Is Wood Badge just about "the beads"?

[Kudu]

Exactly, IOLS presents the Scoutcraft skills removed from Wood Badge as things to be checked off a first year advancement list, so that applied Scoutcraft does not get in the way of Wolf Den Leaders wearing those pretty Beads.

 

This summer I attended an IOLS course at Camp Rainey Mountain (Georgia) in which the adults spend the week watching the eleven-year-olds go through the camp's first year "TNT" course (in other words, there is no "hands-on" instruction for the adults). The IOLS course director boasted that Scouts can earn "90%" of the Tenderfoot through First Class skills (including the five mile hike) in fifteen (15) hours!

 

No.

 

A Wood Badge graduate should be able to teach Patrol Leaders the Scoutcraft skills necessary to take their Patrols out on patrol without adult supervision:

 

Patrols are ready to go hiking and camping on their own just as soon as the Patrol Leader has been trained, and the Scouts have learned to take care of themselves, have learned to respect growing crops and live trees, to avoid unnecessary danger, and in all ways conduct themselves as Scouts...It should be your goal to get your Patrol Leaders qualified for hike and camp leadership at an early stage Handbook for Scoutmasters, fifth edition, page 118.

 

That is what the term "Patrol Method" meant before "leadership" experts kicked Scoutcraft out of Wood Badge and replaced it with group theory.

 

There is no reason to invent a new course, simply kick the Cub Scouts out of Wood Badge, move their boxes of tissue and "leadership" theory to the University of Scouting, and restore those Beads to the Patrol-based backwoods Scoutcraft competency that Baden-Powell intended them to stand for.

 

Yours at 300 feet,

 

Kudu

 

[ScoutBox]

Good points Kudu. At least my IOLS course was us doing the work.. but most of the course is class room, not as hands on as is needed for many.

 

A

[Beavah]

I thought "Introduction to Outdoor Leader Skills" was supposed to teach the Outdoor Skills required to go from Tenderfoot to First Class. If your District/Council version of IOLS does not end with a participant who can competently perform all the required skills then there is an issue with either the presentation of the material or the participants ability to comprehend or perform the skills.

 

Or da structure of the course itself.

 

We believe it takes a kid at least a full year of active participation in a strong troop to achieve First Class. Some of us believe that if we're honest and have high expectations it takes longer than that.

 

Why do we then believe we can get adult beginners the same skills in just one weekend?

 

Just doesn't make sense.

 

Beavah

 

[acco40]

IOLS should have participants "doing" not "observing."

 

Kudu - I've had Scouts who were masters of a certain skill. However, they couldn't teach a lick. They would make lousy patrol leaders.

 

The purpose of a Patrol is to go out on patrol.

 

In other words, Wood Badge took the patrolling out of the Patrol Method.

 

Then why did I go on a patrol hike, pick out our campsite and camp for two days with my patrol during Wood Badge?

[Eagle92]

One thing I've heard about was one camp doing all of Basic Leader training: fast start, sm spec, and IOLS, during the week of summer camp. I heard that the folks going through it wqere bable to get a real feel for things.

[OldGreyEagle]

So if the trouble with IOLS is that it is too short, then the solution is to fix it, not create another course you have to go to after attending a course that didnt do what it was intended to do in the first place

[TNScoutTroop]

We've posted about this elsewhere, but we're trying to do our own 36 hour IOLS+, instead of the Council's 12 hour (really!) course which culminates in an attendance card certification. We thought we'd found gold, with the info that leaders could test for their IOLS card. Now, however, we've been told officially by Council that this is an idea National has kicked around but never adopted.

 

From past experience we know that we are at a dead end unless we can cite chapter, verse, and page number, and supply a notarized Xerox.

 

After scanning through the IOLS trainer's manual a couple of times, we've come up empty (though we like the manual, and will probably use a lot of it!), so any help in locating the citation would be very welcome.

 

TnScoutTroop

 

PS: A new adult leader recruit (20 something) noted tonight that he'd been camping several times with some Eagle Scouts a few years ago, and was afraid to go back because they were so lacking in basic skills!

[OldGreyEagle]

is this what you seek?

 

http://www.bacarrowhead.org/training/IntroductionToOutdoorLeaderSkills.pdf

[Kudu]

acco40 writes:

 

Kudu - I've had Scouts who were masters of a certain skill. However, they couldn't teach a lick.

 

So? The purpose of a Patrol Leader is to safely take his Patrol out on patrol: Day hikes and then overnights.

 

If a Scout is in a Patrol that regularly hikes and camps without adult supervision, he will learn all the Scoutcraft he needs no matter how bad the Patrol Leader is at EDGE theory.

 

acco40 writes:

 

They would make lousy patrol leaders.

 

The only lousy Patrol Leaders are those that do not take their Patrols out on patrol without adult supervision.

 

acco40 writes:

 

Then why did I go on a patrol hike, pick out our campsite and camp for two days with my patrol during Wood Badge?

 

Well, I don't know. Did they tell you "why" at Wood Badge?

 

Did they tell you to take that home to your Troop?

 

If so, do your Patrols go out on Patrol hikes and camp for two days without adult supervision, like a Wood Badge Patrol without an SPL or other Staffers?

 

If your answer is "No, our Patrols do not go on patrol," do they at least camp 300 feet from the nearest Patrol, Baden-Powell's minimum distance?

 

If so, congratulations! But you know very well that only one out of every 10,000 Wood Badgers can get real Patrol Leaders to take their Patrols out on patrol, any only one out of every 1,000 can even train real Patrol Leaders to meet B-P's minimum standard for a Troop campout.

 

Contrary to the goal of IOLS, mastery of Scoutcraft is not measured by "Advancement," but by how a Scout applies it when his Patrol goes out on patrol.

 

Yours at 300 feet,

 

Kudu

[TNScoutTroop]

Thanks OGE, but we've got that. We're gonna order the paper copy -- that PDF is hard to read -- and see if we can find the statement about testing out in a more legible copy.

 

But, right now, we haven't been able to locate any specific mention of that option.

 

Using that faded PDF you linked (numerous sites have copies, but all seem to be the same file, which is a low contract copy) means we may well have overlooked it, so we're hoping someone can help us zero in on the quote we need.

[Eagle92]

i was the one who mentioned test out option. it was either over here or on MyScouting.org that the topuic came up, and someone cited the exact page it was on. I'll search over there tomorrow

 

One comment, unless the self study method of training and personal coaching method of training are no longer allowed, and I haven't heard otherwise, it looks like you can study the material fromteh BSHB, and go to a trainer for the "personal coaching method of training" and demonstrate the skills listed on p95 and 96 for check off.

 

be advised basic CPR has changed in the last 5 years. You can do compression only CPR on adults if you do not have a barrier device, or do 30 compression to 2 breaths for one man Adult, infant, & child.

 

Every 5 years CPR gets reevaluated, and the conference that does that met in June or July. SOOOO be expecting some changes for next year , like 50:2 compressions to breaths ratio for one man.

[ctbailey]

I'm thinking I came across some language about "testing out" of IOLS while reading through a District Training pamphlet. Could be the latest revision, or maybe it was the previous revision.

 

I'll check my district handbooks when I get home.

 

Craig

[TNScoutTroop]

Just noting, for the benefit of future readers of this thread, that it appears that the "test out" IOLS option, may not be documented anywhere that's currently accessible.

 

Perhaps it was mentioned in some document that has since become unavailable, but no one has been able to help us with any current documentation of this option.

 

TnScoutTroop

[pchadbo]

"There is no reason to invent a new course, simply kick the Cub Scouts out of Wood Badge, move their boxes of tissue and "leadership" theory to the University of Scouting, and restore those Beads to the Patrol-based backwoods Scoutcraft competency that Baden-Powell intended them to stand for."

 

Just to make sure the horse is really dead . . why kick those of us in Cub Scouts who want to become better leaders in Scoutcraft AND "leadership theory" so that we will be more familiar with scouting methods and be better able to begin the boys on what has been referred to too many times to count on this board as "the real fun" of Boy scouting?

 

Wouldn't a Cub leader who is laying a foundation be a help to the Troops?

 

Why did this become Cub- vs Boy- Scouts

 

[Eagle92]

P,

 

WELCOME TO THE FORUMS!!!!

 

In reference to WB, once upon a time there were two WB courses, one for Boy Scout leaders that focused on outdoor skills and leadership, and a Cub Scout Trainer WB that focused on how to train CS leaders and ge them pumped. They also breifly had an Explorer Leader WB.

 

Now with a "one size fits all" training approach, folks are concerend that skills specific to one program are not being reviewed like in previous courses. This is both on the adult level, i.e. WB21C, as well as on tee youth level, i.e. NYLT and NAYLE both are available for Venturers under 18, and are now coed, but are covering the same exact material for both Boy Scout and Venturers, when there are differences.

 

Folks aren't knocking on cub scouts and their leaders, rather they are upset that topics that really need more in depth work than IOLS are not covered and/or reviewed at WB like they were in the past.