Patriotism in School

[Rooster7]

Bottom Line - Whether you are conservative or liberal, most parents want their children to view life (and history) from a perspective that reflects what they have been taught at home. When did we ever ask our government to circumvent those efforts? It is not a teacher's function (no matter how qualified he/she may be on a certain subject) to mold our children thoughts. He/She should be providing them with tools. As to what they do with those tools, it's out of their hands. I think parents, as a group, try to imprint their philosophy concerning life onto their children. This is to be expected. It is not surprising to me that OGE, scoutmom, and I all agree. We all love our children. Consequently, we do not want teachers or anyone else unfairly influencing them (i.e., spinning the facts), especially if it is contradictory to our efforts at home.

[OldGreyEagle]

The funny thing is, long before I ever started posting on this forum, I never thought of myself as either conservative or liberal, just me.

 

It wasnt until the past year that I was deemed "liberal" in any context.

 

So, what other myth can we explode?(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

[Rooster7]

Liberal? Did I call you such a thing? (such an ugly thought) ...Although we may have some differences... I don't think I can stake exclusive claim to the conservative veiwpoint, especially at the expense of your self perspection. The truth is, there are many degrees within a circle. Generally speaking, I'd say we're witin the same 90 degree arch. That leaves a lot of room to either side, but I guessing there's not as big of a gap as you might think.

[OldGreyEagle]

Oh no Rooster,

 

It was not you who first cast the epithet "liberal" my way. It was another who liked to rile emotions and attack personalities.

 

When first called liberal, my first instinct was to to respond, "I am NOT", then I thought, whats a label anyway ?

 

Actually I was also thinking, OMG, what if I am a Liberal and I have been in denial all these years?

 

Will I have to come out of the Liberal closet? Will I have the courage to tell my Dad at Thanksgiving time?

When I voted for Nixon twice (I admit) and Reagan once was I just in denial?

And worse yet, between Troop and District activities (especially since I signed up to commit Wood Bage in August)will I have time for the meetings, you know, where liberals get their "Agenda" and talking points?

 

Boy, am I glad I only "experimented" with liberalism and can say I am a confirmed independent thinker... That is, as long as you guys think its ok for me to be so...

(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

[Rooster7]

Voted for Nixon? Twice? Be careful, you're starting to show your age. I was in jr. high when he resigned.

 

I was a die-hard liberal from birth through high school and most of college. I kinda inherited my politics from my parents. I turned conservative shortly after my first child. I'm a little disappointed that you didn't vote for Reagan twice...But hey, noboby's perfect. (This message has been edited by Rooster7)

[sctmom]

I'm have to brag --- I'm NOT old enough to have voted for Reagan twice, much less vote for Nixon. Nixon was the first president I even remember!

 

The older I get the less I think like my parents. But my parents think differently than anyone else I've ever met or talked to. I'm very happy and proud to say I don't think like my parents! My brother, sister and I avoid all conversations with Dad that include words like liberal, conservative, politics, President, etc. Just best not to go there.

 

I prefer to think of myself as Independent. Which includes wanting my son to learn facts now so that when he his brain has matured he will have the knowledge to think critically about issues.

 

[OldGreyEagle]

Sorry Rooster, Reagan only once,

 

Jimmy Carter continues to be the most decent man, the most humble and the most valuable ex-president our country has ever had. As much as I like Dubya, I would dump him in a second to vote for Jimmy Carter for president, again

[SagerScout]

OK, I usually try to keep my voting record to myself but I find myself and OGE in complete and total agreement on Jimmy Carter. Too bad humility, decency, and a personal dedication to service to God aren't much in the way of political assets. I'd vote for him again in a heartbeat but I think he has deduced that the presidency was NOT his most effective way to serve his Lord.

 

HIstory may or may not treat his presidency kindly but IMHO no president in this century (whoops, I mean the 1900's - showing age there....) has ever conjured up as much benefit to humanity out of the post-presidency time. I wish I were informed enough to address earlier times but am hoping the history professor will weigh in instead.

 

Julia

[eisely]

As long as we are disclosing voting records, I voted for Jimmy Carter once. In the Illinois primary of 1976.

 

I would certainly agree that Jimmy Carter is a far better ex president than he ever was a president. I saw a humorous piece of editorial opinion today concerning Carter's current visit to Cuba. "...he (Carter)(in contrast to Castro) is an enduring example of democracy's greatest blessings: the power of the people to vote a bad leader out of office."

 

What was Reagan's percentage of the vote in 1980? Something like two thirds?

[OldGreyEagle]

Well, Jimmy Carter is proof positive you cant send an honest man to Washington. He expected elected officials to have the public good at heart and he expected wrong.

 

He biggest failing was he expected everyone to have the same mindset he did.

 

 

[sctmom]

Being from Georgia, I like Jimmy. He is a very intelligent and honest man. Read something recently about how he tried to look at all sides of an issue, which looked like weakness in the Presidency.

 

Jimmy teaches Sunday School periodically in Plains. It's a big thing to get to go hear him, folks other than Baptists go to hear him teach. He has done a lot with Habitat for Humanity. I've heard they about once a month he and Mrs. Carter go to the Carter Library to do some work.

 

A few weeks ago I went to the Carter Library and museum. There is an exact replica of the Oval Office, decorated as it was during his term. A recording is playing of Carter talking about being president. Part of is him talking about the first time he was alone in the Oval Office. He looked about and thought "wow, I can do anything I want, I can move that chair or open the drapes." He was in awe that HE could arrange the furniture in the Oval Office (we won't get into what other presidents thought THEY could do with their power in that office).

 

 

[eisely]

It is perhaps unfair to refer to Jimmy Carter as a "bad" president since that suggests evil motives. His motives were, and remain, the highest, but he was one of the most ineffective presidents we ever had. I remember one comment he made during his 1976 campaign, to the effect that the people of the United States deserved a "government that was as good and loving as the people of the United States." A comment like this reflects an unreal understanding of human nature. People, Americans included, are not always good and loving, which is probably the most important reason that we need government at all. He is a good man, and has done good works since leaving the presidency. In contrast Gerald Ford has mostly collected director's fees for sitting on various corporate boards. Gerald Ford has done nothing illegal or even anything unethical, but Carter has set the higher example. Nevertheless Carter would do well to butt out of international affairs, which was never his strong suit.

 

[Rooster7]

eisely,

 

You've summed up my feelings on President Carter precisely, in respect to him as a president and a man. There appears to be little doubt in anyone's mind that Jimmy Carter is a good man who loves his country. However, his current attempts at international diplomacy are undermining the current administration's efforts to do battle with rouge nations. What purpose does it serve to tell Cuba that they are being falsely persecuted? President Carter was not invited by the current administration to play the role of ambassador. He should not expect our government to reveal their intelligence on Cuba to him or anyone else dabbling in our country's business. Consequently, his most recent remarks concerning Cuba and our country's embargo are totally inappropriate. He may well have noble motives, but as was the case 25 years ago, his actions are doing this country a disservice.

 

As for Gerald Ford, he did not run for the office. Nixon selected him. I don't think we can hold him to the same standard for out-of-office accomplishments and deeds. He stepped up to fill the position when asked. He did not seek the role. Nevertheless, I would like to note that President Ford is an Eagle Scout. Nor has he ever done anything to embarrass this country.

 

OkayThat's my $.02 on the politics of the day.

 

[ScouterPaul]

Well here is my two cents worth. I turned 18 in 1976 and have voted in every primary and election since then. I voted for Ford in 76 and Reagan in 80. I saw the light and have voted Democrat ever since.

I must say that I'm not surprised that there are certain segments of of country trying to make Carter look bad. Hind sight is 20 20 but I wish I had cast my vote for Carter.

[slontwovvy]

There's a difference between being malicious in attacks on Carter and pointing out honest faults in his administration.

 

He was the second most honest president we've ever had. However, he was too much of an idealist to really get anything done. He was powerless to free the Iran Hostages. The only reason they were in fact released was to spite Carter. Not malicious, just an honest point.