Training a joke?

[chaoman45]

Honestly, I don't see what the point of it is sometimes. Whilst engaging, entertaining trainings are nice, most don't operate that way and instead rely on loooooong lectures. I get enough of that during school. To prove my point, I just did the online Youth Protection training. It was done with the sound off (didn't hear a word, if any, that was said) and during question time, I randomly picked answers within a second. I passed.

 

This was what I did for This Is Scouting because within the first five minutes, I thought it was kinda stupid that I had to take it despite being in Scouting for 10 years. I still managed to pass.

 

If I can pass with little effort, what's the point? I've learned more about Scouting whilst reading Scouter.com and asked commissioners than sitting through a 6 hour lecture. No wonder our Scouts hate JLT so much.

[moosetracker]

Do scouts hate JLT? I always thought scouts liked JLT, disliked it when it became TLT (mostly lectures).. I am unsure what they think of the new one (forget it's acronym..) Because troops in our area stopped using it when it became TLT, some still do JLT..

 

To try to get troops to try the new one (which is suppose to be a combo of old JLT & the hated TLT) I think I have to reintroduce the whole concept to them about what it is and how to use it..

 

But, I always thought scout liked JLT.. At least around here, I get the "It was so much better when it was JLT.." speel..

 

PS.. did you intentenally answer wrong and still pass, or because you were in it for 10 years knew the right answers?..(This message has been edited by moosetracker)

[Eagle707]

Scouts in my troop loved TLT (which we called JLT but that's a different story) and we did it on an annual basis (though I don't know if our trust fall/trust circle games were from BSA literature). We had the SPL help the Scoutmaster lead the activities and we had Scouts repeat the course not because they "failed" but because they liked TLT and wanted to do it again. I've heard mixed reviews about NYLT but that may be due to how my council does it. I'm not sure about that.

 

I think taking "This is Scouting" is an equalizer because then, no matter how many years you may or may not have been in Scouting, every leader has a common knowledge base to draw from. I gladly burned the time it took for "This is Scouting" even though I am an Eagle Scout and AoL recipient because it's good to know what it is that every leader knows.(This message has been edited by Eagle707)

[chaoman45]

moosetracker - I used TLT and JLT interchangeably. Maybe it has to do with our old Scoutmaster insisting he show a videotape of Scouting from the 90s well into the second decade of a new millennium.

 

btw, wasn't intentional. Whenever a question popped up I never even bothered to read the answer. Don't remember my score, but I also took YP three times prior to this test. Now THAT YPT made you do stuff right.

[JoeBob]

YPT - 20 minutes online. 45 minutes if you're from Penn State...

[KC9DDI]

I'm not saying that the online training, or even our training program in general, are as effective or efficient as they could be.

 

But keep in mind that there's a difference between a brand new leader who's legitimately never been exposed to this material before, and a Scouter with several years of experience that has the material committed to memory.

 

I think a step in the right direction would be to implement a "refresher" training curriculum, separate from the "initial training" curriculum. So the first time a Scouter is signed up, they need to go do through full shebang training program. But then, every 1-3 years, depending on the training course, they can take a much-reduced refresher course that can introduce new best practices that have been introduced since their last training, and maybe re-enforces some selected sections of the whole curriculum.

[moosetracker]

If mandated training ever gets teeth, then a few years from now we will have few issues like this, because everyone will have taken the basic traing in their first year after signing up for a position..

 

That is except for the J2E where "There is Trained, and there is Trained" non-sense.. Where if they redo a course, you are trained for the mandatory standards, but can no longer count your trained status towards the J2E award unless you re-take the new course..

 

Luckily I was told as District Training Chair I get to decide if I will except old training courses for J2E... I said "YEP".. The only time I may say "NO" is if I hear of a poorly preforming troop where the leaders as supposibly "Trained".. Like my old Troop.. I should make them retake the new courses in hopes that something can stick.. Of course to do it that way, they will most likely ask "Why me when 95% of the other guys don't have to retake it?" Then I will have to basically say, "Your redoing it because you have a lousy troop program.."

 

So I guess I get to be the bad guy one way or the other..

[SeattlePioneer]

Personally I hate having "This Is Scouting" as a requirement. I don't think adults should be required to sit through BSAs propaganda campaign for programs adults haven't volunteered to lead.

 

I consider it ABUSIVE.

[Eagle92]

KC,

 

Round Tables are the 'contining ed" or "continual training" that us old fogey are suppose to use to keep up to snuff. CSRT and BSRT even have their own training codes for SCOUTNET. However RTs seem to tbe the problem.

 

Moose,

 

if ya on FB, check out the BSA Training Team group. You are correct in that the folks in Irving are listening to some of us old fogeys, and are now allowing district folks to say if older training should coutn or not. I see issues with the new policy b/c a scouter may be considered trained with the odl courses in one district, but if he moves to another district, possibly in the same council, he will be considered untrained.

[MoosetheItalianBlacksmith]

The online Trainings bore me and I do every so often but when I teach the actual ones people have to come to I have as much class interaction and physical learning as I can. I also ask at the end of every class how I can make the class better for the next one and I implement those ideas. Every training we have done has been better than the last and people have always enjoyed coming to our trainings and learning new things and meeting new people.

 

So there is a major difference between the online and physical trainings.

 

But I have to agree that lecturing and quizzing are boring and not really the way to go if you want to hold peoples interest and make them retain what youre trying to teach them.

 

Our Council Does NYLT if thats what you were trying to think of Moose Tracker.

 

Eagle92...you may be right that that is a flaw in the system but for the most part they are not going to be changing districts. If they are they probably have more to get use to then just training. But a lot of people have been struggling to find times to get to these trainings and once they finally do and are all trained for we turn around and say oh by the way that doesnt count....that wouldnt go over well.

 

[moosetracker]

Nope.. NYLT is the course you can take only AFTER you have completed was use to be JLT, then TLT and now is ??? ILST ??? (or something like that)..

 

So if no one in our district runs ??ILST ??? then no youth in our district can sign up to go to NYLT... As far as I know no one in our district does this training..

[Eagle92]

MIB,

 

You'd be surprised how oftern some folks change. I changed councils 5 times in 7 years. At one point I was registered in 2 different districts as a leader (Explorer post was AA for was in 1 district, the troop in another). And I'm in a council with 2 major military bases in their jurisdiction, and additional ones in adjacnet councils, one base is less that 15 minutes fromteh council boundary.

 

As for how you are doing your live classes, you are spot on!

[moosetracker]

I am fighting getting a Facebook account.. Don't know why, but never thrilled me. But, I should start seriously looking for a job change, and they say networking that way is the in thing.. So it probably will come pretty soon..

 

I think I hate the notion of lots of emails of so & so wants to friend you.. Or so & so left a message.. I like the forum where I can come and go when I please and my email is basically left for personal messages.. (I get some spam, but have kept it surprisingly low.)

 

Besides the fact that we would have alot of grumpy people if we said training didn't count (especially when IOLS changes in the near future)..

 

1) We are less then one mth from recharter. All year long we have told people old Training counts.. To tell them old Training does not count 1 mth from when they need to turn in J2E and then tell them there are no classes scheduled.. Would cause anger and lack of trust..

 

2) The council software can't tell us who is trained.. Let alone who is Trained the "A" way, and who is trained the "B" way.. What a rechartering nightmare!!(This message has been edited by moosetracker)

[KC9DDI]

Eagle92 - Con-ed is also an excellent idea, and RT fills that role quite well, but that's not quite what I was talking about.

 

I could be wrong, but I believe you need to re-take your YPT training every 2 years. What I'm proposing is, rather than re-taking the entire course, just present a quick refresher, followed by any new policies or relevant information that have been developed since the last YPT training you took. Similar to how the AHA treats CPR, PALS and ACLS classes. The first time you take the class it's a two-day affair, but your subsequent refreshers are only a few hours long.

 

I think this might come across as being more respectful of people's time, and hopefully encourage better training participation. I really don't mind having relatively high training requirements for first-time leaders - but once you learn the stuff, and are routinely working with a unit, you shouldn't need to re-take classes on stuff you already know. Just do a quick review and present new information, then call it done.

[emb021]

"So if no one in our district runs ??ILST ??? then no youth in our district can sign up to go to NYLT... As far as I know no one in our district does this training.. "

 

Uh, troops should be running their own ILST (Introduction to Leadership Skills for Troops) on at least an annual basis. Its not designed to be run by the district. This is how troops have been running its predecessor course for years. They should be doing this as part of their annual program planning.