Society's attitude toward children

[evmori]

If you get the ACLU involved, it will only get messed up.

 

I Like the idea of going to the local papers & TV stations.

 

It seems the mass is being punished because of the actions of the few. Not a good way to deal with things.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[sctmom]

There are not being denied access to the bathroom, just have to go to the front office and use the one bathroom up there. It's could be a long walk if you gotta go NOW! And I know a lot of kids who wait until the last minute or just don't get "early warning signals".

 

[NJCubScouter]

Well Sctmom, as a recently-appointed and trained member of my local school board (I'm still waiting for my "Trained" patch ) I have to advocate that you continue up the "chain of command" before you go picketing or to the newspapers, or worse yet, suing anybody. (Which I suspect you have no plans to do.) If the principal is being unreasonable, there is probably no point in going to the PTO. However, the principal has a boss, whether he/she is called the superintendent, assistant superintendent or some other administrator. There may be more than one level of bureacracy above the principal. In my district, people would probably go straight to the superintendent on something like this, because it doesn't really fall within any particular person's cubbyhole. Then, if that administrator does not return your call within a reasonable time, or gives you the same answer as the principal, it is time to go to the school board. Some people like to call a school board member, others just show up at the next school board meeting and speak during the appropriate portion of the meeting. If your board is anything like mine, the first thing they will want to know is that you have gone up the chain of command to the chief school administrator, and have not gotten satisfaction.

 

And of course if that fails, you can "go public." Considering what the issue is about, I'd hate to think what you might write on the picket signs if you are really irate. (Just kidding, I am sure you mind your manners at all times.)

[OldGreyEagle]

Ah, picketing the school grounds, takes me back to me roots in the 60's. Except instead of "Heck no, we wont go" the signs will say "What the heck, let them go" or "Just say Go"(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

[ScoutParent]

Director of Pupil Services; if they aren't the right person they can direct you to the right one. You could also speak to the school psychologist about the negative impact this time of attitude has on children and the practical ramifications to locking them out of the bathrooms.

[sctmom]

I do happen to know the school board member from our part of the county. Don't know him well, but enough that he has stopped and spoke and recognizes me. I also know a middle school assistant principal from a neighboring county. Wow, the contacts you make in Scouting and at church!

 

 

I am trying to decipher the school district website to figure out what the chain of command is. Man, I should have made those Webelos learn that last year for the Scholar badge!

 

The PTO is for fundraising and teacher appreciation.

 

The overall attitude is what is really steaming me. The attitude of "we don't have to tell you what we do" and the attitude that an 11 year old can't go down the hall alone. I think all of us in scouting know that if you get a child age-approriate responsibility, they will rise to the occasion. If you treat them like imbeciles, they will also rise to the occasion.

 

The kindergardeners walk to the bathroom alone! Yet, the 6th graders can't? When my son was in 1st grade the teachers did have to take the liquid soap out of the boy's bathroom because the boys found out if you put it on the floor you can slide very well! They didn't ban the bathroom, they just carried the soap to the boys or made them wash their hands in the classroom. Not a big to do, just handle it.

 

I feel that as a taxpayer and a parent, the school staff work for ME. They should keep me informed and want my opinion. This woman made it clear that SHE was in CHARGE and I needed to get with the program.

 

grrrr

 

Picket signs --- Got restrooms? Has your child got to go today?

I also like the "just say go".

 

[evmori]

sctmom,

I think school district officials forget where their paychecks come form - Us - the Taxpayers. You have a right to know why things are done that effect your child.

 

Both of my kids (now age 21 & 17) are deaf. When we put them in regular school we were always questioning why. That's are job as a parent. My kids knew if they were being treated unfairly we would be there for them. Naturally, we didn't stick our noses in the normal day to day stuff but we were and still are very vocal. My wife & I feel this has helped our kids be self advocates for themselves.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[sctmom]

Ed,

I grew up going to a private school that my parents helped found. My parents were always involved. Now, as a kid, I was embarrased to see my father show up at school but that only happened a few times. I told my sister I should tell these school people if they don't behave I'll get my family after them, hehehe.

 

My son is also learning to stand up and ask questions. He is in an "elective" class called study skills. He already knows everything they are doing in this class. He is doing the work even though it is a repeat for him. After 6 weeks, he went on his own to the teacher and explained that he knows this stuff, is doing yet again in another class and would like to change to Technology. The teacher said "no, we can't do that until January". I was so proud of my son for taking the initiave. Yet, his friend screwed around in the class, so they took him out and moved him to P.E. Even my 11 year old realizes this is backwards! Screw up, go to fun class, do well, stay in boring class.

 

My favorite story about my parents talking to school administrators is about my mother. She was running the lunch room that year at the school. We had a coach that talked mean to students and called them "piss ants" among other things. One day he had my sister's P.E. class cleaning up the football field. My sister said there were ants in the clump of grass she picked up and she threw it down. He called her a "pissant". The next day my mother cornered this guy. My mother is about 5'6" and this man was about the same size. My mother told him quietly and calmly "I don't want to EVER hear you call ANY student a pissant again. I sleep with one of the board members and will have YOUR JOB!" He backed away like a whipped puppy.

He wasn't smart enough to know she meant she sleeps with her husband! We were the only people within 50 miles with that last name!

 

[rlculver415]

One other thing -

 

Repeated enforced restraining of bladder and bowel functions can have an unhealthy effect on a person's physical well-being, least of which is an increased incidence of bladder infections. Another wee weapon to add to your arsenal of arguments...(pun intended)

 

 

[ScoutParent]

How about a call to Children and Youth Protective Services or the Health Department for information on this topic? They might be able to take care of it with one phone call to the school district. I also agree that you as a parent have the right to be informed. This is not the proper way to teach children to behave. Is it so hard to institute a hall pass policy? While teacher's contracts may preclude them from monitoring bathrooms there is no policy that would exclude the PTO from setting up a volunteer program or the school district from utilizing a teacher's aid or monitor for this purpose.

 

 

It's funny to me how the schools complain that they are stuck parenting many of the children but when a parent is involved and asks questions then they give the response you are experiencing. They are so used to giving the orders to kids they really don't realize they need to answer to people as well. Have you spoken to the school nurse? That may be another avenue to pursue.

 

[NJCubScouter]

After reading the suggestion about going to a youth-protective services-type agency, or the board of health, I guess I need to be more emphatic about my earlier advice. Sctmom, I think you should call the superintendent of the school district, and then if that does not produce results, call the person you know on the school board. If you feel more comfortable calling the person you know first, that's ok, but do not be surprised if he refers you to the superintendent. In my state, I as a school board member would be required to do that. (New Jersey School Board Member Code of Ethics, Point 10: "I will refer all complaints to the chief administrative officer and will act on such complaints at public meetings only after failure of an administrative solution.") So the chain of command thing in my state is not just a suggestion, it's the law.

 

Now, if you have gone to the web site and the chain of command is a tangle, there is no reason not to call the school board member and ask for help. There is nothing wrong with mentioning the events you have attended together. Tell him what the issue is, and ask him, not to intervene, but to just tell you who is the correct person to talk to. Believe me, I would love to get calls like that -- not the comments I do get at places like Cub Scout meetings, which are more along the lines of "I don't like (fill in complaint about the schools), can't you do something about it?" If it's a global issue, maybe I can do something about it. But if it's something about their school, what I'd like to know is, what have they done about it. Of course, I am more diplomatic than that, after all, if I decide to continue with this madness, I will actually have to run for election next spring.

 

The one thing I would not want to see as a school board member would be a letter from youth and family services or the board of health to the superintendent, asking about a situation that neither the administration or the board were given an opportunity to address first. I would really be offended that the school district was being made to look bad, when the proper steps had not been taken to seek corrective action from the district leadership and ultimately, the citizens elected to oversee it. You did the right thing by going to the principal, now you just need to keep going. If the administration and the board turn you down, then more drastic, and embarrassing, actions are appropriate.

 

I really did not mean to turn this into a lecture. Sctmom, I know you well enough by now to know that you would not do what ScoutParent is suggesting anyway. But I will freely admit that her suggestion touched a raw nerve with me, because I can very easily see myself in the shoes of your friendly local school board members. Because of things that have happened since I was appointed (not involving me personally), let's just say that opening up the local newspaper every morning has become a new kind of experience.

 

(Uhoh, 3 smileys in 1 post, I hope that doesn't break the rule.)

 

A final word, Sctmom, if you do go all the way up to the school board and you get the same attitude that you did from the principal, then maybe you have a problem in your school district that goes deeper than bathroom policies. Can you guess what my suggestion would be then? It has nothing to do with picket signs, just the signs on your neighbors' lawns next election time, with your name on them!

 

(That's 4!)

[DeLukas]

(It's nice to see everyone on this forum agree and not fighting )

 

I think it's fair to say some of the rules in place are just stupid. However, getting people in power to change is always difficult. Gladly, I know most parents become powerful crusaders for small causes when it their child is affected. Good Luck.