Eagle Problem

[SagerScout]

I'm astonished that we have not heard from any Sikh scouts or scouters. Are there none out there? A young man that has been confirmed in that religion does not cut his hair at all, and wears the turban... would this outward demonstration of inward faith make him less a potential Eagle scout? I think not.

 

My scout son has short hair but my other son (17) has hair down his back, medium brown, clean, straight, and normally neatly tied back. When it is worn loosely down, with his tan and his classic good looks, total strangers do a doubletake on him as he looks like the Renaissance painters' image of Jesus of Nazareth. For this reason, his hairstyle got him the lead role in the Easter passion play two years ago. Hmmmmmm. Perhaps the Messiah could not have been an Eagle scout.

 

Obedience to the scoutmaster is a tough one; but it does not sound like this young man has been disobedient in his working relationship with him.

 

I agree with the idea that a tactful, polite discussion with the Scoutmaster reviewing the boy's other accomplishments in scouting and pointing out the lack of a haircut policy in BSA is appropriate. I also feel that this is one of the VERY RARE occasions when I feel the parent should be in the room and in the discussion for the sole purpose of providing moral support for their son. IMHO if his PARENTS have no objections to his hairstyle, his Scoutmaster is over the line in trying to dictate to him, especially as it sounds like he is an obedient, respectful young man with a solid record.

 

Just my two cents. I hope this can be resolved without ill feelings on the scoutmaster's part, and also without grekonsz having to cut his hair.

[fella]

njcubscouter

 

These days, it's quite mainstream for boys to wear earrings.

 

fella

 

 

[fella]

NJCubScouter"

 

"Personally, I don't like guys wearing earrings. But if a Scout wants to wear one, then that's his right."

 

Quite so.

 

Actually, you may find you'll get used to them one day!

 

Lots of boys get ear piercings. It doesn't do them any harm.

[mk9750]

Fella,

 

I beg to differ. Earrings could harm Scouts.

 

1) It is a needless procedure that comes with the possiblity of infection, done for vanity.

 

2) Earrings can be dangerous is some situations, especially situations in which Scouts often find themselves. this is even more true depending on the style of the earring. Every youth athletic association of which I am familiar requires that all atheletes (male and female) remove jewelry, including earrings while participating.

 

3) Whether fair or unfair, males who wear earrings run the risk of being treated differently than those that do not. This can run the spectrum from no difference, to outright predjudice against the boy who has an earring. Mostly I would guess that the different treatment would be along the lines of having to do more / work harder / overcome the negative impression. I'll agree it may not be fair, but if you are reasonable, you'd have to agree that I'm right.

 

All that being said, when we have been faced with this issue in our Troop, we have banned them from activities (not meetings), had a conversation with the boy about the above, and then let him make his own decision. this just isn't an issue we are willing to alienate our boys over.

 

Also, I am curious why you responded to a thread almost 10 months after your last post, which was the last on the topic?

 

Mark

[fella]

Actually I would be the first to argue that earrings (especially the bigger ones) should be removed if hazardous to the activity in question.

 

But let's face it, it's not unknown for girl guides to wear sleeper studs in uniform.

 

I don't see the differnce for boys if they happen to have had their ears pierced as well.

 

Why discuss it? Well, it's kind of topical as an issue, live on other Scouter thread as well.

[littlebillie]

"...and the sign said 'Long-haired

freaky people, don't even try',

so I stuffed my hair up under my hat,

and i went in to ask him 'why?'

he said 'you look like a fine upstandin'

young scout - your Eagle's due!'

then I took off my hat, I said 'imagine that' -

I just got my Eagle from you

 

whoa-oh-oh signs, signs, everyWHERE there's signs,

tramp-a-lin' our freedom and breakin' our minds...

 

 

 

(submitted with total apologies! :-))

[fella]

As far as I'm concerned a little, unobtrusive ear-stud is no big deal for a girl or boy. So many have it.

[red feather]

littlebillie, right on!

 

Remember also:

'If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him keep step to the music he hears, however measured or far away.'

Thoreau

 

yis

[momof2scouts]

Problem solved. Former ScoutMaster is now back in charge. Thankfully, he was in a better situation to step back in & resume the duties. The replacement ScoutMaster was already withdrawing from the troop's activities as he felt most of the parents didn't like him. He was right, but only by his own doings. Personally, I appreciate the fact that he was giving his time to the troop, but he isn't doing anyone (including himself) any favors by assuming a ScoutMaster role. Thanks for all your replies to my son's original post.

[Thomcom]

After reading the posts on this thread I feel compelled to add my 6 bits to this conversation. I was a cub scout (1963-66)Boy Scout (1967-1974) and a Scouter who has completed Wood Badge and has served as Scoutmaster,Asst Scoutmaster off & on from 1975-1991.

 

First, I totally agree the Scoutmaster HAS NO RIGHT to add his own personal agenda to the Eagle requirments. That is the rule "no one can not add or subtract from the requirements" . A scout for any rank must those requirements. no more , no less period. However one of those requirements are adhearing to the principals of the Scout Oath & Law "To Keep myself Morally Stright" and "A Scout is Clean" means not only in Personal Hygine but also of Good moral fiber. I believe if a boy who would cross dress,wear panties and so on. Would ,to most of us, seem to violate that rule. Enough said, I do not think the simple fact one who has long hair would violate in any way that rule. And no organization can (Chartered Organization,Troop Commitee, PLC or Otherwise) Cannot create a local rule that violates or superceeds the national bylaws.(The same way States and Local governments cannot pass laws that violate Federal Law) If the chartered organization does not wish to abite by the national bylaws. Then they are free to not sponser a scout unit. But, If they wish to sponser a scout unit. Then do so with the understanding that they cannot modify the program or change its requirements to suit there own agenda. If this were possible we would have units that discriminate on the bases of ,race,size ,family background and so on. That would not be right.

 

Getting back to the Scout in question. I can only say stick to your guns because you have right and justice on your side. If any such award can be dictated by a Scoutmaster likes or dislike of you. Then its an award not worth having in my opinion. I can say this because what is happening to you .Has in way happened to me. Except my case , I was not able to get my Eagle. Back then (in 1974)the Scoutmaster was consirdered a god. My Scoutmaster did not want me to become Eagle because my father (Who was a steelworker, And had to work weekends) was unable to go camping trips. Although my parents did try to help the troop in other ways. Going on Camping trips was not one of them. My father simply could not afford to take the time off and lose 3 days of pay. Since he had bills and a family to support. My Scoumaster held this against me. He effectively blocked my Eagle progress by not even talking to me about my proposed my Eagle project. Nor apporoving the last required merit bage (It was Nature, I had earned over 24 at the time. Nature was the last required I needed). The troop commitee knew this was wrong and did nothing. I contacted my district and Scout council who replied it was the scoutmaster's decision and did nothing. I even thought of just going to another Scout troop to complete the Eagle requirements. And was told that idea would be sabatoged and "no Troop would touch me". After feeling totally screwed I finally gave up and quit .(I had been the Troop almost 7 years at point) I felt no awared was worth giving up my dignity for. And if earning such an award is to be depended not ones own merit .But ,only can only be obtained by playing along with someone's agenda. Then its an award I do want no any part of. To me, the whole thing was a sham. It may not be true but,thats how I felt at the time.

 

Again this my opinion and I wish to make everyone aware this went on back then and still goes on today. If we can bar a Scout from Eagle simply because he has long hair what is next ? Can we bar a scout because they come ,as someone said to me once, "from the wrong side of the tracks ?". Or perhaps barring them if their family does not have minimum income ? This could happen if we do not put stop to this kind of behavior here and now. Because the old saying "fanaticism and ignorance are forever busy and needs feeding ".If there is no justice for one of us then there is no justice for all of us. We are practicing democracy here not running a dictorship.

[frank10]

Thomcom,

Looks like it is now a non-issue. The original poster replied that the Scoutmaster has steped down. But let this long haired motorcycle riding country boy be the first to welcome you to the campfire.

 

BTW: just held Life Scout BOR for a young man with short hair... bright blue short hair. He passed just fine.

[dsteele]

As it should be, gentlemen. The strength of an Eagle Scout lies in the strength of his character -- which is the sum of his attitudes meeting his actions. A short blue-haired Eagle Scout, a long- haired Eagle Scout, and a "preppy" need to meet the same standards of leadership.

 

High character is imperative -- hair length or color is umimportant.

 

DS