The ladies are inside....

[SagerScout]

OK, I'm registered as an ASM for our troop. My husband and I took the only two boys in the troop that wanted to go to summer camp. I completed my SM training, including the outdoor elements a couple of years ago, and on a separate subject I'm a fully trained Girl Scout leader and on the council training team for the GSUSA. I conducted JLT for the troop's Junior Leaders using the JLT training kit, except that the scoutmaster's sons did not come as two out of three of them were ill that day.

 

So, as I came up to our scout meeting place (the SM's house),wearing my full uniform and ready for a meeting, the SM smiled in his friendly and welcoming manner (not being sarcastic, he's a genuinely nice guy that I like) and said "The ladies are inside visiting...just go on in..."

 

Sigh.

 

There are some other differences in leadership style between us, and I'm trying to be as diplomatic as possible about them. The biggest thing is that he really, really is protective about the boys and to me it communicates a lack of trust in their good sense and abilities. Example: We're talking about selling popcorn. He tells his boys, (ages 14 and 16) that they are NOT to go door-to-door selling without him or Mom, even in teams, as it "just isn't safe." These are not little kids! We're talking six foot tall and 240 pounds! Their neighborhood is older and modest but not bad. I'd let my son sell there, with a couple of buddies and a cell phone, in a heartbeat. Interestingly, his wife thinks he's way overprotective too.

 

Obviously, patrol activities without adults are not going to happen anytime soon as this SM is never going to approve them (if a 16 yearold can't sell popcorn on his own city block I can't imagine what patrol activities would be considered ok!) I have trouble getting the SM to let the boys light their own cooking fires and camp stoves. I don't mean to brag on my girl scouts, but they are all accomplished at these skills before middle school. Again, we are not talking about Wolf Cubs here, but kids that in other countries would already be helping support their families.

 

I do NOT want to leave this troop as we all totally enjoy the boys and adults there, but I can't figure out how to foster the level of independence I think is appropriate with this SM's attitude- and since he's trying to keep me in the sitting room with the wimmenfolk it's gonna be even harder.

 

I have asked my hubby to help as he's on the same page as I am, but he has not done his training yet and he's kind of new in Scouting. Actually, he's really new in Scouting - if I hadn't had to drag him to summer camp I don't think he'd be in it at all. He had fun at camp though, and came home and volunteered. He missed last night's meeting as he didn't feel well. But he'll be coming along soon.

 

Anyway, we'd like suggestions from the peanut gallery.

[SagerScout]

...and if the peanut gallery includes homeschoolers, I'm extra-interested in your take on this as we have 10 homeschooled boys and one PS kid. The youngest is 11 but most are 13-16.

[sctmom]

Is the SM trained?

 

Does sound like he is overprotective. I insisted my son and his friend learn about starting fires as first year Webelos. How will his boys advance in Scouting if they don't learn how to light the stoves, lanterns and fires? This is why you TEACH them about the proper way to do it and about safety first.

 

I have no real advice except to hang in there. Does sound like you need another man to talk to the SM.

 

[SagerScout]

Yes, the scoutmaster is trained. But he has something of a tendency to reject information that doesn't fit his worldview, (as we all do, of course). So when they say in training that young Scouts can, for instance, put up their own tents, he interpreted that to mean "As long as I'm there to help them and tell them how to do it." My take on that was perhaps a little far the other way. "Where's your tent, kid? Why isn't it up yet?"

[sctmom]

I keep waiting for some of the men to comment on this. Don't be afraid! I think the issue is more about the SM being overprotective then just about Sager being female.

 

How do you deal with people who are so overprotective they won't let the boys put up a tent?

 

 

[eisely]

sctmom,

 

I have to agree with you that the problem is more likely with an overprotective attitude generally than with an attitude towards female scouters. This kind of behavior is something that I personally have never encountered. I would suggest a private conversation with the SM along the lines of "How will they learn if we do everything for them?"

[red feather]

Sounds like your SM needs to get with the program of scouting. Is he going to carry all of the boys packs on high adventure because they might hurt themselves? Or not allow float trips because they might flip over? Please let him know, for me, that scouting is to expand a scouts horizons and increase their own image of themselves as capable, confident, young people. If he does not allow them to grow in scouting then he is causing a portion of our society to grow up wishing, hoping that someone will come along and do things for them absolving them of all responsibility for waht happens to and around them.

[Double Eagle]

I'll bite.

 

Overprotective is a pretty good diagnosis. First reply to the "ladies are inside" may have been "where are the scouters"? Sounds like a good time to attend a district level event where troops show their stuff. During this time, take this guy by the neckerchief and visit troops. Let him see how other troops function. You may want to cover this with a training session like he is training ASMs by writing down what they see they like and what they don't. A roundtable item for back in camp or a meeting. This guy has to see what scouts are capable of without him.

 

One way to keep overprotective parent away from son is to have patrol areas where the adults are away from patrols (within reason). To break the ice from a cross over, I recommend that the parent not tent with the scout. It creates an individual and makes him get along with others. This guy doesn't need a scoutmaster minute, he needs a scoutmaster hour.

 

As for the gender thing. It may be a good time to introduce some women OA members along with chapter/lodge members as guests or have them put on a camping demonstration. Anything to show him that skills are not limited to males.