Troop Committee question

[eisely]

There are some committee actions that are difficult to execute without some kind of voting; specifically approving an annual budget, approving the calendar, and key personnel decisions. While committees should and do normally operate by consensus, I think every person who shows up expects to do more than simply report and accept their next assignment. There is no boy scout procedure for voting, but Robert's Rules of Order will do very nicely when required.

 

I agree that it can be dangerous to impute too much authority to unregistered parents who show up and do nothing else. It is also correct that the SM and SA's are not technically members of the committee. If you exclude them you risk losing them.

[Bob White]

Nowhere did I say the committee member doesn't communicate with others. In fact the Committee Guide says you report monthly to the committee. You can certainly talk to others in the pack as you plan the event. You make it sound like you give the assignment out and never see or talk to the person again.

 

The point is you don't need to vote to see if you will do a pinewood or where or when. Your program volunteers make a plan share it and the committee supports it. This is not brain surgery it does not require micromanaging.

 

Just do the task thats asked of you. Pick cabable people and let them do the job. Keep people informed and have fun.

 

In Cub Scouts the Cubmaster and Committee Chair make a plan based on the input of their committees. Asignments are made to the committee to make it happen.

 

In Boy Scouts the Patrol Leaders Council makes the plan and the commiittee supports it to help make it happen., In Venturing the youth are the committee as well as the participants, with the support of adult advisors.

 

Its called the scouting program, there are over 100 print and video resources available to help you learn it.

 

Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Bob White]

Eisely,

Read the Troop Committee Guide, page 12, Annual Program Planning Conference, and you will discover that "the troop committee may make alternative suggestions for the Patrol Leaders Council to consider" it does not say that the committee votes to accept it. the plan is the boys' plan not the committe's to accept or deny.

 

Key personnel decisions are made by the Charter Organization Executive, The Charter Org. Rep. and the Committee Chair. The committee can make recommendations but they do not have the authority to make the decision. Just read the Adult Application Form.

 

Read the responsibilities of the Treasurer and you will see that he or she pays bills on the recommendation of the Scoutmaster and the authorization of the troop committee. No Roberts Rules are need to do that. It also says the treasurer leads the preparation of the annual budget. Nowhere does it say the committee votes on it. They work on it together, its a concensus by its very nature.

 

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[red feather]

Gotta be careful with an active troop committee. Got one that seems to want to run the troop not support it. Hard for new adults to leave the cub scout mentality of doing for the boys. Getting better but takes work for the old-timers to direct the flow.

 

The idea of the TC of canceling an overnight is not Scouting but over control by a TC. Not right at all.

 

YIS

[ScouterPaul]

Bob

I have to disagree with you on this one. On page 33 of the Troop Committee Guidebook it states the following "The Scoutmaster is not actually a member of the troop committee, and has no vote." If the committee is not a voting body why would this statement be in the Committee Book? I took over a Pack where the Cubmaster and the Committee Chair made all of the decisions without consulting anyone. The Pack went from 40 - 50 Scouts down to 14 when the Cubmaster moved on with his son. Less than a year later we have a a Pack of 75 boys with a committee consisting of 12 registered members. We work by the consensus method but require votes on the hard issues that do come up. I would never dream of letting 2 people (CM and CC) be the only people involved in a $2,000 capital expenditure decision.

 

Thanks

Paul

[Bob White]

Vote on what? Where does it say that the committee operates on a majority rule? What the heck does a pack buy for $2000? Read the rest of 33 and 34 and tell me where it it says the committee votes on ...ANYTHING. It says "reports on assigned tasks" and says "assigns tasks and issues are discussed". Those tasks are assigned by the Committee Chair through cooperation with scoutmaster.

 

I'm not saying things should not get discussed but units gridlock themselves by trying to be something they are not. The role of the committee is to support the program. Take the training you'll have a better understanding.

 

Bob White

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[ScouterPaul]

Let me add this. There is large difference between a Troop and a Pack committee. A Troop Committee should never change a decision of the PLC unless there is a saftey or BSA rules and regs problem. However the capital expenditure issue is the same.

[acco40]

What the heck does a pack buy for $2000? - Have you priced a Pinewood Derby track recently? Should the Pack buy a track, rent a track, make a track, ..? Excellent topic to discuss by the full committee after a report by the committee person who has been assigned the task of organizing the Pinewood Derby. Having an open vote sometimes helps. Tiger parents may see the benefit of applying Pack resources up front now to save money in the future. 2nd Year Webelos parents, whose boys will leave the Pack in February before the Derby, may be hesitant to put out a big outlay now for possible monetary benefit in the future, long after their boys are gone.

 

Although not explicity mentioned, voting is referenced by (the SM does not have a vote) PSA literature. Also, reference to a quorum implies voting.

 

However, you don't want "paralysis by analysis" and have the committee forced to vote on every item that may come up. You do have to empower the various committee members to make decisions on their own.

[ASM7]

After reading through this thread, and just completing TC training, I agree with Bob White, totally. If you read the responsibilities of the troop committee on page 13 of the Troop Committee Guidebook, you will see that the committee is not a legislative body that yeas or nays anything.

 

Page 12 states " The patrol leaders' council, not the adults, is responsible for planning and conducting the troop's activities."

 

How much plainer can it get. The troop committees that do otherwise are overstepping their bounds.

[sctmom]

Den Leader responsibility in the Pack includes:

Take part in the annual pack program planning conference and pack leaders' meetings. (Which I assume is more than just show up.)

 

Reporting on progress of an assignment is not the same as making a pack decision. Our Cubmaster and past Committee Chair ran ideas past the committee and den leaders, mainly out of courtesy and to get a feel if it would work. No one would say "oh, I handle the fundraiser and you all do it THIS way". But on the other hand when someone was crowned Popcorn Kernel, we left him to do his work. If he had questions about decisions then he would run it past other adults.

 

The troop committee meetings I have set in on are not to override what the boys want to do (unless a safety problem), but to make sure adults were assigned to making sure the boy's plans were carried out. You do need an adult to make reservations with a credit card. Decisions were discussed and agreement reached as a consensus. If you just coudn't live with the decision, you better speak up. No formal votes taken, but if someone had a valid objection, the decision was discussed more.

 

If the boys want to go to the same cave every year, then let them. But suggest other places to go caving.

[Bob White]

Sctmom,

I think we are agreeing? The Den Leader responsibility in the Pack includes:

Take part in the annual pack program planning conference and pack leaders' meetings.Those meeting are for making the plan.

 

The pack committee meetings are for supporting the plan. The do not include the den leaders but only the cubmaster as the program leader.

[yaworski]

"Vote on what?"

 

As B-P said about something else, "Why, any old thing."

 

The fact that it is specified that the SM cannot vote means that the others do vote. Why would they vote unless there was a decision to be made? Sorry, "Bob", but the underpinnings have been knocked out of your argument BSA's literature.

 

 

[Bob White]

The only voting mentioned in connection to the committee is as members of a Board of Review, in which the Scoutmaster (since he or she is not a member of the committee) has no vote.

 

Go to training watch the video that has the committee meeting on it. Read the Committee Guide and the Cub Scout Leaders Handbook.

 

Find a reference to voting other than for Boards of Review.

 

Bob White

 

 

[sctmom]

Bob, how does the committee come to a decision when one has to be made?

 

[yaworski]

"Bob, how does the committee come to a decision when one has to be made?"

 

Since voting is not permitted all decisions are unilateral and policy is by fiat.

 

The fundraising "chair" says, "We're going to sell chocolate in July" and that's what will happen.

 

The advancement "chair" says, "We'll only have on BOR each year" and that's what happens.

 

How dare you discuss anything or even consider "voting" on any issues like "do we sell chocolate or greens".