate and has always sought ways to address the injustices committed in this land. From the Salem Trials to the Iraq War, there are far more examples of how the people and leadershp of this land have change the laws and as a result society itself to right the boat. From the abomination of slavery to the cruel Jim Crow Laws, to the abuse of Native Americas (Hawiians and Inuit included) to the total debasement of the asian workers (who built the west by the way and then where shipped home), This country, maybe not in the most timely fashion has found its way to correct the wrongs of the afflicted. Compare that record of the short time this country has been in existance to other world powers, whether it be the Roman empire, the Mongel empire, the Japanese and chinese dynastys to todays Europe, like France or Germany where racial tension and hate crimes, by population, far outweigh any thing in the U.S.