Do you home school, public school or private school?

[andrews]

Scoutmom,

 

Just so you know, we have 3 (and maybe 4) ADHD children (out of 4), and my wife is managing to do a quite reasonable job. Certainly better than they would be in a "formal" school setting. And we are without the drugs as well.

 

Obviously it would be a major jump, and I wouldn't force you into it, even if I could, but I wanted to let you know it can be done with ADHD children.

 

Brad

[scoutmom]

KoreaScouter, thanks for your kind words. You warmed my heart and brought tears to my eyes. It's not easy, but we somehow manage to get by and have a good time while we're at it. (most of the time!)

 

And a question for homeschoolers out there. This is just curiosity, not a judgement call on anyone. Of those of you who homeschool, how often does the primary responsibility fall to the woman in the home to school the children? How often does the male in the home take on the "teacher" role? As I said, just curious.

 

I'm sure homeschooling works great for those of you with the resources (financial and personality wise) to do it. I admire people who can homeschool and keep their sanity. I would go insane. I love my son, I love the boys in my pack (I'm Assistant Cubmaster) but to be with them all day long every day would make me nuts. We have a hard enough time just getting through homework, I can't see me trying to get through Algebra! Please don't try to continue to convince me that I can do it. I don't want to do it. I respect your choice, it just isn't my choice.

[andrews]

My wife does the primary teaching, largely because she is at home the most since she has no job outside the home. (But she does have a large one in it.)

 

While I make decent money, we could really use another income about now, but we continually decide that even a part time job for her is not worth it.

 

She does border on "going nuts" at times, and I need to be sensitive to that, and fill in whenever I can.

 

Brad

[Chippewa29]

In case anyone was interested, there is a series of articles this week in the Detroit Free Press (www.freep.com) regarding home schooling in Michigan. I thought the people reading and discussing this thread would find it interesting.

[sctmom]

Like scoutmom, I am a single mother of an ADHD child. I cannot home school him full time. It is not an option. I also don't think I have the patience. It is all we can do to get through homework some nights, and he really doesn't have that much.

 

As someone else said, we ALL homeschool to some extent...I have stopped housework to bring in a fallen bird's nest, pull out the bird book to identify what was in the front yard, done all kinds of experiments on my dining room table (some intentional --lol), I read to my son, we visit museums and historic sites, watch educational shows on TV, discuss current events, play math games, play word games, etc. I print out things from the internet for him to do -- just found some online word searches about a popular book. I actually bought a set of REAL encyclopedia (not just the computer type). We sit and browse through it. We try foods from different countries. We explore any where we can. I was raised this way. My parents (especially my father) is famous for asking "wonder how that works?"

 

I went to a private school. Very small, not church based, the school lasted 11 years. It was opened in response to integration. Sports became such a focus that academics were secondary and that caused the closure of the school. I graduated with 17 other people. You would think that with so few students we got a great one-on-one education -- nope. Because the school had a hard time getting good teachers. Good teachers don't like being told to reschedule tests because it is the day after a ball game. One year our history teacher said "you will have a test EVERY Wednesday for the whole year, you KNOW this, if you are busy on Tuesday, study on Monday." Well, along comes basketball season and games on Tuesday nights. She was told to change the test days.

 

Does that mean all private schools are that way? No. My nieces and nephews attended a couple of different church run schools -- bad experiences. One teacher put tape over the 8 year old's mouth and paraded her in front of other classrooms -- why? She was finishing her work quickly and then talking. Could have found something else for her to do. My nephew got in trouble at about age 9 with some other boys for catching tadpoles at recess and bringing them in the class room to the teacher! Couldn't she have had science class?

 

My son's public school is good. I am very involved and pay close attention to what is being taught. I haven't seen this "agenda" others speak of. My big concern is the size of the schools. Some studies are now pointing out it is the size of the school, not the classes that are the problem. If there are 2,000 students in a high school and the child has a change in personality, who notices? Who even knows that child's name? How can the teachers take the time to care? Only the top academic and atheletic students get noticed.

 

Bottom line for me is that each child is different, each parent is different, and each school is different. There is no ONE answer. I admire those who home school, it takes a lot of dedication. I've seen a few instances where the kids were 17 and could barely read because the parents didn't do much at the home school. I've also seen the articles on the ones who excel. The parents who care will have kids that succeed no matter what school. I just found out that some parents tell the school to NEVER call them for any reason. That amazed me. I've heard of parents of elementary school kids trying to check the kid out of school early who did not know the teacher's name! Amazing!

 

[Rooster7]

sctmom,

 

I agree with most of your post. I see an agenda in some public schools, but that could be a matter of location...

 

Regardless, I do have one comment. You said -

 

I've seen a few instances where the kids were 17 and could barely read because the parents didn't do much at the home school. I've also seen the articles on the ones who excel.

 

Per every study I ever read on home schooling, the example you gave (17-year-old barely able to read) is truly the exception. As a group, home schoolers do far better than public schoolers. This is not to say there is anything wrong with sending your child to public school. I merely want to emphasize that home schoolers do very well as a group. In fact, in my neck of the woods, the possibility of your 17-year-old not being able to read is more often associated with the public schools.

 

[FScouter]

If a seventeen year old cannot read, that should not be a slam against public schools. Rather, it's because the kid and his parents don't care whether or not he can read. Kids do poorly when the parents don't care. And parents that put their kids in private school, or do home schooling, care.

[andrews]

Public schools share no blame for not doing their job? What do we hold them accountable for then, if not teaching the basics?

 

Sctmom, you probably don't see "an agenda" because you agree with a good portion of it (based on your posts here). If they are teaching what you agree with, it would seem well and good.

 

I do believe that education will change, with many bumps, over the next few decades. The mass production model does a good job producing "citizens" for the welfare/warfare state (started in Prussia), but it doesn't do a good job of educating people.

 

Brad

[sctmom]

A few of my complaints about the public school is that it is still based on an agrian (spelling?) society. I don't know many kids that need to out in the fields during the summer. Also, the school day is still based on all kids going home to mom baking cookies.

 

My biggest gripe is how you either get it or you don't. My son brings home a failing grade but no one has time to go back over what he didn't understand. Off to something else. My child struggles a lot partly because he is one of the youngest. If I could just hold him back about 6 months, he would have an easier time. But I can't do that, it's hold them back for a year or not at all.

 

Brad, I'm not trying to argue but tell me what the "agenda" is. My neices and nephews all went to public schools, they aren't part of a "welfare state". They know they must have jobs to live. The one who dropped out of high school caught one real quick that if he wants to eat and have a car he better work. None of them expect handouts. Location may be a big part of it. I'm in the Bible Belt where local traditions and values weigh heavily. My son is still in Elementary school, so I can't really comment on the upper grades except from what other parents have told me. I talked to a dad last week that has 2 grown children and one child in elementary school. The family is very involved in their church and their children's lives. They have very high values and morals. He said he always told his kids that school is mainly what they make of it. His oldest son is about to graduate from a highly respected southern "technical" university.

 

Parental involvement is so critical in education. I have carefully read the "values based education" taught at my child's school. Tell me what is wrong -- respect for yourself and others, persistence, patience, hard work, respect for authority, etc. The only thing they don't teach is a specific religion or specifics about sex. The "class" for 5th graders about their body discussed the physical changes they are going through, they are told to ask parents or clergy about other issues. Many of the parents from our school are Christians and have very high values, I've never heard of any problems.

 

My example of a 17 year old who could not read is about lack of parents caring. I graduated from a private school with kids who could barely read. They could not read enough to enjoy a magazine about sports or cars. I went to the same school and could always read well about "grade level". Again, it was about parents involvment and expectations. I think home schoolers today have come a very long way from the fringe element it may have been many years ago. I am all for the public schools working with the home schoolers. It boils my blood too when I hear of school administrators who want to fight home schoolers. It has always been my understanding that EVERY child has a right to access public school facilities no matter what school they attend. The mission of the public schools is to educate each and every child, no matter what that takes. If you are home schooling your child but would like to borrow a book from the school library, you should be able to do that. I have also recently read about some people who are part time home schoolers, sending the kids to the school for subjects like science that may be hard to teach at home then at home teaching them reading, history, language, etc.

 

[andrews]

I wasn't disputing that parental inolvement wasn't vitally important - it certainly is!

 

As to the values, I don't really want to charge down that one, but I recall you having a much more open view of homosexuality, for example, than I, and therefore I don't think things in the school that told children homosexuality was a "fine alternative choice" would bother you much, while I would disagree greatly.

 

I teach my children, to the best of my abilities, to always respect others, even those who are disagreeable or who practice things we completely oppose.

 

Brad

[sctmom]

brad says:

I teach my children, to the best of my abilities, to always respect others, even those who are disagreeable or who practice things we completely oppose.

 

I do too and have already found it necessary to do this even though my son is only in the 5th grade. I have yet to know of a school that teaches homosexuality or sexual "freedom" is okay. But my eyes and ears are open to all that is being taught to my child.

 

 

[Rooster7]

Just as I suspected...

 

The mantra for real estate and public education seems to be one in the same:

 

Location! Location! Location!

 

sctmom,

 

Trust meYou can find plenty of that "stuff" in the Northeast.

 

[YoungBlood]

I have yet to know of a school that teaches homosexuality or sexual "freedom" is okay.

 

Haven't you heard of high schools handing out condoms after a sex ed class? Or having condom dispenser in the bathrooms. Now, don't tell me that giving a teenager a condom doesn't give him and ideas that sexual "freedom" is ok. Kinda sad they give out condoms but would never consider handing out a scripture tract.

 

[slontwovvy]

It takes a village to raise a child, not just a school system or just a parent. That's been said since long before any of us were born. Still, it rings true. You need a network of people for education to work.

I am in agreement with Brad that public schools often have an agenda, however, often liberal. In Wisconsin, our teacher's union especially has gotten their hand caught in the proverbial cookie jar...just a little exposure of what they do.

[sctmom]

One approach that might raise the quality of education would be to raise the salaries and be pickier about who teaches. I considered leaving my corporate job to go into teaching. Our state has a teacher shortage and is offering a program where you can get a provisional teacher's certificate in a short time and then be on "probation" for a couple of years. Since I'm in a high tech field, I would be a good candidate. Do I want to take a 60% pay cut? Yikes, not really! And have to put up with the school buearacracy? Nope!

 

Many good people try to teach and then get tired of fighting the paperwork monster and the low pay (at least in our state it is very low). Few men teach because it's hard to support a family off that salary.

 

I'm sure many of you scouters have experienced the reality of the parents are often more of a problem than the kids. Imagine how many of those parents the teachers have to put up with! A common thing in some rich neighborhoods is "if you punish my child or don't pass my child, then I'll SUE you!". Geez, do you want to put up with that while driving a beat up old car, then seeing the same kid driving his new SUV that mommy and daddy bought him!

 

Or the parents who refuse to talk to you about their child's problems? The kids who come to school with no breakfast and no one at home who cares?

 

I've worked closely with my son's teachers and school administration because of his problems. They were so helpful once they realized I wasn't blaming them for his problems and I was open to suggestions. We quickly became a team. I'm lucky to have a school where they really care about the individual child. I also know the parents who do blame the school for everything and take no personal responsibility.

 

My nephew was going to a public school, he was about 14 when his father began dying of brain cancer. The boy was at times helping his father bath and get dressed. My nephew always tested above average on standard tests but got bored quickly in school. His mom would have to go to work early in the morning and he would often skip school. When the school caught him the punishment was to suspend him! They knew that his father was dying and his mother doing the best she could. But they just let him slide away. He dropped out of high school. They really failed serving him. He is now 22, has a job as an electrician and is thinking of getting his GED.

 

So everywhere you look there is good and bad. I think we all have to be very aware of what is going on so we can make informed choices.

 

I really do admire those of you who are dedicated to home school. That is a much bigger job than many people realize. I'm glad to see more resources and organizations to support home schoolers, and to see more home schoolers being successful. In public school the focus seems to be on the grade -- not what the kid learned, this hurts all the kids.