This has a familiar ring to it

[firstpusk]

"Firstpusk before you get your liberal shots in. I am not a conservative or any other title you want to say let me say this I believe that any group has the right to establish their own standards of leadership like the Scouts do."

 

For someone who claims to take offense at being labled, you sure are fast to apply them to someone else. Didn't call you a conservative. The issue in the Dale vs. BSA was different. The Supreme Court found in favor of the BSA because it was a private organization. Here we have a group asking for public support that wants to exclude. IVF is asking for support from a government entity and then wants to discriminate on the basis of religion. The 1st amendment don't bend that way big guy. The establishment of religion by government is the one the founders found most fearful. It was the basis of the religous wars in Europe they sought to avoid here.

 

"If a group claims to be Christian and is forced to have Non Christian Leaders then that group has effectivey shortchanged."

 

But a student that is forced to pay for and can't participate in IVF is not shortchanged? Oh, that's right, they don't qualify as full citizens in the IVF world because unless you think the way they do, you aren't qualified. In their world, most Christians aren't Christians.

 

"But hey lets see if the Clinton News Network will report on this story. I don't think so."

 

The second time Mr. Don't-Label-Me seeks to apply a label to someone else. If CNN doesn't report it, it is simply because you have no story here. Just a bunch of talk radio claptrap.

[littlebillie]

firstpusk,

 

"BSA was different. The Supreme Court found in favor of the BSA because it was a private organization. Here we have a group asking for public support that wants to exclude."

 

Um... has the BSA given up all public support, free use of lands and facilities, whatnot? I hadn't been aware of that. Was that announced at the website? Couldn't find it...?

[evmori]

My point is there are other groups on college campuses that exclude certain people for various reasons & they are still allowed to exist and are still funded by the student paid activity fees.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[firstpusk]

"Um... has the BSA given up all public support, free use of lands and facilities, whatnot? I hadn't been aware of that. Was that announced at the website? Couldn't find it...?"

 

IVF is receiving a share of dollars. In this instance it is different from the situation with the BSA. Maybe your council is getting money from the county, mine certainly isn't.

 

"My point is there are other groups on college campuses that exclude certain people for various reasons & they are still allowed to exist and are still funded by the student paid activity fees."

 

If they are getting student service fees, they are liable to the same exclusion as IVF. The article made some claims, but they were not supported.

 

 

[evmori]

littlebillie,

So what if the BSA receives public money or free use of public lands? Where does it say they can't get this? Obviously there are some public organizations who think the BSA is worth funding!

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[scomman]

Twocubdad I agree with you on your latest post on this.

 

Everyone show me in any article that they are asking for money every time I read both posts it doesn't say anything about money just recognition from the Universities.

[littlebillie]

evmori,

 

dude, regardless of where I stand on THAT issue, don't tell me - firstpusk was saying that the BSA was different from an organization that wants to exclude AND wants 'public support'. Free use of any publically owned facility or resource (meeting halls, school auditoriums, national forests, local campgrounds, whatever) that others are charged for IS public support.

 

firstpusk, the BSA does indeed receive public support in the kinds listed. even if it doesn't happen in your county, I'm surprised that you're unaware of these matters overall.

[acco40]

Regardless of the facts (as is so often the case) the Supreme Court of the USA has deemed the BSA to be a private organization and as such, can set exclusionary membership requirements.

 

Public universities are funded by taxpayers, fees, private donations, corporate donations, etc. As public institutions, they need to follow certain laws. Can a man join the Volleyball team at State U? In most cases no. Can a woman join the football team at State U? In most cases yes, but not many would become defensive tackles.

 

I don't believe that organizations (clubs, to put it loosely) that de facto exclude certain students (from membership or leadership) should receive monetary support from public institutions. Should an elementary school allow a cub scout den to use a classroom after hours? Some do, some don't and the law profession if profitting from this dilema.

 

My opinion, Universities should tolerate many different and diverse thoughts. Certain actions, they should have a slightly more discriminitory attitude. Closing membership and or leadership to select students should not be encouraged.