Smoking and campouts

[Ryon_Nayr@email.com]

The adults in my troop frequently smoke near scouts. Me, Being an Asmatic, am annoyed by this. It causes me to have asthma problems. My Question is this; is there are BSA regulations About adults smoking by scouts? Also, If you know of any BSA books that mention the topic, please mention them. Thanks

[dan]

It saddens me to tell you that the BSA does not have a rule for non-smoking. The Charted Organization decides this issue.

The Guide to Safe Scouting says that scouting SHOULD be done smoke free, here is the excerpt.

 

All Scouting functions, meetings, and activities should be conducted on a smoke-free basis, with smoking areas located away from all participants.

 

You can find the Guide to Safe Scouting Here, http://www.scouting.org/nav/enter.jsp?c=xds&terms=Guide+to+Safe+Scouting&x=16&y=12

Go to www.scouting.org and you can download the Guide.

 

[Bob White]

Actually what the current Guide to Safe Scouting, section IV, says is "The Boy Scouts of America prohibits the use of alcoholic beverages and controlled substances at encampments or activities on property owned and/or operated by the Boy Scouts of America, or at any activity involving participation of youth members."

 

"Adult leaders should support the attitude that young adults are better off without tobacco and may not allow the use of tobacco products at any BSA activity involving youth participants."

 

Now keep in mind that Bold type means it is unalterable policy and that violation of policy can lead to permanent revocation of your adult membership and exposure to financial loss from civil lawsuits. There has been some discussion on this board and others as to whether "may not" means shouldn't or can't. In talking to the powers that be at national due to a local situation I can tell you what I was told. The BSA has no power to punish adults who are not registered members of the BSA , but if a leader uses drugs, alcohol, tobacco or misuses controlled substance in front of scouts at a youth activity they can expect to get a warning to stop and on the next offense have their membership revoked. An adult member that allows other adults to use the above named products in front of scouts at a scout activity will be warned and then on the next offense have their membership revoked.

 

I think that makes the rule clear for everyone who might want to dance with semantics in order to these habits to youth.

 

Bob White

 

[dan]

Bob

What I posted was off of the BSA web site, and what I posted and you posted say the same thing.

may not allow

and

should

means the same thing.

 

"Adult leaders SHOULD support the attitude that young adults are better off without tobacco and MAY NOT allow the use of tobacco products at any BSA activity involving youth participants."

 

[bt01]

Smoking should not be allowed on any Scout Active. If the Parents have to smoke, they should do when the scouts are not present.

 

 

 

[Ryon_Nayr@email.com]

Thanks for all your help. Wish me luck at mondays metting

[evmori]

While Bob makes a valid point that the bold type is unalterable policy, the words may not do not mean will not. Bob & I have gone round & round and someone even sent a previous thread to my DE. My DE called me & told me while the words are in bold print the wording is not definitive. Therefore, the powers that be in my neck of the woods disagree with Bob's powers that be.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Bob White]

so evmori,

Are you saying that prohibiting the use of alcohol, tobacco and controlled substances in front of scouts on a scouting activity is a good rule or a bad rule?

 

BW

[scoutldr]

I just taught Youth Protection and NLE yesterday...the policy presented in the videos is clear, "the use of alcohol, tobacco or illegal drugs is not permitted at any Scouting activity", and that "smoking areas must be out of sight of any program area."

[NJCubScouter]

First, let me say that I think smoking should be prohibited at all Scouting events, period. That should dispel any questions about my motivation in saying that the rule language quoted by BobWhite is NOT clear. Why don't they just come out and say it the way I said it: Smoking is prohibited at Scouting events and activities. They can leave off the period.

 

The only time I have seen this a smoking policy in writing was in the Cub Scout Leader Book, and it had language that was different from what BobWhite quoted, and it indicated that smoking was NOT prohibited. It said something like, smoking in the presence of boys is "strongly discouraged," or something like that. I don't know if it has been changed, but if it has, they need to take all of the statements about smoking and make them consistent.(This message has been edited by NJCubScouter)

[sctmom]

Ryon,

Do the adults know you have asthma and how the smoke affects you? There are putting you in serious danger.

 

I don't think they should smoke around any scouts but they really need to know that some people can NOT be around smoke due to medical problems.

 

[evmori]

Actually Bob, I didn't say either way. I don't feel alcohol, drugs and controlled substances should be lumped in the same catagory as tobacco.

 

Alcohol, drugs & most controlled substances can (and usually do) immediate danger. Tobacco on the other hand only poses a danger to the user. I know all the theories about 2nd hand smoke.

 

So to answer your question Al, I think it is a good rule. I also feel if the BSA wants to prohibit smoking, they should day so and not say may not.

 

And don't forget, the policy only addresses activities where youth are present. So, if there are no youth, light 'em up!

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Bob White]

So Evmori,

If you think it is a good rule but you feel the language can be interpreted in different ways WHY do you not interpret it in the most positive way (which you say you support) that has the greatest benefit to the youth.

 

Why do you choose to dance with words and give less experienced leaders the wrong impression of your position?

 

Why do you choose to poison the well? This is not about the wording of the policy, this is about your personal choice in insert controversy, rather than protect the scouts through supporting what you know is the intent of the rule.

 

BW(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Twocubdad]

Boy: "May I have a cookie?"

 

Dad: "You may not."

 

Parent: "May I smoke?"

 

Leader: "You may not."

 

Where is the ambiguity? In which English-speaking country do they interpret the father/leader's response to mean "have one if you want to."

[Bob White]

I'm with you on this Twocubdad. Personally, I have never met anyone who did not understand what this policy is. So if anyone who chooses to pick on the wording agrees with the intent, why can't they just support the behaviour rather than dance with the wording?

 

It is a mystery to me.

 

BW