Wood Badge beads for NYLT staff

[emb021]

There was discussion on-line about National allowing NYLT adult staff to earn their 3rd/4th WB beads for being on NYLT staff.

 

Well, the latest Southern Region newsletter has info on it: http://srbsa.org/public/services/administration/pubs/spotlight/2008/091208.pdf

 

It has been approved that certain positions on NYLT staff can earn you your 3rd or 4th WB beads.

 

3rd bead for NYLT ASM

 

* complete 21CWB and complete ticket and received beads

* complete Trainers EDGE/Trainers Development within 2 years of NYLT course

* Staff a NYLT or NAYLE course as the ASM who provides training and oversight for youth staff (this is the ONLY position that qualifies!)

 

4th bead for NYLT SM

 

* staffed 21CWB as a Troop Guide (ie, got third bead, but ONLY this position is acceptable)

* complete NYLT Area/Regional Scoutmaster Course within 1 year of NYLT/NAYLE service and sign scoutmaster pledge.

* complete Trainers EDGE/Trainers Development within 2 years of NYLT course

* Serve as SM for NYLT/NAYLE

 

Also noted that service on NYLT courses before 2008 DO NOT COUNT. So no retroactive recognition.

 

It also seems that the means to earn these beads are pretty limited. Just being on NYLT staff won't do. It must be a specific position. And its clear you can't get your 4th bead without being on WB staff.

 

 

[John-in-KC]

It's still wrong.

[click23]

Well then, why don't they present woodbadge beads to the boys then?

[emb021]

"Well then, why don't they present woodbadge beads to the boys then?"

 

Because Wood Badge (2 words) beads are for adult training???

[John-in-KC]

So why give the 3d and 4th beads if you're not training adults?

 

emb, I know you're the messenger. You're reporting.

 

I object to the message. That's my problem.

[Vicki]

and John, I absolutely agree for reasons stated in another thread. Create another recognition system if we need to recognize adults with anything but a shield, but leave BP's legacy alone.

 

Vicki

[Eagle92]

Ok I haven't gone through Woodbadge yet, But I've been through the old Brownsea 22 program, and staffed JLT. While those two programs were similar in nature, they were geared to two different groups and should share same recognition.

 

In my original council all Brownsea 22 and JLT staff over 21 had to go through WB, either earning their beads or workingon their ticket. Those staff under 21 had to either complete the course or go throuhj NJLC in Philmont. The staff recognition for both those courses was the Smokey Bear hat. Most WB folks had the official one, those with working their ticket were issued a surplus one, and under 21 staff were also issued one. THAT was our recognition of being on staff. Also when you completed the course, you were issued a campaign hat with your certificate.

 

I have not seen the MYLT program yet so I cannot comment. BUT I think the idea of issuing beads is way off.

[Bob White]

The folks who own the awards get to determine how they are used. The beads you have are for the work you did. Do not worry about whether or not you did more or less work, or even different work, then others who wear the same recognition.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Vicki]

Bob, I have the right to comment on what I believe is an inappropriate use of an award which I think will result in a cheapening of both programs. "Worried" is not a word I would apply except in that I think National should rethink their strategy on this one. I am not "worried" about what others have or have not done. As a registered member of this program, a dedicated volunteer, and a donor to FOS, I am a stakeholder in this program and will offer my opinion whether or not anyone asks for it. I know, contrary to what some think, that National does actually listen to what its stakeholders say - whether or not it always changes a proposed action is another story. That's not my problem. I believe a serious mistake is being made here.

 

Vicki(This message has been edited by Vicki)

[Bob White]

Isn't the "appropriate" use of the award determined by the people who give the award?

 

No one said you can't have an opinion, but just having an opinion does not make it a useful or well thought out opinion.

 

Why be "concerned" (if worried is the wrong word), that the committee that determines training recognitions chooses to expand how they use a recognition they control. How in the world does that effect others?

 

The beads you have earned are no more or less a recognition of what you did to earn because of what another person does to earn them.

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Vicki]

Bob, you're not getting it, which is fine. Maybe someone else can explain it better than I. Like the e-mail autoresponse says, "I'm sorry. Your message is undeliverable, I've given up."

 

Vicki

[OldGreyEagle]

I think what is being expressed is a dismay at how something that was regarded in a certain light is now being changed. Wood Badge beads "used" to be earned in the context of the Wood Badge program and only the Wood Badge program and it distresses some when NYLT staff may also get what was up to this point something reserved for Wood Badge Staff.

 

I liken this to my reaction to the seemingly proliferation of knots lately. I can't say I like having the NESA Lifetime knot available, but I also know there isnt much I can do about it but that doesnt mean I can't express an opinion on it as well.

 

Back in the early 60's quite a few of the members of my Parish didnt like that the Mass was to be said the "vulgate" for us, English. They preferred the Latin Mass. Didnt matter that no one knew Latin, it was what they knew and didnt want to change. Did that make them "bad" catholics? No, it meant they needed time and space to express themselves. Did they have to like it and shup up about it? No, they were free to express themselves. Did they have to learn to live with it? Sure did and we will learn to live with NYLT staffer who qualify getting Wood badge beads as well. Doesnt mean we have to suffer in silence though either

[Vicki]

OGE, that's not it. It goes back to the original intent of the WB beads and the significance they have for, specifically, adult leader training. There is no tradition relating the WB beads to youth training. To force such an association dilutes both programs, IMO. It also has nothing to do with what I feel I've earned - I would have a third bead under either scenario (assuming I serve on yet another NYLT staff and fulfill that set of requirements, which I would do in any event, being one of those folks who gets the training available for the position). I've already served as WB staff. In fact, as I re-read the requirements, I've been invited to serve as an SM for NYLT - I'm not sure I'd wear that 4th bead outside of the NYLT program. I wouldn't want to wear it in front of a WB course director!

 

I believe it would be more productive to come up with a recognition that sufficiently honors those adults who serve on NYLT staffs and fulfill those requirements. I think it betrays a certain lack of imagination on National's part that they decided to do it this way.

 

Vicki(This message has been edited by Vicki)

[Bob White]

Perhaps I was unclear, allow me to try again.

 

For those of us who have three or four beads already. How will this additional use of the recognition negatively effect our lives? How does it effect the work we did to earn the beads or the knowledge and skills we learned in the process?

 

For Scouters who have not earned three or four beads yet how does this additional use of the recognition negatively effect them?

 

Were you aware that Wood Badge beads are used in several countries around the world. Are you positive that every country uses them the same way we do? If not how would their different requirements or uses for earning beads effect you or scouters in this country?

 

Please be as specific as possible.

 

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[dancinfox]

As a former Wood Bade Course Director, I would be proud that any Wood Badge Staffer who took on the position of NYLT Course Director would wear 4 beads. I know what it took to put the course on and what it takes to put on a NYLT Course. The teaching given to the participants in NYLT is on a parallel with Wood Badge and I feel that staffing NYLT is training and training is what it's all about.

David Harrison